To insist husband is allowed into scan with me?

[Lass67]

Today experienced pain and bleeding in early pregnancy- tried to refer to EPAU which was a shit show in itself and ended up having to go to A&E as GP & midwife insisted wasn’t their responsibility to refer me and no self referrals accepted.

Husband allowed to stay with me in A&E and was a lovely support to be honest. When we finally got to EPAU he was told rather abruptly by receptionist he wasn’t allowed in. I waited hours to be seen alone listening to smooth FM in the waiting room (playing songs about being a parent FFS!) and wringing my hands before being seen by a very lovely doctor who had only been working in gynae a few weeks and struggled to tell me anything but told me my anatomy was ‘awkward’ and I’d need a scan- but by this point five hours after initially trying to get help scanning is shut and I have to come back tomorrow.

I then went out to find my husband sat in the cold with some other sad dads to be -not allowed to be with their partners.

I checked NHS England guidance and it says I’m allowed one support person with me at all points during antenatal care- updated December 2020 in light of Covid-19.
Royal college of obstetricians and gynaecologists agree.

Am I being unreasonable tomorrow if I insist on my husband being with me? I feel sick thinking of being told I’ve lost the baby on my own and then having to go outside and find him and have to repeat everything to him. It was hard enough today to retain what was being said. I understand if they want to minimise people in the waiting room but it was half empty and I don’t understand why they’d be able to contravene guidance from the organisation that commissions the service.

[Miscarriage39]

I am so sorry you are going through this, and I am so sorry you are having to do so alone.

I am quite horrified at the reactions of some people in here, who appear to be suggesting that because they had to do it alone, so should everyone else. I am also disappointed to read all the people who are saying ‘it’s the same for everyone. It is not.

Some hospitals are allowing supporters to scans, and are even allowing partners to stay with women if there are private rooms available. This is a basic right, and if some hospitals can do it, I don’t understand why others cannot (unless they are in particularly high COVID areas). The real tragedy here is the inequality women face. I was fortunate and my DH was there when I had the bad news and there throughout my hospital stay. Had he not been, I would still want it to be possible for others to have support, and would certainly not resent any other woman having that.

OP you are not being selfish or unreasonable. My heart breaks for you, and all the women who go through this alone. Do ask, and if he cannot be at the scan, ask if can be with you immediately afterwards in the instance of bad news.

[Soontobe60]

@haveapieceoftoast

yes yabu, you are no more important than the thousands of other women who have attended scans alone, including me

That’s harsh! Of course its not unreasonable to want your partner with you for support particularly when things are not going well? It’s not a race to the bottom you know.
OP, I really feel for you in this situation. It may have seemed bonkers for you to sit in an almost empty waiting room without your partner for support. I hope all goes well today. If they won’t let him in, have your phone on video call so at least you can talk to each other whilst youre being scanned.

[poppycat10]

@Nogardenersworld

Are people really saying
- Despite the rules saying you can have someone with you - I couldn’t have anyone with me, so you shouldn’t either. ?!

I’m sorry to the pp who had difficult times, that must have been very hard to deal with. But this isn’t a race to the bottom, women deserve compassionate care, and men deserve to be involved in their children’s lives. If they do not want you to have someone there, the regulations should not permit it.

Op being allowed her partner, or not allowed her partner, won’t effect you and doesn’t change your experience.

Agreed.

It's the same when NICE guidance says you are entitled to certain treatment and a GP fobs you off. Or the guidance about VBACs or having c-sections when you want them and some arrogant consultant thinks he knows better than the specialists at NICE.

Funny how this sort of thing only ever affects women and how women are always so keen to pile on to women who challenge it.

[Nala82]

@TammySwansonTwo

I’m so sorry you’re going through this OP.

Unfortunately that guidance (a completely and utterly useless document and stupid idea from NHS England) has not been implemented at most trusts around the country, because it can’t be. Most units have already reorganised space as much as they can, and - here’s the real kicker - even now most trusts have not received the lateral flow tests needed to perform the testing the guidance relies on. And even if they have, there was no thought as to where the tests would be done and by whom, since most units are currently greatly understaffed and have no available space to perform tests, keep partners there until the results develop etc.

There’s the added complication in that scans are nothing to do with maternity in logistical terms - sonography is a separate department, and EPAUs are generally run by gynaecology, not maternity.

NHS England released that guidance knowing it could not be implemented - the Royal College of Midwives released a statement the same day saying it wasn’t possible to implement, and then nothing has been said about it since. It’s basically like it never happened.

I’m so terribly sorry you’re having to face this alone, but unfortunately I can tell you from experience of working in maternity through this that insisting on a partner’s attendance will not do anything. The units that can allow partners due to their layout and space are doing so. The others can’t because it goes against their risk assessments. I have regard some truly distressing stories over the last year of women facing some unthinkable things alone. I wish it were different, but sadly it isn’t yet.

I really hope things go well for you tomorrow

The argument from the college of midwives is daft. The harm caused by not allowing partners at appointments like this is clearly much greater than that arising from a potential to spread a disease which vulnerable people are now vaccinated against.

Given they have legal responsibilities to reduce risk and harm so far as is reasonably practicable, if they are going to ignore a piece of guidance it should be the covid related one.

[poppycat10]

So many sanctimonious idiots on here, I should actually stop coming on here as it's bad for my blood pressure

[LifesLittleDeciders]

Mention the guidance and ask again- they might have an individual policy that doesn’t allow him in but I can’t imagine anyone is heartless enough to refuse when it’s not just a routine scan but because you’ve got pain and bleeding.

Fingers crossed everything is fine though OP, i had period like cramps very often during my pregnancy and it always kept me on my toes - I have a very energetic 1 year old now though! 💛

[4Mongrels]

I’m sorry OP, I understand why this is hard for you.

I do think though that minimising the number of people in the unit is right. It helps keep everyone safe, including the staff and other patients.

That’s not to say that I am unsympathetic to those that wish to have a partner present, but keeping everyone as safe as possible is an understandable priority.

I wish you well for today.

[boltfromtheblueblue]

Are people really sayingDespite the rules saying you can have someone with you - I couldn’t have anyone with me, so you shouldn’t either. ?!

Don't know about anyone else but what I'm saying is guidance is not rules and don't over ride actual rules in each hospital.

[Enwi]

The pettiness of some women on this thread. Doing it alone should bloody well show you how awful and frightening it is. Why should OP go through that if she doesn’t have to? The guidance has changed thank fuck.

[Takebackthepower]

@haveapieceoftoast

yes yabu, you are no more important than the thousands of other women who have attended scans alone, including me

Agreed

[Gerla]

YANBU OP and I can't believe the heartlessness of some of the replies on this thread - so much for a bit of sympathy! BTW your post also makes me rage that I had a similar experience 15 years ago - waited all day for an emergency scan and was then told the scanning unit was closed. Why is this still happening? Terrible way to treat people. I hope you get some good news today.

[acrossthemultiverse]

For those saying "I didn't so you shouldn't either."

Well, my mother was with me at my emergency early scan as my partner was working away. And my partner will be with me at my 12 and 20 week scan so, OP, you should insist on yours being there too.

Good luck with it all 💐

[Countrylane]

Is it worth trying PALS? In some hospitals, they're v good at getting to the bottom of why something is going on. I am sorry you are going through this. And I am sorry for everyone who has gone through this in the last year - it must have been horrendous - but that doesn't justify inflicting the same misery on everyone going forward.

[WootMoggie]

Take a printout (or have handy on your phone) the following:

"In December hospital trusts were ordered by the NHS to allow pregnant women to have their partners present throughout scans, labour and birth after growing outrage that women were being forced to go through labour alone, or hear devastating news about miscarriages without the support of their partners."

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/jan/31/pregnant-women-going-for-scans-alone-told-they-cannot-film-baby

[AndThenTheDayBecomesTheNight]

I think there are very, very few posters on this thread who are really actually saying 'I had to go through it alone so so should you' and accusing those saying any variant of YABU of this, when they are actually saying something like 'I do sympathise but the guidance is there for a reason and you may not get what you want', is unfair. It is really exceptionally important atm to minimise infection risk wherever at all possible.

I suspect that some people have had my experience of this kind of thing on grim repeat and know that it's horrible whether someone is with you or not.

[WootMoggie]

(personally I would take more than one printout, in case a staff member conveniently wanders off with it).

[cakesandcookies89]

OP I really sympathise having been through Epc twice its hard. Nobody wants bad news alone. Clearly people are grieving and upset on this thread. You can definitely ask though. Hope everything is okay. :)

[ancientgran]

Maybe the person doing the scan is vulnerable and is concerned about being in a small room (if it is a small room) with lots of people and their partners in the course of a day.

It is hard to balance everyone's needs. I hope the scan goes well.

[drspouse]

@Wondermule anyone going into the EPU is likely to either have a life-threatening ectopic or be losing their baby. So yes, late scans (after the regular 20 week scan) are likely be held due to a risk to the baby but so are all early scans.
In fact, the 12 and 20 week scans are least likely to throw up problems (as the vast majority will be fine at this stage).

[B33Fr33]

Having had the worst news both on my own and with someone pre covid definitely push for what the medical community have agreed. To those who didn't have that, hey I am sorry you've gone through it. Personally I wouldn't wish it on anyone else. Over time I hope as you recover from your experiences that your compassion for others also returns. You must all be very hurt right now.
Thinking of you OP

[NoIDontWatchLoveIsland]

They should be following current guidance.

I would warn you, depending how far along you are NHS can be very poor at handling miscarriage. If you are under 12 weeks you will simply be told to go home, take paracetamol for the pain and wait it out. There will only be medical intervention if you bleed very very heavily and even then in my experience you may be left for hours before being seen.

There's a bit of an old fashioned attitude that pre 12 weeks is no big deal and many health care professionals are very matter of fact/lacking empathy when dealing with women suffering miscarriage.

[ancientgran]

To actually answer your question I wouldn't insist, I'd explain how you feel and ask if it is possible.

[WhiskyIrnBru]

@timeisnotaline

Why is everyone so competitive misery? Clearly the experts have decided it’s reasonable to have partners there so let them be there. Just because other women have died in childbirth trying to cross a desert in a refugee train doesn’t mean you need to wish that on the op. It’s the other way around - we need to wish (& fight for, wishing doesn’t do much on its own) health care delivered with compassion for everyone instead of this spiral to insisting worst case outcomes for everyone.

This. All day long.

[Jent13c]

YANBU

I don't personally think you are going to get anywhere insisting and if you only have so much strength to get through a tough day I wouldn't spend it arguing with battleaxe staff but no YANBU.

I've seen guidance so poorly executed across the NHS. One charge nurse who insisted her patients were not allowed to leave the ward at all for a cigarette or nip to the shop for infection control. Essentially holding them illegally against their will. It ended pretty badly.
The gynae ward which has been turned into an overflow covid ward therefore leaving nowhere for gynae emergencies to go and be looked after by highly specialised nurses like they deserve.
People dying alone or having to receive terrible news alone and make decisions for end of life care without their family.
It is not good enough.

We cannot have a 0% covid rate in hospital and we can try and reduce transmission as much as possible but you cannot expect people to put up with these ridiculous policies. You treat everyone as 'Amber' and take the protection you need to, wipe down all surfaces in between patients, swab all inpatients at first opportunity and treat people as advocates in their own healthcare. Its as if person centred care has just flown out the window under the guise of infection control. To the person who insists a chair needs to be left before someone else can sit on it...no you wipe it down! Same as every other vaccination clinic is all over the country! I'm sure OP and her DH wouldn't mind giving their chair a quick wipe.

I hope its not bad news today..I had a terrible massive bleed with my first and remember that trip to the EPAU. Its still pretty traumatising. I lost so much blood I was sure he was gone after waiting nearly 3 years for him.

[Rosieposy89]

Op, that is awful for you both and you should challenge. I would say its more important you have someone with you at epau than the routine scans as its more likely you'll receive bad news so I cannot understand not allowing partners in.