To insist husband is allowed into scan with me?

[Lass67]

Today experienced pain and bleeding in early pregnancy- tried to refer to EPAU which was a shit show in itself and ended up having to go to A&E as GP & midwife insisted wasn’t their responsibility to refer me and no self referrals accepted.

Husband allowed to stay with me in A&E and was a lovely support to be honest. When we finally got to EPAU he was told rather abruptly by receptionist he wasn’t allowed in. I waited hours to be seen alone listening to smooth FM in the waiting room (playing songs about being a parent FFS!) and wringing my hands before being seen by a very lovely doctor who had only been working in gynae a few weeks and struggled to tell me anything but told me my anatomy was ‘awkward’ and I’d need a scan- but by this point five hours after initially trying to get help scanning is shut and I have to come back tomorrow.

I then went out to find my husband sat in the cold with some other sad dads to be -not allowed to be with their partners.

I checked NHS England guidance and it says I’m allowed one support person with me at all points during antenatal care- updated December 2020 in light of Covid-19.
Royal college of obstetricians and gynaecologists agree.

Am I being unreasonable tomorrow if I insist on my husband being with me? I feel sick thinking of being told I’ve lost the baby on my own and then having to go outside and find him and have to repeat everything to him. It was hard enough today to retain what was being said. I understand if they want to minimise people in the waiting room but it was half empty and I don’t understand why they’d be able to contravene guidance from the organisation that commissions the service.

Of course YANBU. I think some people on this thread are being very bitter and nasty. It's not a race to the bottom.

YANBU - like you say it's not a race to the bottom and women should have been allowed a partner in. Especially now that guidance has changed I see no harm and only benefit in mentioning it.

Sorry to hear about the situations on this thread it must have been so hard to go through that.

Some people on this thread have been so horrible to OP who at the end of the day doesn't know if her baby is OK or not.

Clearly the experts have decided it’s reasonable to have partners there so let them be there

IT's just meaningless guidance from above that has not been implemented. IT doesn't make any difference to the actual rules happening in the hospital.
It's not about who deserves what. Hospital staff are trying to do their best in very difficult times and really don't need people insisting that the rules in place for a good reason don't apply to them.

@NoIDontWatchLoveIsland

They should be following current guidance.

I would warn you, depending how far along you are NHS can be very poor at handling miscarriage. If you are under 12 weeks you will simply be told to go home, take paracetamol for the pain and wait it out. There will only be medical intervention if you bleed very very heavily and even then in my experience you may be left for hours before being seen.

There's a bit of an old fashioned attitude that pre 12 weeks is no big deal and many health care professionals are very matter of fact/lacking empathy when dealing with women suffering miscarriage.

I’m so sorry you’ve had that experience but I wanted to add a bit of balance.

I’ve had two MMC diagnosed at scans, and both times I was offered surgical, medical or natural management. I opted for surgical both times and was given a choice of dates, and a leaflet on what to do if I started bleeding before the surgery date.

It would not be unreasonable to ask. But I think you would be kinder to yourself and your DH if you prepared yourself for them not being allowed to agree.

It would be awful not to be seen, again. Or being seen, alone, and also terribly upset.

I really hope that everything is ok.

Some right cunts out and about today. Really hope everything is ok OP

would warn you, depending how far along you are NHS can be very poor at handling miscarriage. If you are under 12 weeks you will simply be told to go home, take paracetamol for the pain and wait it out. There will only be medical intervention if you bleed very very heavily and even then in my experience you may be left for hours before being seen.There's a bit of an old fashioned attitude that pre 12 weeks is no big deal and many health care professionals are very matter of fact/lacking empathy when dealing with women suffering miscarriage

I don't think that's at all fair. Women have miscarriages, all day every day. There isn't anything to be done about it, in the vast majority of cases. Women rush to the dr, the hospital, expecting/hoping for who knows what...and there is nothing to be done most of the time. Under 12 weeks the best option normally is to go home and wait it out.
That said, ime, when something more is needed, it is provided. I've had two ERPC's, plus two medically managaed m/c, plus 4 wait it out at home ones.
I don't think the NHS is poor at all, I think often people expect something that isn't possible.

I really hope he is allowed in with you, OP. best of luck for today!

YANBU.
The guidance has changed since the first lockdown. They should be following their own rules.

I hope it all goes well. I would query about him coming in pre-appointment and bring the guidance and any response with you. I don't think in principle it's unreasonable, but it depends on what's going on where your hospital is and what your needs are. I wouldn't insist unless you're willing to not have the scan because they can simply say no and your options at that moments are having or not having the scan. You can complain and might have him allowed later, but that's not guaranteed.

Hospitals are in a difficult position with COVID. It's hard to balance the risks of potential increased transmission which is a major issue in hospitals to the risks when people aren't allowed a support person.

Pre-COVID, I sometimes have to state that I was bringing my spouse as a support person to appointments, including some involving gynae scans. It didn't cause the hospital to descend into chaos as some seem to think - in fact, while they were clear people couldn't bring family and friends to appointments, they encouraged patients to bring one support person/chaperone if we felt it was needed - they had posters everywhere about it and it was in all the paperwork. During the last year, HCPs are being offered in this role though how well that's working is questionable, and yes I've arranged in some cases him to wait with me and to be brought in if there is an issue (I've previously had the problem of losing sensation from the knee down during appointments and so unable to stand without assistance that I feel much safer having him give and it's probably safer with COVID for him to do so).

Being seen as an individual who has specific needs to consider should be part of basic care. That even pre-COVID this wasn't something always possible with the lack of staff and space is an issue that now has just been compounded. It may not be possible in this case, but that doesn't mean the want or need for support means someone thinks they're special.

Support person?! You make them sound like they install stairlifts.

Support person is much better to a lot of people that the otherwise commonly used "chaperone" and has been used for a while to distinguish someone there to provide additional care for the patient, including emotional support but also for mental health, mobility related, communication issues, memory problems (whether part of someone's condition/treatment or may be an issue if someone is likely to be distressed), and so on, from someone just bringing family/friends to a medical appointment.

I can’t believe the women on here saying that she is being unreasonable, that they went through it alone so the OP should too. The compassionate side of you should be saying absolutely no woman should be going through that alone.

It's sad. But these are difficult times for hospitals. I think people just need to comply with the rules.

For those who can't read:
"I checked NHS England guidance and it says I’m allowed one support person with me at all points during antenatal care- updated December 2020 in light of Covid-19.
Royal college of obstetricians and gynaecologists agree."

Op isn't asking for special treatment, just the treatment she should be having.

I hope the news is good, best of luck xx

There are some nasty shits on here today.

@Ironytheoppositeofwrinkly

YABU, you're no more important than anyone else 🤔 I've had 2 miscarriages during lockdowns and have had to be given bad news by myself both times, I'm sorry for your situation, and I hope it's good news, but what makes you so special that you can 'insist' the rules are changed just for you?

She’s not insisting its changed just for her. She’s found guidance which is applicable to all pregnant women. I’m sorry you didn’t get to have someone with you, it’s barbaric the way pregnant ladies have been treated during covid.

@Viviennemary

It's sad. But these are difficult times for hospitals. I think people just need to comply with the rules.

I hope things go ok for you today OP x

The guidance changed but the hospitals can only facilitate if room for social distancing allows. At my midwife unit, they do not have the room regardless of being allowed a support person or not. For the 20 weeks scan, my husband was allowed which is standard across the board but he had to wait in the rain outside while I was in the waiting room until our appointment. I understand your frustration, but they make allowance for you, they have to make allowance for everyone and it isn't safe to do so. We're in the middle of a pandemic. It isnt the nurses, midwives, doctors or receptionists fault. They are doing it for your and their own safety. Please dont start being difficult for them. I hope you get good news.

I do feel sorry for women in this position. However I also feel that staff shouldn't be put at any increased risk while doing their job.

I was under the impression that the national guidance is that partners should be allowed, but each NHS trust may impose different rules in light of each trusts' risk assessment (e.g. in a hotspot area you'd likely find more restrictions in place). Not saying that's right, but as with most things antenatal you'll find inconsistencies in different trusts!

FWIW, DH was allowed to my 12 weeks scan in Nov but only that one. I ended up needing a few 12 week scans as baby was originally too small, then in the wrong position. My trust didn't let him come along to any except that first attempt at the 12wk scan... so DH didn't really see anything as baby was too small. Rules across the trusts are very inconsistent.

I really hope you get the news you are hoping for today.

@WaitingForNormality

I was under the impression that the national guidance is that partners should be allowed, but each NHS trust may impose different rules in light of each trusts' risk assessment (e.g. in a hotspot area you'd likely find more restrictions in place). Not saying that's right, but as with most things antenatal you'll find inconsistencies in different trusts!

FWIW, DH was allowed to my 12 weeks scan in Nov but only that one. I ended up needing a few 12 week scans as baby was originally too small, then in the wrong position. My trust didn't let him come along to any except that first attempt at the 12wk scan... so DH didn't really see anything as baby was too small. Rules across the trusts are very inconsistent.

They're making it up as they go along, as many sectors/industries are. I needed an early scan at 10 weeks. Was told on the phone I'd have to be alone. When I turned up they said "do you have anyone with you you'd like to be in the scan?"

Fortunately my mother was outside in the car for support as my partner was working away. She was invited in.

The compassionate side of you should be saying absolutely no woman should be going through that alone

Lots of things should or should not happen, but reality is different. People shouldn't be dying alone of covid, but they are. If the hospital has rules in place to help keep numbers down, that is more important than guidance from above that is not relevant to what is actually happening right now.

It's not about what each individual wants or needs. The pandemic is not over, we are all impacted in a thousand different ways, and compassion doesn't make much difference to what is necessary.

It seems that every trust or area has its own different rules right now. Fortunately for me my local epau are letting partners in to wait and attend all necessary scans throughout. I can't imagine having been alone whilst told that are baby had stopped growing. I was able able have him with me the whole time. As it should be.

I hope everything goes okay for you today OP.

Sorry you've had this OP. I was at EPU yesterday- I had self referred by phoning the number (only open 9-12) and leaving a message and then they contacted me back the following day but didn't invite me in for a further 3 days. I also was told I had to attend alone. It is miserable and stressful and I already knew it was bad news due to private scans. I can't imagine how much more fraught it is in your situation to have to be alone. As PPs have said- screenshot the guidance and bring it with you. My EPU did say on their answerphone message that patients are asked to attend alone due to covid but if this is a concern to speak to the nurse/midwife about it.