To be a true feminism, I need to address my own misandry?

[FerrisWheelTrain]

For example - are terms like LTB sexist?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@Pumperthepumper read the article!! And it’s written by a woman![/quote]
I did, here’s a quote from it you’ll find really interesting:

He also points out that false allegations are exceptionally rare. “In my three decades as an employment lawyer, I only had one case where allegations were patently false and made up in an attempt to extort money. Most of the time people who report harassment are reluctant to do so and the vast majority are never reported.”

And you want us to stop believing women in case men’s feelings get hurt?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@ArcheryAnnie ok - I get you! Only women are permitted to have views about gender issues Duh me![/quote]
No, men are permitted to have views, too, about anything they like. And I am permitted to point out when they are wrong about something.

@Pumperthepumper equally - are all men guilty until proven innocent? Is that how it should be?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@Pumperthepumper equally - are all men guilty until proven innocent? Is that how it should be?[/quote]
Which men? The ones who’s side we don’t get whose partners come on here to talk about how abusive they are? Is it those men you’re worried about?

@Pumperthepumper - I’m asking if you agree with that statement. All men are guilty until proven innocent.

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@Pumperthepumper - I’m asking if you agree with that statement. All men are guilty until proven innocent.[/quote]
But that doesn’t make sense - which men? Guilty of what?

Ferris
People post when they have a problem. Most people don’t post about their lovely male partners because they don’t need another opinion.
The threads where LTB is used are those threads where an individual has posted genuine concerning details. Perhaps they are lying perhaps they are not. However, people react to the information they have about that one specific male. This is not a court, it is simply a bunch of people expressing an opinion about a specific individual’s behaviour in a unique set of circumstances.

Why are you so keen to extrapolate generalisations from individual specific situations.

genuinely concerning

Ferris you don't seem to understand the definition of the word misandry (despite PPs already explaining).

You say you don't hate men but misandry is literally 'hatred of men'. So for you to address your misandry you imply that you do hate men.

You can see why people are confused.

If you changed your question to "to be a true feminist I need to address my own preconceptions of male gender stereotypes?" I think the discussion would have been more coherent.

Is that more like what you meant?

@Batteredoldchesterfield I believe I have implicit bias e.g whether it’s against a white van driver. Or a few years ago - I was in room with a group of women who were suggesting to a sole young male student that he dress as a ‘butler in the buff’ for someone’s birthday. He just looked to the ground - and I didn’t speak up. As examples.

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@BadNomad - so is ‘ditch the bitch’ acceptable on dadsnet? I acknowledge that the origin of the term bastard is gender neutral. But it’s slang dictionary definition states that it applies to typically a male who is selfish or arrogant. I would therefore argue that it’s a gender derogatory term and not appropriate?[/quote]
I don't give a shiny shit about what they say on Dadsnet. What has that got to do with misandry?

@ChazsBrilliantAttitude yes I get that and it’s vital for exactly that reason. But how much gender bias goes on which could potentially be counter productive? Should we address that? Is it fair? Should we be mindful of it? And what’s your opinion on : all men are guilty until proven innocent? Is it ok to have that mindset when responding to posters on mumsnet?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@ChazsBrilliantAttitude yes I get that and it’s vital for exactly that reason. But how much gender bias goes on which could potentially be counter productive? Should we address that? Is it fair? Should we be mindful of it? And what’s your opinion on : all men are guilty until proven innocent? Is it ok to have that mindset when responding to posters on mumsnet?[/quote]
Oh god, how many times? What does that mean? Which men? Guilty of what?

@FerrisWheelTrain
Like most of your arguments on this thread, you have cherry-picked your dictionary definition of bastard.

Here’s the definition from dictionary.com
noun
a person born of unmarried parents; an illegitimate child.
Slang.
a. a vicious, despicable, or thoroughly disliked person:
b. a person, especially a man:
c. something irregular, inferior, spurious, or unusual.

LTB is using the ‘a’ slang definition not the ‘b’ - which is fairly obvious in context. We don’t just randomly advise MNers to leave ‘people’ but we do advise MNers to leave ‘vicious and despicable people’.

If you have a problem with (mainly) female posters advising other (mainly) female posters to leave partners who are vicious and despicable, I suggest you have a problem with women. Maybe focus on that issue.

Ferris
You are the only one putting forward the proposition that all men are guilty.

To echo my fellow poster
Which men? and Guilty of what?

@SorryAuntLydia you’ve missed b) says person especially a man

When someone posts on here about their terrible relationship we're not here to question how truthful they're being or what the other side's story is. How innocent or guilty the man is is not relevant. This is an advice and support site. Not a judge, jury and execution service.

@ChazsBrilliantAttitude @Pumperthepumper
I just want your opinion on that statement. Is it all men, some men are guilty until proven innocent - or the partners of posters on mumsnet are guilty until proven innocent - or should it read all men are innocent until proven guilty? Or - my personal belief ALL people are innocent until proven guilty.

I'll bite.
OP. The purpose of feminism is to highlight and rail against the disadvantages and limits placed on women.

Feminists don't need to work on Misandry because 90% of societies around the world, including this one, are already falling over themselves to point out that men are overall the better sex. So in a largely misogynist world focussing on the minority misandry is just diverting from the main feminist issue: the disadvantages for the female sex class.

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]**@ChazsBrilliantAttitude* @Pumperthepumper*
I just want your opinion on that statement. Is it all men, some men are guilty until proven innocent - or the partners of posters on mumsnet are guilty until proven innocent - or should it read all men are innocent until proven guilty? Or - my personal belief ALL people are innocent until proven guilty.[/quote]
f. none of the above

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@Batteredoldchesterfield I believe I have implicit bias e.g whether it’s against a white van driver. Or a few years ago - I was in room with a group of women who were suggesting to a sole young male student that he dress as a ‘butler in the buff’ for someone’s birthday. He just looked to the ground - and I didn’t speak up. As examples.[/quote]
Ok so not hate then. Implicit bias.

You didn't hate white van man.

So using the term misandry is why people have got confused with what you're trying to argue.

To your point about all men being guilty (of ANYTHING it seems) no, and that's not even what you see on MN.

Often someone asks for advice on a slightly suspicious situation. Very often the OP is told they're possibly over reacting. But with abuse cases very often there is a chorus of LTB because we trust what the OP is telling us. It might be tosh but this isn't a law court. If it is tosh posters saying LTB aren't doing any harm if it's all made up anyway.

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@SorryAuntLydia you’ve missed b) says person especially a man [/quote]
Yes that’s why I pointed it out...

In case you are struggling with comprehension, I will repeat my point. The word Bastard has several definitions. One of which is as above . This is not the definition we are using when we say LTB. We are using the definition that means vicious, despicable person. We are also not using LTB as shorthand to advise women to abandon their children born out of wedlock.

@BadNomad - so when giving that advice, should we assume the man is guilty/in the wrong/a bastard?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]**@ChazsBrilliantAttitude* @Pumperthepumper*
I just want your opinion on that statement. Is it all men, some men are guilty until proven innocent - or the partners of posters on mumsnet are guilty until proven innocent - or should it read all men are innocent until proven guilty? Or - my personal belief ALL people are innocent until proven guilty.[/quote]
It still doesn’t make sense, guilty of what?

Why is this such a difficult thing for you to answer?

@SorryAuntLydia I’ll have a big sigh too!! I think you are struggling with comprehension? That definition states that it applies especially to a man.