To lie to get a contextual offer for DS?

[midnightorchid]

Name changed.

DS (17) is having talks from school about applying for university and I have also been looking into the contextual offers. DS wants to apply for a very competitive course, for which the interviews count for a lot. We are a FSM family as I am a carer for ds2, but live in a naice area as I rent a property from a close friend for half the market rental value. From what I have read due to our postcode DS will not get a contextual flag. Ex DH however lives in an area with the worst POLAR score and this would get a flag.

DS will not perform well at the interview, he narrowly missed the ASD criteria when assessed but he very much presents with ASD traits. He is very literal, doesn't expand answers etc and the questions he is likely to be asked in the interview require detailed, thinking outside the box answers.

WIBU to put DS's address on the UCAS as his df's address? If it wasn't for my friend renting me her house then I would nearly 100% be living in a qualifying postcode. This will not qualify him for a contextual offer (as his course does not offer contextual grades) but according to the university sites they will take into consideration lack of preparation/appropriate responses in the interview. DS could even move in with his DF for a period of time so that technically this is true.

Obviously this is lying (although if he moved in it wouldn't be) so I feel very conflicted, but I'm quite sure without this that DS will do well in the interview, no matter how well he is prepped. I have no doubt he can get the required grades and wouldn't even consider this if it wasn't for his difficulties.

Do you think you are trying to ease your conscious or trying to get from people their thoughts on how this lie might trip you up and therefore what you need to do to avoid being caught?

You can't hide this stuff. Surely he would notice when they usually say AAA but suddenly say BBB for him

The course is so competitive that there is no contextual grade change. They will use the contextual data to assess those who perhaps didn't do as well at the interview only.

@zzizzer

You can't hide this stuff. Surely he would notice when they usually say AAA but suddenly say BBB for him.

It specifically states a contextual offer on UCAS and you have to put them first to get the contextual. So you get a normal offer, then below that the contextual offer.

Some unis make offers because they want you specifically, ie Birmingham was offering CCC for some top courses.

Don't do it - what would happen with funding etc., and when he has to put his non-term time address down for University registration? This impacts voting, benefits, and, some university-offered funding.

A huge percentage of students on science course have ASD diagnoses, particularly at the "better" (if you believe University Wankings) Universities. The interviewing teams will be aware this is a possibility for all their students.

Just ensure he preps for the interview and knows the style - it's quite often not a formal sit-down interview that the decision is based on.

I wouldn’t hesitate to be honest. I think most parents would use whatever resources they have to gain advantages for their dc.

@HollowTalk no his school do not do interview preparation unlike the grammar beside it as they do not have the staff expertise apparently. The careers department until now has been pretty useless. DS is considered a very high achiever in the school, he is well above the typical student in terms of academic grades.

Your DS completes his own university application so he would have to agree to lie on the ucas form - so no you can’t hide this from him.
He has to confirm that all the information on the form is true.

I do appreciate that there are already unfairnesses in the system, OP - wealthier families coaching their kids, etc - but your actions wouldn't reduce those unfairnesses, they would add to them. You wouldn't simply be cancelling out the advantages of the wealthier -- you would be skewing your son's chances in relation to other non-wealthy kids, many of whose parents won't have been as motivated/competant/etc as you have already been by obtaining an ASD assessment.
An unfair system is made more unfair by the differential ability of a minority of parents to research it and optimise all its quirks and loopholes.

Plus, you have already had it confirmed that your son is not ASD, and therefore isn't entitled to any artificial boost to compensate for any lack of interview skills. There will be loads of unassessed ASD kids who will be struggling at interview.

The course is so competitive that there is no contextual grade change

Seems like a lot of effort then, if he wouldn't even get a lower offer. But, if you really feel like he'd do so badly at interview that it could risk him getting an offer then I don't think it's a particularly wrong thing to do.

Could you afford a couple of sessions of interview prep coaching instead? Might be less hassle overall than having him move out, risk your UC etc.

I think you should find a way to tell uni about the asd traits. In my non-expert opinion, but as a parent of a young man with autism, I think autistic traits can essentially mean autism, as I don't feel that neurotypical people tend to have those presentations and rigid thinking just as a trait, it come from the whole mental wiring. I think there is more reluctance to make a full diagnosis, lately. But he is certainly, from what you say, greatly impacted by his difficulties, in routine situations. He's not able to advocate for himself well.

I wouldn't lie. People with ASD can be very truthful and self-directed. He probably will tell his friends the truth, as it makes for an interesting ironic anecdote and take on parent/ child dynamics.

Unless you are moving everything from child benefit to contact details at school for when they ask for references, registration etc to his dads address and confident he would be able to lie convincingly in an interview situation if asked something related to where he lives, I wouldn't.

So much is joined up nowadays, the uni's must know this could happen so will/should check for it and the consequences of being caught out, being flagged to UCAS and ruining his chances for any courses are too high.

Go for it!

I am posting from the viewpoint of an autistic woman who worked in student services in HE for over ten years.

Your son issues are:
He's autistic although undiagnosed
His communication needs are in the minority
Due to a lack of inclusive practice he's likely to face a selection process that hasn't been designed with his needs in mind
He does not know how to navigate f2f interviews

Changing his address will not help with any of those things. If your son was my child in the first instance we'd be getting in touch with disability services at uni, getting an appointment with a disability advisor, discussing what reasonable adjustments are normally put in place for these interviews and then going from there.

Did you know some uni's will pay for the student to have an assessment if they suspect they are autistic? I worked at one uni who provided this support. At one point they did have a really poor assessor who diagnosed autistic individuals as having socialanxiety, so they were replaced and all of the students were reassessed and received the right diagnosis. The reason I'm highlighting this is some assessors are really poor at their job, therefore, if your son needs this pieceof paper to have his needs met I'd pursuea second assessment. Uni briefs can be hard to decode and he may need a 1:1 academic skills tutor funded through the DSA to be able to thrive in HE.

In relation to interviews, I often find those with the predominantneurotype(PNTs) are rubbish at adapting their communication style to meet the needs of those with a neurominority, hence, communicating effectively with these individualsrequires extra effort from myself. As such, I have the following reasonableadjustment for f2f interviews, which could be put in place for your son:

Questions 30 minutes in advance to give me time to decode ambiguous languageetc and to give me the processing time I need

Rather than act fraudulently I think you should use this opportunity to empower you son to think about what support he actually needs and support him with navigating negotiating this

I probably would do it yes.

But it’s a bit unethical, if not downright fraudulent.

I don’t know how things are working with schools/uni and contextual offers, but instead of lying about your address couldn’t you ask the school to write to the uni and say they suspect he has ASD?

@OnTheBenchOfDoom it’s really not possible to say as it varies institution to institution and even cycle to cycle. At my HEI POLAR is probably used more at the moment. But tbh even that depends on the admissions cycle and how under or over target we are. This year we expect there to be under recruitment (not true everywhere obviously) so we’ll probably drop offers considerably anyway.
But if it were my child I’d probably go with using the other address.

You don't necessarily need a diagnosis to qualify for adjustments during the application process. I would suggest you organise a post 16 Needs Assessment in readiness for applying for DSA which would open the door to learning support at uni and potentially exam access arrangements, such as using a separate room, for A levels and beyond.

I think you will find that FSM will flag him anyway. I suggest you speak to the admissions team at the uni on an anonymous basis and ask them. Fraudulent entries on a UCAS application can lead to offers being withdrawn.

I'd do it in a heartbeat. You should too. You should get him to move in with his Dad for a few months though just in case.

I don't think you will feel right about it. Play the hand you were given. I think the contextual offers are going to prove a minefield for just this reason. Inequality is hard to address.

Don't lie to get an advantage
I was in the exact same position. No way we're we doing to lie to get an advantage. It is just purely cheating and getting what you want out if lie is no glory.

Instead your DS should be encouraged to give his actual best, and if he doesn't get in this year, learn from it, and use next year to mature and do better.

My DS was shocked when a couple on his class admitted to doing the same. They are both struggling on the course and considering dropping out.

OP will end up doing this, definitely.

I would do nearly anything to help my kids succeed in life.

I watched this last night on Netflix "Operation Varsity Blues" about the pure bribery for university places one "coach" organised and which destroyed the lives of the teenagers who had no idea what their parents had arranged, the parents who were conned by the fraudster into going it and should have known better and the fraudster himself who ratted them all out to get a lower sentence - he is still not in jail.

Best to be careful even with this kind of thing.

Surely he will get a contextual offer because he is a young carer anyway?

Thank you all for the replies, they have been very insightful. No, I definitely wouldn't feel good about lying and I would be constantly worrying that it would catch up with us and penalize DS. I also realize that I would be adding to further disadvantage, which obviously makes me feel bad.

Thanks a lot to the poster who gave lots of info on admissions as a person with autism. I will look into all of that. Interesting that someone said FSM should be a flag, I haven't seen that in any of the universities contextual data info, but I could always phone and ask anyway.