AIBU For not wanting people to let there dogs jump up me or my children?

[ILoveMyMonkey]

Why do people let their dogs jump up into children’s faces and then use the excuse “but it’s only a puppy” as though that justifies it!
Prime example today, nice country walk with Dh and DS8 minding our own business. Stop to look at the view and this dog comes trotting over. Immediately heads for DS who does not like dogs at all. He stands still and the bloody thing leaps up him inches from his face. I stick my leg between him and the dog so it’s now leaning on my leg and move my leg away from DS to kind of use my leg to lever it away - did not kick or injure it at all. Owner comes over after a few mins and moves dog away with her. Then mutters under her breath about me kicking the dog. I told her I didn’t kick the dog and it shouldn’t have jumped up at DS to which she trots out the age old line of “it’s only a puppy!” So put it on a lead until you can control it then.

Why don’t these people ever just say sorry my dog jumped up at your kids face! Rather than blaming you for simple being there!!!!

Grrrr rant over.

Our pup is 19 weeks old. Always on a lead, not allowed to jump up. If people want to come over and fuss him,that's fine, he loves it! He's a Staffy so obviously he's very vicious with his licks and leaves lots of slobber behind!
I also don't like strange dogs jumping up at me,even though we have a dog.
And if they have no recall, then they shouldn't be off a lead no matter what breed they are!

@LolaSmiles how incredibly selfish you are.

I’m scared of dogs. Why should I not be able to go to the beach or the park because irresponsible owners haven’t trained their dogs and let them off their leads. It’s only getting worse and I think the government should legislate to designate specific dog walking parks. I have my life significantly ruined by people who don’t consider no I don’t want your dog running up at me.

Jangle33
I've repeatedly said that I don't, and will never, defend irresponsible dog ownership.
Once again, off lead does not equal out of control.

I'm not sure what point you're even trying to make Lola. Just pages of #NotAllDogs while being extremely insulting about other people's trauma and telling victims to stay home.

ContentsMayBeHot
After already agreeing that dogs shouldn't jump up at people, I made a flippant comment about the inevitability of some people speaking in hyperbole, on threads like this which other posters recognised, and people repeatedly confusing off lead and out of control dogs.
Then was met with claims that this is putting dogs before humans and 'but why should we have to be jumped at'.

Even though:

• I've not said dogs come first
• I've explicitly said dogs shouldn't jump several times
• I've also said I'm in favour of dog free areas
• I've also had a fear of dogs and would freeze up around them

The bottom line is that people are allowed to have their dogs off lead & being in a public place means other other people might be doing things we don't like. If someone is genuinely saying that they can't be around any off lead dog without having some of the reactions claimed on here, even one that is not close, minding their own business with their owner then you'd think that the person would choose not to go to busy areas that are popular for off lead exercise.

I have two small dogs, one adores children and won’t hesitate to trot over for a stroke, therefore, if I see children (even in a pram) if he’s off lead he goes straight back on. But it would be nice if people actually asked if their children can stroke my dogs, it’s very rare to be asked and if I’m not prepared they very friendly one will jump up and could potentially knock a child over.

The same with other dog owners, I won’t let my dogs rush over and harrass other dog walkers, but not everyone else is considerate I get tired and having to try to dodge around while some random dog is jumping up at me and bothering my DDogs.

It just takes some consideration that’s all, unfortunately it seems to be in short supply

YANBU. I would have kicked the dog. I’m not letting a dog I don’t know get anywhere near my baby.

But @LolaSmiles the issue is that the entire area now seems to be popular for ‘off lead exercise’. Once upon a time I would have agreed with what you are saying about frequenting places that are known dog exercise places. There are a few places in the parkland that I don’t go to for this reason. Every single incident we have had in the past year has been when we are minding our own business walking along one of the busy access paths, only to be harassed by a gambolling dog whose owner is inept and nowhere to be seen. One such incident was on the approach path to the only fenced off dog free area on the whole 300+ acre site. So please stop victim blaming.

The issue is clearly a minority of dog owners who think that as long as they are not actually on a main road then their asbopooch can have free rein, does not need to have good recall, and has equal right to the space as humans.

If my children were running around tripping other people up, pushing them over, shouting boo at innocent old ladies, and refusing to come back when I called them, then I would probably put them on a lead too! (In reality I just make sure that they are courteous and polite to other path users and hold their hands if that appears to be challenging for whatever reason)

Why doesn’t everyone just get a cat? 🤷‍♀️

Springchickpea
I'm not victim blaming. If a dog is out of control then responsibility lies firmly with the dog owner.

If a dog is off lead and minding their own business then their owner doesn't have to stop doing that just because some people don't like off lead dogs. If someone is genuinely so troubled by off lead dogs that they need to post regularly about regularly shaking/quaking with fear and deciding that anyone with an off lead dog is irresponsible, they have to accept that that's their issue and adjust their outings accordingly, or find a way to make peace with the fact that people are allowed to have their dogs off lead.

I totally agree with you regarding the minority of dog owners who are hugely irresponsible and allow their mutts to do as they please though. They are a problem for non dog owners, families and fellow dog owners alike.

@LolaSmiles

Springchickpea I'm not victim blaming. If a dog is out of control then responsibility lies firmly with the dog owner.

If a dog is off lead and minding their own business then their owner doesn't have to stop doing that just because some people don't like off lead dogs. If someone is genuinely so troubled by off lead dogs that they need to post regularly about regularly shaking/quaking with fear and deciding that anyone with an off lead dog is irresponsible, they have to accept that that's their issue and adjust their outings accordingly, or find a way to make peace with the fact that people are allowed to have their dogs off lead.

I totally agree with you regarding the minority of dog owners who are hugely irresponsible and allow their mutts to do as they please though. They are a problem for non dog owners, families and fellow dog owners alike.

Spot on. And, as you say, those irresponsible owners are in the minority, I walk my dogs every day, twice a day, in a v dog centric area, the majority of dog owners are polite and courteous. As usual, MN is full of dog hating hysteria that just doesn’t exist in the real world.

I HAAAATE off-lead dogs (well, their owners, tbh...) everyone’s right about the entitlement. What the hell happened to the days when people didn’t need to take their dogs everywhere they went? I have an anxious, giant-breed dog. She can’t be walked off-lead. If I am out in the daytime with her, she wears a bright yellow coat that states “Do Not Approach” and has a picture of a dog and a hand in a circle with a line through it. It’s pretty clear. Doesn’t stop people coming up with their little kids asking if they can “Pat the big doggy - it doesn’t matter - My kid’s not afraid of dogs.” Never mind the fact that my big doggy is afraid of little kids! She is also afraid of all dogs (she was attacked by two pitbulls, so this is why she’s anxious.) Guaranteed, we’ll be accosted by some fluffy “oodle” that is nowhere near their dog, stopping the ball of fluff from bouncing in the face of mine, (who also has a harness around her nose so she doesn’t pull me over) and trying to calm mine down- (she has no idea how big she is and thinks she’s going to be attacked again starts getting worked up.) The owner eventually gets there and breezily says “Don’t worry, he doesn’t bite!!!” I have to say something along the lines of, “If you don’t take yours away, mine might, and it will be entirely your own fault!”

On-lead doesn't necessarily mean under control either — I've had a dog reach out and nip my hand completely unprovoked as I walked past minding my own business, and another one snap at my leg, grazing me with its teeth through my trousers, simply because the owner and I were passing each other on the pavement. Owners didn't give a fuck, of course. Presumably I should be leaping into the road to surrender the pavement to the Almighty Dog every time I see someone with one coming the other way, just in case it fancies attacking me.

Neither caused major harm to me, though I had to bin the jeans with the teeth-holes, but I can't help thinking if I'd been a small child I could've been left with a lasting fear.

SnoopyOnALude
I honestly think that the vast majority of people accept that lots of people use public spaces and will use them for a range of purposes, and that we all need to get a grip and accept this.

Some places allow ball games, some places don't, most people follow this, some people don't. Some places allow off lead exercise, some places stipulate on lead only, most people follow the rules, some people don't. That's life.

The problem is there's a minority of people who misuse public spaces, and a minority of people who think public spaces should only be used in a way that they deem acceptable. Both are unreasonable.

Trying to decide that public spaces should only be used according to your preferences is similar to people who think they get to moan about the neighbours doing entirely reasonable tasks during the day. Most people understand there is a huge difference between antisocial noise levels and normal life, but some people think their neighbours should run their lives around their preference for a lie in and the fact they want to read a book in their garden in peace. That's how we get regular threads about why children shouldn't play in their garden until 11am, people moaning that the neighbour mowed their lawn and was landscaping their garden etc regularly discussed as if it was horrifying antisocial behaviour that needs reporting to the council.

FrankensteinIsTheMonster
The few nips and scratches I've had/my dogs had, have been from either smaller off lead dogs, whose owners seem to think small means they don't need training, or smaller dogs at the end of retractable leads.

I think that's why the on lead/off lead argument is unhelpful, especially when people seem to confuse the presence or absence of a lead with being under control or out of control.

Lola these would've been dogs on short leads, walking more or less at heel down suburban pavements, and yes, both fairly small ones IIRC. It's about training and control, not just the type of lead. It's as though people think that because their dog isn't physically capable of actually ripping someone's neck open, it doesn't matter that it's nippy/jumps up/whatever. Very irritating.

FrankensteinIsTheMonster
You're totally right. It's about training and control, not the lead/lack of lead/type of lead.
Equally, owner behaviours make a difference to the way the dog responds. Some owners would benefit from working with a dog behaviourist to see how their actions affect their dog's behaviour, or develop strategies to make walking their dogs nicer for all involved.

Too often IMO the discussion seems to fixate on "I don't like off lead dogs therefore nobody should walk dogs off lead and anyone who says otherwise is saying I should tolerate being jumped at/insert emotive claims here".

I'm yet to have seen a dog thread where lots of dog owners have said it's fine for dogs to be out of control and jump on people, but plenty where people get very emotive about the vast majority of dog owners being irresponsible/defending off lead exercise is telling people to accept being jumped at etc.

I guess the difficulty is that it's impossible to know whether the off-lead dog you can see 20m away is under someone's control or not. If it's on a lead, you can (usually) choose to stay out of reach of the dog whether it's under the owner's control or not, but with an off-lead dog, you're left with having to trust the owner.

I'm interested to know where these places are that you can take children where there are no dogs.

The local play areas (you know, for children)? No, numerous dogs off the lead. The local wood with fairy doors, rock trails? No, swarming with dogs with no recall off the lead.

It is also very strange that people are blaming the child or parents of the child for the phobia, when the catalyst will have been an incident with a dog.

If you are an irresponsible dog owner, dog phobias are caused by you.

Dogs are not a natural hazard though? Why should I be prepared that I might encounter a dog? It's only going to be there because of a string of (poor) decisions made by another person. Private land is the only appropriate place for someone's pet to be wandering at will. Dogs are a danger to people, wildlife, themselves near roads. If these owners were really "dog people" they wouldn't be putting the dog at risk. How long til someone does kick the unsupervised dog jumping up at them?

you'd think that the person would choose not to go to busy areas that are popular for off lead exercise

the problem is an area doesn't have to be popular for off lead exercise. Dogs are everywhere. When cafes and shops reopen they'll be in those, too. People even want to take them to work with them. And then they project human emotion onto them and say it's unfair for them to be on leads. It's unfair for them to be pets!

I love dogs. I don't have one because it wouldn't be fair on the animal to have one in my current circumstances. I have always told my daughter since she was small to ask the owner first if its OK to pet a dog, in case they don't like kids and/or strangers. I grew up with a dog that hated all humans except the ones she lived with, so I know the risks. But if a dog jumps up at my daughter and any risk is dismissed by the owner I get annoyed. Yes the dog might be harmless to his family but they do have a defensive streak so any outside humans might still be fair game, especially if it thinks their human might need guarding. They are pack animals, after all. If the dog jumps up then it puts the question to the owner of "is it ok to stroke your dog?" out of the window because dog is already in her face being disobedient and potentially dangerous. My daughter is 14 now, and has a greater understanding of risk but why should she assume all loose dogs are safe, when they potentially are not?

Whatisupwithme
Not an irresponsible owner here. Just a responsible owner who used to be scared of dogs, but didn't expect everyone else to cater to the fact I didn't like dogs.

It's a public place and it's fine to exercise dogs off lead unless the place says not to (and I'm in favour of more places having restrictions btw, especially smaller parks, and more enforcement in those areas). I just get fed up with people thinking their dislike of off lead dogs equals deciding that those who exercise their dogs off lead are somehow out of order, or that people should stop exercising their dogs within the law to appease those who don't like the sight of one in the same field as them.

puffinkoala
I don't like dogs in shops and cafes, but if those businesses have decided that allowing dogs in helps their business plan then they can crack on. They've decided on their market and I won't be going to have coffee there, mainly because if I go for coffee and I'm dog free, but also in my experience the more pampered the pooch, the worse it behaves.

@Tlollj

Why doesn’t everyone just get a cat? 🤷‍♀️

We have a cat who also hates most humans but she hides under my bed to avoid visitors.

My cat has done far more damage to me than my very large dog!

Also he stares at me as if he's trying to work out how I will taste when I die...dogs don't do that