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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Upset about letter from neighbour, and angry at myself for telling DD

372 replies

SheikahSlate · 18/03/2021 12:03

This is my first post, so I hope I am posting in the right place. I guess I'm asking AIBU for being this upset. I'll try to be as succinct as possible. Sorry if it's a bit long.

Quick bit of context. My DD (now 6) and I moved into this semi-detached house in November (rented). The house is 'attached' to another building which has been converted into 6 small apartments (also rentals, but with a different landlord). DD has only recently been back in school (I'm not a key worker - I'm studying for a Masters and start teacher training in September), so we've been in A LOT, homeschooling, following guidelines, etc etc.

Back in November, a few days after we had moved in, my mum came round for a cup of tea (I'm a single parent, and I'm in a bubble with my parents). We were talking in the sitting room. There was a knock on the door and a young woman, probably early twenties, was stood there looking a bit perplexed. She asked, 'do you live here? I thought this was an office'. This slightly perplexed me, because it’s clearly a house, but I was pleased to meet a neighbour so quickly and said that my daughter and I had just moved in, and briefly introduced myself and enquired in turn about her. She's from London, but studying for a medical degree at the University here. She then said she had heard talking, so loud that it 'was like it was just right outside my window'. 'Great', I thought...'thin walls'. However, my mum and I don't talk particularly loudly - and were just chatting in a very normal way. I felt like the young woman was waiting for me to apologise or offer to reduce the noise, but I just felt that I shouldn't. I'm generally a very accommodating person (sometimes too accommodating, I think) but felt that I shouldn't offer not to talk, at a normal level, in my own sitting room. It turns out she lives basically in one room, and works at her computer on the other side of the wall. I did, however, feel sympathy that she could hear noise, and that this was disturbing her. I know that the previous tenant here was a divorced man who wasn't home at a lot - and without children - so she was probably used to blissful silence.

Anyway, I have never seen her since. I've already established a really good relationship with the people in the house next to us (another semi-detached), but see little of the people in the flats to the other side. Yesterday morning, however, as I was leaving the house to take DD to school, I saw a letter had been posted. It was four pages of A4 and I quickly scanned it as I was in a rush, but my heart sank when I realised it was from the young woman, apparently at her wit's end, about the noise coming from our house. The letter included one which she had composed just after Christmas, and one she had written that morning. She said she had resisted sending the one at Christmas at first, but that she's now really struggling.

Apparently she hears lots of shouting and thudding, which stops her going to sleep (she said she goes to bed very early some days - between 6 and 7pm after working at her placement) , and that the noise also impacts on her ability to concentrate on her studies. I have obviously obsessed and obsessed about what she could be referring to. Occasionally, but not that frequently, my DD decides to launch herself from the sofa, or climb to the top of the door frame and drop down, so that could explain the thuds. As far as 'shouting' goes, often I do shout upstairs - 'Are you OK?' - if she's playing in her bedroom. Or I call her from the kitchen, ‘Dinner’s ready!’. Admittedly, I will often have shouted either of these things at around 6-7pm, shortly before DD’s bedtime (but sadly DURING the bed time of the woman next door). I've started to become extremely paranoid about the level of noise we produce, but I just can't really, rationally believe it's anything beyond a normal level for a family of our (small) size.

I DO have sympathy. She's on her own, in a different city, studying for what must be an incredibly difficult degree, and under a huge amount of pressure. None of this is helped by COVID and the accompanying restrictions. I've struggled massively myself and definitely empathise. But I also feel slightly aggrieved that she didn't just come and speak to me sooner (and more directly, unlike that first time when she came round), rather than send me this really rather long essay about how desperate the situation has been for her, and basically lying it all at my door.

I've asked if we can speak face to face (she gave me her number in her letter), and we're going to speak tomorrow. I feel like my approach should be that, 'while I feel sympathy, we are a small family just doing normal things and behaving in a very normal way. I don't know what more I can do?’ Is this reasonable? It's so difficult...

What I'm most upset about, and angry at myself about, is that I STUPIDLY mentioned it my daughter. I am an absolute idiot. In the car I was in a bit of shock after receiving the letter, and feeling awful and weird, and gently told my daughter that we might need to be careful to keep the noise down otherwise we might upset the neighbours. She knew I had a letter in my hand, and put two and two together. Again, STUPIDLY, on my part, she overheard me mentioning it to a close friend near the school gates.

Sorry for all this rambling. But to finish - DD is a sensitive thing, and on our previous street, where we lived since she was born, we were surrounded by a huge array of really lovely neighbours. She's always associated 'neighbours' with friendly, almost family-like people. This has shaken her a bit and she keeps asking about our neighbour, and saying she feels 'bad and sad' about the letter. She even started whispering yesterday evening when we were in the sitting room, fearful that she might be being too noisy. I regret letting her know about this so, so, so much - it was an utterly stupid and irresponsible thing to do. So I guess I also would love any advice on how to repair the damage done here.

Sorry again for the rambling. Well done, and thanks, if you made it to the end.

OP posts:
thecatandthevicar · 18/03/2021 12:38

climb to the top of the door frame and drop down
often I do shout upstairs - 'Are you OK?' - if she's playing in her bedroom. Or I call her from the kitchen, ‘Dinner’s ready!

you do sound a bit of a pain frankly.

Loopyloututu2 · 18/03/2021 12:40

Your neighbour sounds strange and neurotic. Are there possibly mh issues involved? Wh9 the hell goes to bed at 6-7pm? Sorry, that’s not your problem!

I wouldn’t have said anything to your dd, she’s a little kid - she doesn’t need to know or worry about this.
I wouldn’t even meet with her tbh. I’d just say “look, there are just two of us making minimal noise. I’m sorry if we disturb you it’s not our intention but you cannot expect us to tiptoe around in our own house. You will have to look into soundproofing.” Be polite but do not comment to anything. I’m afraid you may need to get a bit of backbone OP.

Loopyloututu2 · 18/03/2021 12:40

**commit to

Megan2018 · 18/03/2021 12:40

A 4 page letter is not a normal response. She’s going to be a massive PITA.

I would keep interactions friendly but brief. You are making normal household noise. If she can hear it, it’s tough.
We are slightly attached to next door (our house is sideways to theirs and shares part of a wall), we can hear their microwave beeps if we are quiet and when they shut their back door our pan rack rattles. We hear their dog sometimes and I’m sure they hear DD. It’s marginally annoying but that’s all.

But thudding off the door frames is a bit much, perhaps discourage that.

NeedaLittleNap · 18/03/2021 12:41

I do think you're catastrophising over telling your DD. She doesn't have much sense of proportion yet, and she will learn from how you handle it and whether this counts as a big or small problem.

Think for yourself how big a problem this really is on a scale of 1 to 10 where 10 is massive, like your closest loved one dying. Whatever level you assign it, make a real effort not to present it to your daughter as any level bigger than that. I don't mean don't talk about it, or just ignore it, I mean model taking it in your stride, not dwelling and not fretting. Make it a GOOD thing for your DD's worrying that you have this opportunity to model keeping it in perspective.

Loopyloututu2 · 18/03/2021 12:41

climb to the top of the door frame and drop down
often I do shout upstairs - 'Are you OK?' - if she's playing in her bedroom. Or I call her from the kitchen, ‘Dinner’s ready!

you do sound a bit of a pain frankly.

Don’t be so bloody ridiculous.

TimeForTeaAndG · 18/03/2021 12:41

If she is studying then she needs to get headphones or something. There is no guarantee that all the noise is from you and your DD.

I hope you don't agree to anything daft like no noise after 6pm or anything, her bedtime is her decision and 7pm is super early by anyone's standards.

If DD mentions anything again just give her a big smile, tell her it's all sorted and not to worry. She is 6, don't weigh her down with adult worries.

Notaroadrunner · 18/03/2021 12:42

@Bunnyteam

If I was you I would send the other lady a nice note or give her a small box of chocolate saying thank you for bearing with us, sorry if we are noisy. When you talk just say that you ll try to be considerate but can’t be quiet because that’s normal family noise.
No way should you do this. Why on earth would op apologise and give chocolates for simply being normal in her home? Apologising is admitting that op has done something wrong, which she hasn't. The other woman's over sensitive hearing is not ops problem to solve.
Sansaplans · 18/03/2021 12:43

Unfortunately in this situation it's just tough shit for her. It doesn't sound like you are making excessive noise, and there's not much you can do about it really. If she finds the place she rents isn't suitable (because it's just one room etc) then that isn't your issue to be honest.

PlumKetchup · 18/03/2021 12:43

You don't sound unreasonable at all. She is perhaps overly sensitive to noise but that isn't your fault. If she's really going to bed at 6pm she can't expect the rest of the world (or you) to tiptoe around her, she needs some earplugs. When my son was little, he used to play a similar game to your daughter - he called it Spiderman (it started because he had some Spiderman pyjamas) and he would pretend to shoot webs at us, climb up the living room doorframe and generally leap about. The noise you are making is just everyday living and she should not be expecting you to keep quiet on her account - she needs to find ways to cope with it. How will she manage if one day she lives next to a genuinely noisy/anti-social family?

BuggerBognor · 18/03/2021 12:43

This reply has been withdrawn

Message from MNHQ: This post has been withdrawn

AryaStarkWolf · 18/03/2021 12:46

Your NDN is being very unreasonable expecting to live in a flat and for people around her to stop living normally to accommodate her unusual hours and exceptions of quiet. She needs to get noise cancelling head phones for working if she's that sensitive to normal sounds

StellaDendrite · 18/03/2021 12:47

I think you are massively overthinking this. Try to be mindful of any noise you make but there is no need to be OTT about it. The woman next door probably is being disturbed. It doesn’t mean she is overly sensitive or unreasonable - it might just be that the walls are thin and a neighbour shouting up the stairs and a kid jumping about is annoying.
She isn’t wrong and you aren’t wrong. She hasn’t been rude and you haven’t done anything unreasonable.
If she is on place,ent she may well be doing nights and could easily be going to bed at 6 or 7.

She has mentioned shouting so that would be easy for you to stop. You daughter is six and needs to play but I might remind to be considerate if she was being extra noisy.
I think doing nothing to try and reduce noise would be mean even though I don’t think you sound like you are making noise that’s out of what most people would consider normal.
The only unreasonable one here is the builders who haven’t sound proofed the house properly.

Cowbells · 18/03/2021 12:48

YANBU. The walls are too thin, clearly. In our old terraced house, the neighbours sometimes accidentally switched our TV channel with their remote Grin.

You could move the sofa away from the shared wall, and you could try and be in the same room as each other rather than shouting upstairs. But she can't expect a child never to make a noise.

Cupoftchaiagain · 18/03/2021 12:49

Our neighbour complained that our (crawling) baby was crawling too loudly.

Windinmyhair · 18/03/2021 12:49

this is a normal level of family noise & your daughter playing is not unusual.

Whilst her shift pattern makes it difficult for her, It doesn't make sense that the other flats are making no noise whatsoever, and you are making all the noise that is annoying her.

I suggest that you say that you are sorry that she is upset, but you genuinely don't think that you are making anything other than normal family noise.

I would assume that her medical placements are very stressful and impacting on her ability to manage other stressors in her life. And/or the noise coming from the flats the other side is really unbearable. Maybe suggest noise cancelling headphones or ear plugs in a gentle way to her.

thecatsthecats · 18/03/2021 12:50

She sounds like she's winding herself up about it, and I do sympathise, because as soon as something is in your head as irritating, then it's harder not to be irritated by it, even at normal levels.

I'd do a few things a little differently but not excessively. You are massively over thinking your daughter's response to this, and it's rubbing off on her. It's a GOOD thing that she's learned to modify her behaviour to avoid upsetting someone - you just need to adjust her response. She doesn't need to whisper, but she could keep an eye on the clock and come down at a set time when dinner's ready (maybe get her to help you plate up?).

And then for your neighbour, you can be polite and firm. You'll make a couple of small changes thst you hope will improve things for her, but maybe she could consider shifting her bedtime routine slightly or using a white noise machine, as 7pm is too early to expect complete silence.

Blackbirdblue30 · 18/03/2021 12:51

I live in a building with bad noise transference between floors. You don't sound inconsiderate at all. Suggest white noise to her; an extractor fan or something similar can block talking sounds although not the vibration of thumping or banging.

VinylCafe · 18/03/2021 12:51

@Bunnyteam

If I was you I would send the other lady a nice note or give her a small box of chocolate saying thank you for bearing with us, sorry if we are noisy. When you talk just say that you ll try to be considerate but can’t be quiet because that’s normal family noise.

Do NOT apologize or give her a gift. You and your daughter are not at fault for producing a bit of normal noise.

As for the pp saying you're a pain - they are very wrong too. I lived in a flat with paper thin walls and, after the batshit crazy and incredibly noisy neighbours we had, I would have welcomed you living next door to us.

Tell ndn you are making normal noise (while it's wonderful your daughter is so active, maybe she can leave her gymnastics until she's at your parents house) and if ndn is so bothered, she should ask her landlord to soundproof the wall in her room and/or buy herself some good noise canceling earphones and ear plugs.

badacorn · 18/03/2021 12:52

Neighbour is being OTT. She needs to use earplugs like the rest of us. How would she cope living in halls??

Comefromaway · 18/03/2021 12:53

She sounds a little like my dd. Writing a 4 page letter is definitely something dd would do!

Dd is autistic and hyper sensitive to noise. Dh has bought her some special ear plugs and they help her immensely. She lives in halls and quiet time is 11pm - 10am. It's not reasonable to expect other not to make normal, family noise.

MrsAudreyShapiro · 18/03/2021 12:53

YANBU it's just normal household noise. Listen to her sympathetically, but don't agree to changing your behaviour or moving your furniture around. If the walls are that thin, you are not going to be able to solve her problem anyway.

Movinghouseatlast · 18/03/2021 12:53

Are the walls incredibly thin?

I bought a semi detached house once and on day one the neighbour came round complaining that he could hear every word we spoke. It turned out that the walls between were just hardboard.

He used to play really really loud music to 'punish' us which really was unbearable. He moved out in the end as he couldn't bear hearing just normal conversation.

Interestingly, it didn't work the other way. We couldn't hear conversation or normal volume tv but he could. The next neighbour we had confirmed this.

You can do nothing about this as you rent. The wall thickness is the landlords responsibility.

I would talk to her about it and maybe offer to go into her house to listen to what she can hear- could you get your mum to be in your house at the time while you listen? If you can get her to understand that it is a lack of soundproofing that is the issue then it may help her.

Newmumtobeee · 18/03/2021 12:54

Honestly it’s just part of life. Your next door neighbour is being unreasonable. I live in a terraced house and I can hear my neighbours all the time running up the stairs, down the stairs, slamming doors etc and it’s always after 8pm but I just deal with it because it is what it is & soon enough I’ll have a newborn who’s going to annoy them back. It’s not your fault she sleeps so early and you shouldn’t be penalised for living. Hopefully you sort it out but the letters to me are weird, she should’ve just knocked and spoken to you like a normal person

EmbarrassingMama · 18/03/2021 12:54

It sounds like the building work converting the house next door into six flats was done very poorly if she can hear your conversations?

You're not doing anything wrong and there's little else you can do to change the amount of noise you're making. She sounds very oversensitive.