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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Destroying the Planet? I'm sure AIBU and I don't care

224 replies

Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 14:05

Inspired by another thread.

Live as a couple. Have no children and one 6 year old car. Have a 4 bed house which we love. Modest holidays (pre-covid would go abroad twice a year). We try not to be wasteful and recycle.

But please stop telling me we are destroying the planet! Just because we eat red meat and like nice clothes. I'm fed up of people coming out with the "go vegetarian / go vegan" lines. Just go away.

I think not having children trumps most people who are eco-warriors (with children) so on a comparison basis I think we would score quite well re our environmental credentials.

Apart from that, I'm not really bothered by environmental issues as there is naff all I can do to influence the behaviours of other people and especially big powerful conglomerates and governments. We quietly do our "bit" when we're happy to do so as long as it doesn't inconvenience us. I also accept that the Earth has changed a lot in its very long history and inevitably will keep on changing. If the ultimate result is that it changes to become completely hostile for supporting human life, well, so be it. But hey that's probably thousands and thousands of years off and mumsnet will be a dim and distant memory by then.

OP posts:
Parky04 · 01/04/2021 16:09

Must admit, I don't give a rats arse about the environment. I drive a petrol car, I eat meat, fly around 6 times a year. I have a gas boiler. Life is tough, so I'm going to enjoy myself as much as I can, and as cheaply as I can. When mother nature has decided that she has had enough of us, then fair play to her.

Original poster
Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 16:10

@PattyPan

Obviously Yabu. What is the point of this thread? Do you just want people to say don’t worry OP, it’s fine eat steak for every meal and set fire to a heap of coal in your garden because BP won’t reduce their emissions? Grow up.
No PattyPan I'm not seeking validation for my lifestyle choices. I'm perfectly happy with who I am and what I do, thank you.

I just want to put my own views out there in response to far too much hand-wringing about environmental issues, and preaching from the converted (often people who have children but are now committed vegans, cyclists etc and make sure you know about it).

OP posts:
Original poster
Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 16:12

@Parky04

Must admit, I don't give a rats arse about the environment. I drive a petrol car, I eat meat, fly around 6 times a year. I have a gas boiler. Life is tough, so I'm going to enjoy myself as much as I can, and as cheaply as I can. When mother nature has decided that she has had enough of us, then fair play to her.
Thank goodness for Parky! I applaud your honesty and couldn't agree more that if mother nature decides to give us the boot, tough.
OP posts:
mushforbrain · 01/04/2021 16:14

YABU if you think recycling should count towards green credentials. It’s just putting stuff in a separate bin FFS it literally doesn’t involve any extra effort. Is this how lazy people are that they think recycling is actually some kind of sacrifice that they make in their life? Consumers drive production so yes of course your choices matter, it’s such a cop out to blame ‘big powerful conglomerates’, what a crap attitude. So you are ‘not bothered by environmental issues’ well good for you, some people are. Why should they ‘go away’? But you are right when you say you can’t influence the behaviours of other people - you do realise you are one of these people - nothing anyone says will make you change your ways.

Ace56 · 01/04/2021 16:15

You do come across as a bit of a selfish arsehole, OP. However, good for you for saying what I’m sure many people are thinking.

mushforbrain · 01/04/2021 16:16

1 billion animals died in last years wildfires in Australia - but you think there is ‘far too much handwringing about the environment’ Yeah, ok then.

PattyPan · 01/04/2021 16:20

@Parky04

Must admit, I don't give a rats arse about the environment. I drive a petrol car, I eat meat, fly around 6 times a year. I have a gas boiler. Life is tough, so I'm going to enjoy myself as much as I can, and as cheaply as I can. When mother nature has decided that she has had enough of us, then fair play to her.
Mother Nature has been trying to give us the boot for the last year if you hadn’t noticed 🤔
Keepithidden · 01/04/2021 16:22

"Mother Nature has been trying to give us the boot for the last year if you hadn’t noticed 🤔 "

Nah, Covid is just a warning shot. One that most of the polluters won't care about because, you know, poor people, disabled, elderly... ... collateral damage.

HugeAckmansWife · 01/04/2021 16:26

What does worry me more is the rise in anxiety and depression that seems be afflicting almost every other poster on mn and I can't help wondering whether this constant background rumble of doom, gloom and guilt isn't helping. A lovely couple I know, who are in a stable marriage, kids at uni, employed in secure jobs are both suffering A&D, as are their adult kids and every facebook post is about either the environment or trans rights or another uber-woke issue. I think at least part of the answer to all this hand wringing angst is to accept that the environmental damage is global, on an industrial scale and individuals spending hours sourcing a cleaning product or non pvc freezer bags or whatever is going to do naff all and working out their carbon footprint likewise.

2021youpromisedyoudbebetter · 01/04/2021 16:32

I always think this whole issue is too big to be like everyone needs to do one specific things ie be vegan, it just needs more people doing things better to make a different. You dont need 100 people doing it perfectly you need 1000 doing something to reduce their carbon footprint. I think you're not being unreasonable to say you dont want to stop eating meat but you would be unreasonable to say you wouldnt give it a go to reduce it for example so if you had meat 5 days a week to reduce to 3 or 4. Every step in the right direction is a good thing. I work in the environmental sector, have a child and eat meat but I do try and reduce and change my lifestyle where I can. Completely agree with everything @notalwaysalondoner said. Green shaming just makes people switch off as who wants to be lectured and told they're doing it all wrong when they're trying to change habits that take a long time to unpick

MereDintofPandiculation · 01/04/2021 16:36

@Parky04

Must admit, I don't give a rats arse about the environment. I drive a petrol car, I eat meat, fly around 6 times a year. I have a gas boiler. Life is tough, so I'm going to enjoy myself as much as I can, and as cheaply as I can. When mother nature has decided that she has had enough of us, then fair play to her.
I hope you're middle-aged or above. Because the effects of climate change and of degradation of the environment are increasing, and I don't think it will be that long before they are starting to make life unpleasant - more pandemics, increased pressure from migrants from parts of the world that have become uninhabitable, resistance to antibiotics, extreme weather events etc
Llyn · 01/04/2021 16:43

But hey that's probably thousands and thousands of years off and mumsnet will be a dim and distant memory by then.

You have misunderstood. This is happening now.

Karmakarmachameleon · 01/04/2021 16:45

It might not affect you but it will definitely affect your children/their children.

Yeah, but the OP doesn’t have any children so it doesn’t matter to her.

Original poster
Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 16:51

@Ace56

You do come across as a bit of a selfish arsehole, OP. However, good for you for saying what I’m sure many people are thinking.
Thanks Ace, I'm sure there are some people out there thinking similarly to me. Yes I probably am a bit of a selfish arsehole but I know I also have a lot of good qualities too.
OP posts:
WeAreAllCompletelyFine · 01/04/2021 16:55

I am less bothered about me - I've had 36 pretty great years of life on a beautiful planet so far - but my children and the beloved children of others deserve more than people just saying fuck it, what it will be will be.

That said I don't know what to do about it. I do the normal stuff, recycling, glass milk bottles, reusing clothes etc but I don't know how to go about making the huge-scale changes that are required?

BeforetheFlood · 01/04/2021 17:00

Hmmm. So I'd heard of climate change deniers, but I don't think I've previously come across anyone who acknowledges the environmental catastrophe that's unfolding and simply says 'meh - don't care.'

That seems quite... an unintelligent response, if I may say so.

AcornAutumn · 01/04/2021 17:00

@HugeAckmansWife

What does worry me more is the rise in anxiety and depression that seems be afflicting almost every other poster on mn and I can't help wondering whether this constant background rumble of doom, gloom and guilt isn't helping. A lovely couple I know, who are in a stable marriage, kids at uni, employed in secure jobs are both suffering A&D, as are their adult kids and every facebook post is about either the environment or trans rights or another uber-woke issue. I think at least part of the answer to all this hand wringing angst is to accept that the environmental damage is global, on an industrial scale and individuals spending hours sourcing a cleaning product or non pvc freezer bags or whatever is going to do naff all and working out their carbon footprint likewise.
I know what you mean

You mention Facebook so I wonder if they are the type to shout about green stuff while owning several gadgets and buying new ones every time they fancy it?

SueSaid · 01/04/2021 17:00

'I'm not really bothered by environmental issues as there is naff all I can do to'

But if everyone thought like this nothing would ever change.

Our one electric car and air heat pump rather than gas won't save the world but if everyone did what they could it really could make a difference. I like using a water butt to water the garden, makes me feel worthy Grin

Tell you what annoys me all that mess in public areas after 2 days of sunshine. If people at least took their rubbish home and used recycling it would be a start. What is it with the youngsters, they go on about climate change but can't seem to dispose of their own rubbish.

Stinkywizzleteets · 01/04/2021 17:01

The rapid adoption of green products and pushing recycling and recyclables diverts attention away from the true polluters, corporations and capitalism and blames consumers who have very little option or variety.

Even if everyone was recycling everything and cutting out red meat etc, it still wouldn’t stop the problem of global capitalism which produces all the environmentally unfriendly products and the practices involved in producing them.

But clever marketing blames us the consumer.

Original poster
Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 17:02

@Karmakarmachameleon

It might not affect you but it will definitely affect your children/their children.

Yeah, but the OP doesn’t have any children so it doesn’t matter to her.

But I do have nieces, nephews, a godson etc. I love them all deeply. But even then we all have to take our chances given to us at the time we live on this planet. So past generations have had to survive wars, famines, plagues and no one is guaranteed freedom from disastrous times. That is why I find it so sad when lovely young people, with so much going for them, state they won't have children " for the sake of the planet".

At the moment in the UK we have it pretty good; we've not been at war for a generation, we have bountiful food and resources, and even a vaccine to mitigate Covid. I think it's a good a time as any to have a child.

OP posts:
Buccanarab · 01/04/2021 17:05

We quietly do our "bit" when we're happy to do so as long as it doesn't inconvenience us.

Do you apply this thinking to all aspects of life or just the environment? I.e. Are you happy for your dad/husband/brother/colleagues to just pay lip service to equality as long as it doesn't inconvenience them or do you expect them to make an effort to support it?

If the latter your a massive hypocrite, if the former fair play carry on.

Must admit, I don't give a rats arse about the environment. I drive a petrol car, I eat meat, fly around 6 times a year. I have a gas boiler. Life is tough, so I'm going to enjoy myself as much as I can, and as cheaply as I can. When mother nature has decided that she has had enough of us, then fair play to her

There's 2 things that really, really bug me about that type of attitudes

  1. You just know these are the same people who will screech and wail the loudest when the effects of climate change start to bite here and they can't carry on as normal.

  2. The "I'm alright so fuck everyone else" sense of entitlement. The effects of climate change are already being seen through an increase in intensity and frequency of extreme weather events and these are most acutely being felt in third. People like the OP and Parky are essentially saying they're more than happy for those in the third world to be even more disadvantaged, and possibly die, than to hang out their washing on a line or walk to the shops.

Original poster
Ivebeeninlockdowntoolong · 01/04/2021 17:05

@JaniieJones

'I'm not really bothered by environmental issues as there is naff all I can do to'

But if everyone thought like this nothing would ever change.

Our one electric car and air heat pump rather than gas won't save the world but if everyone did what they could it really could make a difference. I like using a water butt to water the garden, makes me feel worthy Grin

Tell you what annoys me all that mess in public areas after 2 days of sunshine. If people at least took their rubbish home and used recycling it would be a start. What is it with the youngsters, they go on about climate change but can't seem to dispose of their own rubbish.

Yes, rubbish! I couldn't agree more - why don't people take it home or dispose of it properly? What mentality have they got that it doesn't occur to them how unpleasant discarded rubbish is for everyone else (but will happily bang on about climate change).
OP posts:
QueenPaw · 01/04/2021 17:08

I'm not giving up meat
I don't have children, don't fly, and my energy is with a green energy company. Also recycle and use reusable sanitary products
I'll carry on eating chicken/sausages thanks Grin

MehWithBellsOn · 01/04/2021 17:11

@Ace56

You do come across as a bit of a selfish arsehole, OP. However, good for you for saying what I’m sure many people are thinking.
Exactly.

So OP, the point of this thread is to broadcast to strangers that given the choice you prefer to take the selfish route and you don't give a shit.

OK, whoop-de-doo, good for you. What are you looking for, a medal?

HugeAckmansWife · 01/04/2021 17:12

acorn no they are very sincere and genuine. Hence (in my opinion) being very adversely affected by worry about it. I have enough concerns very close to home that I really don't feel taking on the weight of the world would be helpful. There's an interesting bit in a tv show (I won't say which) which points out its virtually impossible to live an environmentally harmless life, even when you really really try just because of the way global industry works. Short of going completely off grid or Tom and Barbara Goode style, most aspects of our lives will, somewhere along the way, be causing harm.