Is there any woman who hasn’t experienced male harrassment

[Twintub]

I was thinking about this and was initially thinking things have massively improved since I was young in the 80’s. I experienced flashers, a teacher tried to kiss me in high school he was married baby on the way, a pub boss whose girlfriend worked with him tried to kiss and grope me and another middle aged boss in my late 20s that pulled my trousers down at a night away for work. There were many more. Now I’m in my 40s I thought I don’t get bothered much but then I remembered 2 other pre covid instances. One late night train a drunk guy tried to chat to friend she politely said she wasn't interested and he got Aggressive calling her a speccy lesbian. Another instance my friend and I in a pub and a middle aged drunk man obviously on a business trip chatted up my friend she wasn’t interested I very nicely said we are just having a chat he turned on me and called me an ugly bitch He wasn’t talk h to me and I wasn’t a patch on her etc etc his work mates dragged him away.

What amazes me is men behave like this bit raise daughters who in turn get treated like this.

SweetPetrichor
II don’t do anything to provoke unwanted attention though and I think that makes a big difference.

Oh I hope that was just clumsily worded I don’t do anything to warrant unwanted attention either sitting in a bar or going home in the train minding my own business and still been harassed by drunk middle aged men who probably have daughters and a wife at home. Not ALL men are like this of course but we men and woman are often complicit in allowing it to go on as boys will be boys or they were drunk etc etc

@SweetPetrichor

I’m 31 and I have never been harassed, cat called, touched, groped or anything untoward. I work in a male dominated environment as well which ups the stakes. Maybe I’m just ugly...or maybe it’s not as much of an issue as people think. I don’t do anything to provoke unwanted attention though and I think that makes a big difference.

Nope. I used to deliberately dress down, and would still get shouted at. Men would ask about the colour of my pubes from about the age of 12 (I'm a red-head). I certainly wasn't trying to "provoke unwanted attention" when I was 12. I had a man waiting for me every morning when I was walking to school. I kept trying to avoid him, but he was always there. One morning he tried to kiss me. I told the school, who told the police, who concluded that he was probably just a man "with a crush". So, I was taught pretty early on that that kind of behaviour was acceptable for men - if they had a crush. And if I felt scared, awkward, confused, then that was probably on me.

Am frustrated by the number of posts on here that think that women are doing something to result in this kind of behaviour. There is never any excuse for a man to grope / shout at / intimidate a woman. I've been sexually assaulted by a doctor, during a smear test - was I asking for that? I've had men put their hands up my skirt in night clubs, bouncers make comments about my breasts (thankfully that seems to have changed these days - bouncers in the 90s were pretty awful). Been called a "fucking cunt", because a man wouldn't take no for an answer in a bar. And so many men won't take no for an answer! I am always polite to start with, but I lose my patience pretty quickly these days.

Wow, what a cunt. Abuser-sympathising. Nice!

It started when I was twelve, walking home from school in my uniform and getting catcalled by some builders down the road. Then it was shouting from cars, getting pinched on the bum, being filmed on the bus, lewd comments, walking too close beside me and so on and so on. I don't know of any woman who hasn't had experiences similar. Everyone I'm close to has.

Oh and SweetPetrichor I've never been Miss World and some of these events happened when I was wearing a duffle coat/boring work clothes/school uniform and walking along the road or just sitting on a train. How's that drawing attention to myself?

Are you saying it's okay if it happened when someone was wearing a short skirt/having s laugh/going out for a few drinks? Because it sure as hell isn't.

Can’t imagine who the 4% who voted YABU are.

@SweetPetrichor

I was speaking to the police officer about a career in the police as a 17 year old having just left secondary school, and considering my future, when he tried to molest me. There was nothing in my questions which provoked him to act as he did.

It makes me sad that in fact too often, as seen here, women blame women for men’s actions towards women. If we can’t even get women on board to understand the problem, what hope so we have with men?!

@SweetPetrichor

I’m 31 and I have never been harassed, cat called, touched, groped or anything untoward. I work in a male dominated environment as well which ups the stakes. Maybe I’m just ugly...or maybe it’s not as much of an issue as people think. I don’t do anything to provoke unwanted attention though and I think that makes a big difference.

Oh Lord, another one who thinks 'I've been ok because I did it right.' No, that's not why. And nice victim blaming.

I have only experienced mild harassment, nothing that has disturbed me really, and I didnt really recognise it as harassment at the time. I'm aware that's quite lucky though!
Although any woman could experience harassment I suspect it might be worse for those who are very attractive? I'm fairly plain looking!

SweetPetrichor wow...just wow. So I suppose you’ve never been a girl in a school uniform? Never joined any clubs? You’ve never been for a run? Never been to a bar or a night club? Never walked down the street minding your own business? Never been on public transport? Never been drunk? Never been around drunk people? Never used any social media? Never been in a relationship with a man?

These are all examples of things you have to be doing to be sexually harassed or assaulted.

It's actually really sad to see woman post things on here suggesting it hasn't happened to them because they haven't invited it/encouraged it.

There is absolutely nothing that makes any kind or sexual harassment, whether minor or prolonged, acceptable or invited?!

Please consider your attitude on this, no one invited sexual harassment at all. Just because one woman wore a baggy jumper and another wore a shirt skirt and crop top does not mean harassment was invited!! If I go out with a low cut too revealing cleavage it doesn't not mean someone can touch it. Don't ever say you didn't invite it; as it suggests others do and makes the behaviour acceptable!!

I used to be touched and grinded upon every single time I went out to pubs/clubs.. it isn't ok. It isn't invited and it isn't normal.. but we do normalise it, we do say oh it's just men. No it's harassment.
Feeling uncomfortable walking past a building site because men whistle or shout comments.. something else that people normalise.

These kind of behaviours are not exaggerated, they are mostly ignored as 'normal' behaviour. People experience it and don't consider it harassment as it's just normal male behaviour.. but it isn't.

Ahh, and then I scroll up and come across @SweetPetrichor. I guess the rest of us 96% had it coming to us then.

Ps I didn’t mean to put the voting on but yes who did vote YABU ???

I think that those who say they haven't been harassed perhaps have a different definition? I guess one must believe that a woman hasn't been if she says not. But, if you're counting things like (and I absolutely believe we should) receiving a cat call at any point ever, bum groped in a club etc then we must be hard pressed to find those who havent.

This issue is eye opening for me as I feel I'm changing my attitude to this all the time, which is a good thing.

I have previously dismissed things that have happened to me. Now I am older I can see how wrong app this was and how I have been conditioned to accept it.

Cat calls from passing cars and builders. Bum touched in a club. Someone rubbing their crotch on me on the night bus. And, the worst, an old colleague when in a club putting his hand up my skirt and asking when are you going to fuck me?

Now I knew that was wrong but I guess I just accepted it - as did other girls I worked with. He was a wrong un. But now I look back and think - then men at work knew this happened. They were outraged... but did they disown him? No.

I use to when I was younger, I don’t experience any harassment now that I’m fat and in my 30s!

I've been raped twice, seriously sexually assaulted and lesser assaults. I have spent years being harrassed: regularly followed by men demanding blowjobs agressively in dark streets - one grabbed me by the neck and said I was going home with him... I have had hands shoved up my skirt and down my top, as well as myriad 'brushing up', innapropriate but less grim touching, licking (!?) etc incidents.

I know more women who have been raped than haven't been. It's grim.

@anxietyaunt

Can’t imagine who the 4% who voted YABU are.

The ones to whom it hasn't happened and who are, from the evidence, busily patting themselves on the back for having the "right upbringing" or "not being provocative like those other stupid females" I sincerely hope they read the responses and think again, hard.

I had the audacity to snog a boy in a nightclub once. Then he tried to physically drag me out of the club. Him pulling my arms with all his might, me leaning back with all mine, skidding along on my heels.

Was I asking for that @SweetPetrichor ?

Most disgusting that the majority of harassment I've personally experienced has been before the age of 16. By adult men. Just bloody strangers. I'd like to think that its because as time has gone on things have improved but I'm not convinced. I'm only in my 30s now so it wasn't a million years ago.

@ThighsofSteel

What a horrible post. How could having a wonderful father make any difference? Are you saying all those women who experienced harrassment just weren't aiming high enough or failed to have a 'male' demeanour at work.

No, what I was actually saying is that too many fathers teach their daughters what their place should be.

How does it make any difference to receiving abuse from strangers who don’t even know you? How does having an amazing dad stop unwanted comments and attention? I have plenty of confidence and self esteem but I could only respond to these incidents, I couldn’t stop them I can understand that some women enter abusive relationships perhaps due to upbringing and don’t see red flags. This is STILL the fault of the abuser. Your post is really poor and again blaming the woman. Exasperating!

Yes of course I have, I don't know any woman who hasn't. It's certainly lessened as I've got older, but only a couple of years ago a man pressed his dick against me in a busy train.

I enjoy the invisibility of having a baby/toddler.

Yes throughout my life and I’ve never invited it or encouraged it. Actually dumbfounded that some women think that that is the issue.

Yes.
I have been beeped at by men and heckled as a young school child with uniform on, groped in public places, had a man who I trusted enter me without a condom when I had been very clear that a condom was a prerequisite to our sex, I have had a friends male neighbour verbally harass me as a teenager, I know more women then I can count on both hands who have been the victims of violence at the hands of their partners and fathers, I know women who have been coerced in to sex, I have witnessed vile objectification in a corporate workplace and normalisation of the harassment of women to the point where our director had to host a meeting with the males in our company ASKING them not to grope women at the Christmas party....
I mean the list is endless

@anxietyaunt

Can’t imagine who the 4% who voted YABU are.

Yeah! Who the hell are they and what's wrong with them?