Report that says Institutional Racism doesn't exist and more ...

[Dustyboots]

Is no one else angry about this?

I can't find any other threads about it.

What is going on?

And the bit that says the “slave period”, was not just about “profit and suffering” and argues that the era was also about how “culturally African people transformed themselves into a re-modelled African/Britain”.

Are people unaware of this? Or do we just no longer care ...

@Watermelon1234 Yes I agree I feel the same. Likewise it would be wrong to blame the current German people for the actions of their predecessors during the war. We do not expect them to apologise and that is more recent.

This is a false comparison and it's not about blame. We have a collective responsibility as a country to reckon with the ongoing effects of our past and how it continues to influence mentalities and inequalities. Germany has been actively going through a process of Vergangenheitsbewältigung , which translates as 'confronting the past', since the second world war. There has been a concerted effort in schools, religious institutions, a famous literary movement, philosophical movement, memorials etc. all dedicated to working through the horrors of National Socialism.

The problem is that the same thing has not happened in the UK and the population have not been taught the damage done by the British Empire globally, and its knock-on effect on systemic racism in the UK. The UK curriculum does not work like this, and we have only very recently been elevating authors like Akala and Reni Eddo-Lodge who write openly on the legacies of colonialism and racism.

In Berlin there is a museum on the site where the SS HQ was. It details in an absolutely upfront way the atrocities that were committed.

The Jewish museum covers the atrocities and also goes into Jewish religion and culture and displays more current art installations.

I have never been to a country that has something appalling in its history, that is so upfront and straightforward about what they did. No excuses are made.

I think this is a poor comparison. See -slavery was an opportunity to change.

There are many more museums and memorials about it as well.

The past is the past - its history , Britain's colonial past contains some dreadful acts, but that is history, the actions were by people and authorities who are no longer around. We don't live in the past, the past is of the time and the world was a different place, we need as a country to move forward and discussing what happened 150 years ago whilst having its place does not help. History is schools I agree needs to cover all history and the UKs part - but just as we judge now some of those actions to be appalling each generation will put thier own slant on the action, so the 1960/70s will be judged differently by further generations.

@twelly But the past isn't some obscure place completely unconnected to our present day. There is such a thing as a legacy of colonialism that continues to have an impact on colonised countries, on their peoples, and on the descendants of their peoples currently living in the UK after it quite rightly imposed itself on their ancestors' land. Part of that legacy are the ways in which racism affects people of colour day in, day out in our country.

This is a good article that demonstrates how the racism of today is grounded in the colonial past:
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jun/03/racism-george-floyd-britain-america-uk-black-people

But windrush scandal was recent!

I keep saying this but apart from one poster upthread no one is interested.

When people say forget about the past, they really mean 'forget all the bad things Britain did in the past'

They don't mean forget about Shakespeare and the Tudors and the Blitz spirit and all the positive things they like about history, that makes Brits feel good about themselves. They want to glorify Churchill and all the great stuff he did and erase all the horrific things he's responsible for.

You can't have it both ways, if history doesn't matter then none of the good stuff matters either.

One of Britain's colonies gained independence in 1980. The people affected are still very much alive. Those who supported and upheld those structures are still very much alive. This is not ancient history

I think a pp made a really really good point, in that Germany has museums and schools teach their kids about the atrocities.

I think it would make a difference if British schools were to teach about the negative impact of the empire and not just the version that sounds ‘nice’.

Having said that, I do think we have come a long way and are a much more civilised society, but there is room for improvement.

The gap between the rich and the poor as usual in increasing, so something needs to be done to get people (of all ethnicities) out i of poverty, because the class divide is increasing.

I think it would make a difference if British schools were to teach about the negative impact of the empire and not just the version that sounds ‘nice'.

The only version that sounds nice, sounds nice to white supremacists

@Benelovencd

I think it would make a difference if British schools were to teach about the negative impact of the empire and not just the version that sounds ‘nice'.

The only version that sounds nice, sounds nice to white supremacists

Oh right....

There are people who were tortured in concentration camps in Kenya in the 1950s who are still alive, they are trying to sue the British government.

I guess they should just shut up eh, it's all in the past

The problem is that the same thing has not happened in the UK and the population have not been taught the damage done by the British Empire globally, and its knock-on effect on systemic racism in the UK

Slavery, colonialism, empire, US civil rights, fight for thr emancipation of slaves, eg Wilberforce, has been taught in UK schools for at least 50 years

@Benelovencd

I think it would make a difference if British schools were to teach about the negative impact of the empire and not just the version that sounds ‘nice'.

The only version that sounds nice, sounds nice to white supremacists

The point is - it’s like telling a story but missing out all the bad bits. 11 year olds don’t ask if it’s factually correct, they are just told a story and take it for what it is.

@NiceGerbil

But windrush scandal was recent!

I keep saying this but apart from one poster upthread no one is interested.

The reaction to that scandal by an overwhelming majority of the public was one of horror and anger at the Home Office for it happening. Is that the reaction you would expect of a hideously racist population?

A story where there appears to be no upset...

The British government waged a campaign of terror, systematic genocides and theft complete with concentration camps, starvation in some cases etc, and Black and Brown people are expected to extoll the virtues of the Empire.

But we can all recognise how universally unacceptable it would be to tell Jewish people to look on the bright side of the Holocaust, because they built lovely roads and had really clever scientists.

I don't think anyone yells that story missing the bad bits or indeed including the good bits and asking people to focus on the good, why is the same honest conversation not expected of the Empire. Xountries got their independence as recently as 1980, this is not some ancient issue.

@Flaxmeadow but it is taught from a very specific point of view, namely with the US depicted as the enslaver, and Britain's involvement is often framed as that of the great emancipator. The actions of British colonists, the lives of people living in colonies and former colonies is not usually covered.

It's also important to note that civil rights and slavery are often only covered from KS4 onwards, and not everyone opts for history GCSE. The way teachers are trained and the way university degrees work also often mean that teachers are more comfortable teaching certain topics like WW2, the Tudors, etc. Schools all do it differently but there's definitely a pattern in which the actual details of Britain's colonial atrocities are rarely, if ever, taught.

Here's an article by a lecturer in colonial history with more detail:
theconversation.com/british-empire-is-still-being-whitewashed-by-the-school-curriculum-historian-on-why-this-must-change-105250

but it is taught from a very specific point of view, namely with the US depicted as the enslaver, and Britain's involvement is often framed as that of the great emancipator. The actions of British colonists, the lives of people living in colonies and former colonies is not usually covered.

But it isn't and it wasn't in the 1970s

There seems to be this idea now that a history teacher in the 1970s was some kind of stuffy old Enoch Powell type character banging on about the glory days of empire . Nothing could have been further from the truth in most schools

My school teachers in the 1970s were a mixture of old socialists, some who had fought in WW2 and even in WW1, trade union strike sympathisers, and hippies

The difference back then was that history was taught very much from a class perspective. Which was better IMO

Largely agree with the report bet the usual suspects don't agree though. Better to keep bashing poor white kids for their privilege.

@Benelovencd

The British government waged a campaign of terror, systematic genocides and theft complete with concentration camps, starvation in some cases etc, and Black and Brown people are expected to extoll the virtues of the Empire.

But we can all recognise how universally unacceptable it would be to tell Jewish people to look on the bright side of the Holocaust, because they built lovely roads and had really clever scientists.

I don't think anyone yells that story missing the bad bits or indeed including the good bits and asking people to focus on the good, why is the same honest conversation not expected of the Empire. Xountries got their independence as recently as 1980, this is not some ancient issue.

Is this a general post or is aimed at me?.....

The Windrush scandal was perceived with indifference by many otherwise it wouldn’t have happened in the first place.
Who are these people who are supposedly bashing poor white kids?

@Livelovebehappy

The past is done. Nothing anyone can do about what’s happened. We can now only control the here and now, learn from the past and apply those learnings to the future. How many times can people apologise for a past that belongs to people long gone. The U.K. is so different now and bears no resemblance to how it used to be. I’m sick of being held accountable for the actions of past generations just because I’m white.

That is just it. No one has been held accountable.

In 2015, the UK taxpayers were finally paying off the government debt borrowed to pay millions in 'compensation' to wealthy slave owners.
A lot of people had no idea modern Brits were paying off money the British Treasury gave to people made rich through human suffering.
The government pledged, in 1833, £20 million in order to reimburse the owners of slaves when slavery was abolished in Britain, and it took the British taxpayer 182 years to pay off (Brice, 2018).

So, the past is still very much present in all is heinous forms.

Now, tell me, how much did the British Empire pay the enslaved? I'll wait for your post on that number, because that amount is still outstanding to date.

Apologies - words of little affect unless accompanied by a tangible resources - will not erase the legacy of deep rooted prejudice and hate etched from an era of debasing enslaved people held captive; worked from cradle to grave to create wealth for the colonisers, whose purses bulged from the lucrative Plantation a place where enslaved men, woman and children were forced into laborious, unrelenting, soul-breaking tasks, while being brutalised: chained, systematically raped for further profit and sustainability, bought, sold, whipped, butchered, lynched, mutilated, tortured, branded like cattle and dehumanised, as they toiling these large farms in forced colonies, harvesting cotton, rice, sugar and tobacco for trade and export.

You say it's in the past, I say it's entrenched in the polices and laws we live by today - policing hairstyles at school under the guise of 'uniform policy', high proportion of people of colour being subjected to stop and search, high prison numbers, high mortality rates of black women during child birth, high exclusion rates in school, lack of senior positions in top companies, a higher proportion of prosecutions in the Black and mixed ethnic groups against children, 13% and 14% respectively, compared to 5% for white defendants...

The legacy of prejudice and bias still linger today and that's why it's important to still address it.

A lot of people had no idea modern Brits were paying off money the British Treasury gave to people made rich through human suffering.
The government pledged, in 1833, £20 million in order to reimburse the owners of slaves when slavery was abolished in Britain, and it took the British taxpayer 182 years to pay off (Brice, 2018).

So, the past is still very much present in all is heinous forms.

That's one perspective. Another might be that the Govt at the time, who remember desperately wanted to end slavery in the BWI and as quickly as possible, had no othe choice but to compensate slave owners if they wanted to end slavery

The fight to end slavery had been a popular cause for at least 50 years by then but hampered by legal issues. If the only way to end it was by paying off the slave owners then, as they saw it at the time, so be it. Otherwise the issue could have dragged on even longer

Great post Kamr123
The gaslighting by some is disgusting.

Still some black children are outperforming white working class boys ( a group that have many difficulties of their own ) so nothing to see here...