To think I could be harming my baby?

[silicageldonoteat]

Long time lurker, occasional poster, name changed for this.

I have a 5 week old baby. After a traumatic delivery my milk was delayed coming in and we ended up readmitted to hospital with weight loss and had to top up with formula.
Since then, I have been breast feeding every 3 hours and topping up with expressed milk or formula if I haven’t managed to express enough.
My little one has only put on 10g in the past few days and is only just back above birthweight. I was hoping that we would be able to move towards EBF but obviously that’s not on the table at the moment. I’m devastated that breastfeeding isn’t working out for us as I’d hoped.
The feed/top up/express cycle is brutal, but I could carry it on if there were light at the end of the tunnel. As it stands, I don’t think there is. I can’t help thinking that my baby would be better off with a mum that wasn’t totally miserable all the time, particularly when trying to breastfeed, who had some time to spend playing/talking/bonding - and that maybe it’s time to stop and switch to full formula. But on the other hand, surely some breast milk is better than none? I feel like whatever I choose is not doing what’s best for them.

What Hobgoblins described was my experience too. It wasn't til I had my second that I realised that what people described about let down etc wasn't what I felt at all.
Ditching some or all the expressing sounds sensible especially if you get very little. I was told my a very experienced midwife to put a time limit on breastfeeding. 10 to 15 minutes a side then offer the bottle. She said if my supply was low past that he was burning more calories trying to get the milk than he was actually receiving.
In the end he was probably really bottle fed but it was nice to have at least a small amount of breast milk to offer if he had just got out of the bath or just wanted comfort or we were out too long and didn't have formula.
We were both happier once not tied to the house but that's my personality. We like walks and I wore the wheels off the pram (literally). Other people enjoy being in and can take the sitting and feeding for days on end. I respect their decisions and doing what worked for them but my mental health couldn't have stood it.
Giving some formula allowed me to experience the lovely cuddles everyone else got as I'd be actively trying to give him to other people because he was never really satisfied and would only want milk when anywhere near me even if he'd been on the breast for hours. As someone else said, taking a bottle is a useful skill to develop. What if you end up in hospital, it would make the experience so much more traumatic if your baby can't be successfully fed.

She wants to breastfeed.

Would you tell a marathon runner to stop doing marathons and just enjoy watching Netflix?

I drove myself mad trying to BF feed one of mine. She just couldn't get it at all, it was like trying to BF a tasmanian devil, she would thrash around, and I was left bleeding and in tears.
I knew it was her and not me as I BF fed the other DC until they were 2 years, with no problems at all.
Putting her (reluctantly) onto formula was the best thing I ever did, I'd have ended up with PND if I'd persevered.
Your mental health is important OP, it's all very well people telling you to carry on with BF but will they be there to help you if your mental health crashes?

My dd didn't regain her birth weight after a month so we added two formula bottles a day (HV insisted). Sometimes a bit of expressed milk too but I hardly got any when I expressed. We did eventually manage to drop the am bottle. I remember feeling sad about it all but I don't know why! There's nothing wrong with formula. My advice would be to try and embrace the combi feeding.

@daffodilsandprimroses

She wants to breastfeed.

Would you tell a marathon runner to stop doing marathons and just enjoy watching Netflix?

I would if they were repeatedly injuring themselves and in tears over it.

Yes but PerspicaciousGreen not as the first reaction to say a twisted ankle (I mean, you’d say rest it but not give up entirely!)

I’m not trying to be provocative here. But so many times someone posts to say they want to breastfeed and in response are pages saying formula is fine and I don’t think there is anyone who doesn’t know this but when you really want to breastfeed it isn’t helpful.

At the very least with the hypothetical marathon runner you’d acknowledge they’d lost something important to their sense of self and identity.

Bf'd my two, and am still meh about it, so I'd suggest giving yourself a deadline (week or two) and try to switch to pure breast in that time. Cut out the pumping and the top ups if possible and just go cold turkey with the breast. If the supply doesn't kick in with a lot of feeding, I'd just give it up. My first had 3 month colic and those months were hell on earth. Stopped dead on 12 weeks, but the stress and lack of sleep did my milk supply in so at four months we switched to formula.

@silicageldonoteat have you spoken to the national breastfeeding helpline? Or googled breastfeeding support groups in your local area. If they're not meeting up in person I know some of them are meeting virtually. They can reassure you and give you some tips that might help.

My dd would feed anywhere between 9-16 times a day (over 24 hours) when she was a tiny newborn. Some of those feeds would only last 3 minutes and some of them would last 50 minutes. It's all good bonding time. Like others have suggested, put your feet up and enjoy the cuddles whilst watching something. Cake is always good to have to hand too. As long as the nappies are being filled you can be reassured she's feeding well.

What did your dd weigh at birth? The health visitor told me that if babies drop to the lower percentile but maintain that new percentile weight gain that that's normal and fine. That's what happened to my dd.

Expressing can help but please don't think you don't produce enough milk based on what you can pump. My supply has been fine but I can only get a few ounces of expressed milk in the morning. It doesn't mean you can't produce enough. Babies are much more effective at getting milk out than pumps.

I got like this when mine were babies as tried the bf thing and it made me so unhappy, then i stopped and moved to formula and then the guilt got me! MIne were only bf for 5 weeks and are very healthy and rarely ill so all that worry and guilt was for nothing. If you need to change to formula to make you feel happier then do it, your baby will be fine, x

@daffodilsandprimroses

Yes but PerspicaciousGreen not as the first reaction to say a twisted ankle (I mean, you’d say rest it but not give up entirely!)

I’m not trying to be provocative here. But so many times someone posts to say they want to breastfeed and in response are pages saying formula is fine and I don’t think there is anyone who doesn’t know this but when you really want to breastfeed it isn’t helpful.

At the very least with the hypothetical marathon runner you’d acknowledge they’d lost something important to their sense of self and identity.

I know, but the OP's been at it for five weeks - it's not like she's not been trying! I'd be saying something different if it were only two days! And the thread title is "To think I could be harming my baby?" It doesn't sound to be like a mum who's surprised by how hard it is in the first few days and wants some hand-holding over the difficult bit.

I can’t help thinking that my baby would be better off with a mum that wasn’t totally miserable all the time, particularly when trying to breastfeed, who had some time to spend playing/talking/bonding - and that maybe it’s time to stop and switch to full formula. But on the other hand, surely some breast milk is better than none? I feel like whatever I choose is not doing what’s best for them.

Sounds to me like the OP is doing it because she believes she ought to breastfeed as it's good for the baby but it's making her totally miserable all the time. I believe fed baby and happy mum is best.

Look, I think breastfeeding is great. I flogged myself half to death so I could breastfeed both of mine, while included doing the triple feed that OP is doing with my first. Looking back, I wish I'd jacked that shit in sooner and not been so convulsed with guilt at giving him some formula. I believe that combi feeding (breast plus formula, NOT expressing) is not generally offered as an option.

But in my opinion, this thread is really not the twisted ankle. This is a mum who recognises that marathon running is making her miserable but she feels like she ought to keep it up because she's started and what kind of self-respecting mother gives up at the thirteenth mile and wouldn't it be better for everyone else for her to just cry her way to the finish line even if she later has to have her feet amputated?

Oh I didn’t mean anyone should feel bad at giving up if it’s not for them. Sorry, that probably came over wrong.

It’s hard to explain. I think when I was in this position people were lovely in telling me ‘oh use formula, it’s fine, no one will know or care, happy mum / happy baby’ - but I was so sad.

My hand was forced but I ... wanted it to be acknowledged. Does that make sense?

It does make sense. I had a very different experience, where everyone was encouraging me that basically I could do it if I just tried hard enough. I think all the "support" for breastfeeding was sort of detrimental for my mental health because no one ever questioned whether I should be doing it or not.

I think we are both on the same page, that we want our sadness over not doing it and our effort to have tried to be validated, but what I really could have done with was someone giving my baby a bottle and putting me to bed. I needed the physical problem of baby not eating and me being strung out on no sleep to be fixed first before I could start to actually think about my feelings about it. My feelings at the time made no sense and were basically "tired + guilty + scared".

I agree with you daffodils.

There is an awful lot of projection going on here from people who wanted to breastfeed but couldn't so just think that everyone else should just give up because that worked for them.

I also had a lot of obstacles and terrible advice and I'm very pleased I persevered and didn't listen to people who said it wasn't going to work.

Right now I'm listening to the OP and its clear she wants to breastfeed.

Please don't let breastfeeding ruin this time for you. Give him/her some formula, keep offering the breast too if you want to, and just enjoy your baby.

Can I suggest urgently getting some help from a breastfeeding counsellor or independent lactation consultant? Midwives and health visitors have very little training in breastfeeding, shockingly little. The NCT Feeding Helpline is open every day and is manned only by trained breastfeeding counsellors.

0300 330 0700

NCT supports all parents, however they feed their baby. If you have questions, concerns or need support, you can speak to a breastfeeding counsellor by calling the helpline on 0300 330 0700, whether you are exclusively breastfeeding or using formula milk.

Would you tell a marathon runner to stop doing marathons and just enjoy watching Netflix?

But in the case of the marathon, there is only one person involved; the marathon runner. In OPs case there’s is another person; the baby. OP cannot just put her wants above her wants above the baby’s need. A very basic need of getting enough to eat.

@CecilyP

Would you tell a marathon runner to stop doing marathons and just enjoy watching Netflix?

But in the case of the marathon, there is only one person involved; the marathon runner. In OPs case there’s is another person; the baby. OP cannot just put her wants above her wants above the baby’s need. A very basic need of getting enough to eat.

I object very strongly to the implication here that the OP is being selfish.

Sorry, I don’t think OP is being selfish at all. She is actually going above and beyond in trying to follow the advice she has been given. She is trying 3 different ways of feeding, getting little rest but, sadly, her baby still isn’t gaining weight. My previous post was more to do with the marathon analogy not really working in this case. In addition, daffodils has posted a little more detail about her experience and sadness and I do sympathise.

@CecilyP

Would you tell a marathon runner to stop doing marathons and just enjoy watching Netflix?

But in the case of the marathon, there is only one person involved; the marathon runner. In OPs case there’s is another person; the baby. OP cannot just put her wants above her wants above the baby’s need. A very basic need of getting enough to eat.

Wow, @CecilyP. That’s pretty harsh. I think I was quite clear that I am topping baby up every 3 hours - this is a ‘full feed’ amount of breastmilk or formula. My query was more about whether I should call it a fat trying to breastfeed. I AM feeding my child.

Sorry OP, I didn’t mean it to come across that way. Rereading it now I see it does sound really harsh. You are doing you’re absolute best. It was more my clumsy way of saying the marathon analogy doesn't really work.

Thank you for apologising. And for trying to help, honestly.

I have a very similar story to yours. My milk didn't come in and readmitted for weight loss. Stayed in hospital and fed then pumped then fed then pumped. When I came home if I wasn't feeding my baby I was constantly pumping. It truly was a miserable few weeks. I started to give formula and felt terrible but it slowly moved to fully FF. I felt guilty for a while but then I felt relief that I wasn't stuck to my pump all day everyday, desperate to get 'just 1 more oz', I was obsessed with it and his weight. 2 years later and now I know it was the right decision, even if it did make me feel like a failure 💐

Do you have a local breastfeeding group? Mine is wonderful and much more helpful than the hospital to be honest. I couldn’t breastfeed and there wasn’t any support groups in the first lockdown. I’ve ended up exclusively pumping and it’s tough going but l think if I’d found the breastfeeding group earlier I wouldn’t have needed to.

Sorry if I've missed this OP - who has told you to top up? Did they come up with a plan for how to increase breastfeeding so you don't need to keep doing so long term? (Unless you choose to move away from it of course)

@KatieKat88 we had to top up when we were readmitted with weight loss. There was no onward plan for transitioning off them until I got in touch with the infant feeding team, who gave a plan for gradual reductions. Unfortunately when we started that the weight gain has been sub par so I don’t feel we can safely reduce any further at the moment, but I also can’t go on triple feeding indefinitely.

I tried reducing expressing today by not pumping if there appeared to have been a good feed but then when I did express I got almost twice as much as usual, so I’m worried that my supply will drop if I don’t carry on pumping after each feed