Screaming and shouting in a relationship

[cocowhite]

Is it normal for one person to loose their temper and scream and shout at the other person in the relationship?

I absolutely hate it - I've made this very clear that I hate it and it makes me unhappy. But I'm told that I'm living in romance land and that it's completely normal for screaming and shouting during an argument if if one person loses their temper.

From what I read on Mumsnet it's classed as "verbal abuse" sometimes I wonder if that actually living in the real world as surely all human beings lose it from time to time?

However I'm so at odds with that and whether to accept this any further. I'm in a 6 year relationship lockdown has been so testing.

I just don't know if I'm being unreasonable in thinking we can always discuss things and even argue like adults without aggressive shouting and screaming - or am I in cloud cuckoo land? Or is it basically whatever your comfortable with is ok?

I think it shows a massive lack of respect for you - as you clearly aren't ok with it. Sorry to say, but that doesn't demonstrate love.

I know some couples are ok with shouting but it would make me personally run for the hills. And hell would freeze over before my dc ever heard it (I had enough of that as a child, utterly terrifying).

No I wouldn't say it's normal, especially not if it's something that happens frequently. Dh and I actually had a briefly shouty argument this morning, and I can honestly count on one hand the amount of times that has happening in the 15 years we've been together. Yes people can get angry and shouty at times, but I definitely wouldn't put up with being shouted at as a normal par for the course occurrence

We've never once shouted or screamed at each other.

I'd be completely shocked if he shouted at me. I should be the last person he would shout at.

@Megan2018

I will buck the trend and admit it. We are shouters. But we are both shouters, and we don't mind it.

We never do it when DD is in the house so these days we shout less as the moment has usually passed - but we do have fairly frequent ranty outbursts because that is how we are. We get over our arguments quickly and move on. We aren't abusive to each other though - we are just quite animated and tend to get it all of our chest. It works for us, but other people would hate it.

It's not ok for one party to be shouting at the other regularly though in a one sided way- that does sound abusive.

This is exactly like my family - all very shouty and we all move on from it once the storm is over.

It was occasionally abusive when we were kids though, like it crossed a line. Especially my sister to me - she could be quite a bully, though we all suffered in different ways from our father dying when we were young. There was a lot of psychological fallout! We're all in a much better place now we're in our 30s, but it's been a slog.

We do shout sometimes now, but it's over stupid stuff and doesn't cross the line anymore.

My husband's family is not like that though, and he's very quiet, even when he's angry, so I have learned to control myself (most of the time, I'm not perfect!).

My ex husband was like this. He was mostly lovely but would explode and lose his temper and it was awful - and sometimes embarrassing if we were out or with friends. I always kind of just put up with it. Then he did it in front of our young child and her face was just so terrified it was awful.

We split up and now no-one shouts at me and it’s bliss and I feel so relaxed. I don’t think I realised just how oppressive it was.....I wouldn’t put up with it again.

@cocowhite maybe some relationship counselling would help you to decide what to do for the best?

Or consider this - does he shout at his boss? His mum? I'm guessing not, which also suggests that he is choosing to shout at you

This book is an eye opener
www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Does-He-That-Controlling/dp/0425191656?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

So it's not "only" shouting, he also uses the silent treatment?

This will be damaging your children.

We never argue, let alone shouty argue. I have snapped a little in the past, which DH knows comes from a place of frustration. He does the same but rarely. If either of us can't discuss things with a cool head we say we'll come back to it.

Why would you shout at someone if you love them?

Whether he's right or wrong, you are not within your power to change him if he doesn't think it's wrong. You could be in for a lot of huffing and puffing without blowing the house down

If you're regularly shouting at people you're an idiot who commands no respect and a failure as an adult.

Screaming and shouting is what kids do when they throw a tantrum.

Depends if it's 'just' raising your voices and you both do it and get something off your chest, maybe.

When combined with insults, putting you down, threats that it will get worse if you don't comply, then gaslighting you later that it was all your fault and you 'drove him to it' - crosses the line into verbal abuse to my mind.

Occasionally a fiery disagreement is normal, if it's frequent then it's time to have a rethink on your relationship and how you talk to each other!

[quote cocowhite]@TheLeadbetterLife what made you decide to change? [/quote]
I realised that it wasn't normal, that most people didn't do it, and that it was hurtful to anyone who didn't grow up in that environment and didn't know the rules of engagement, as it were.

Also, it's not like in the heat of the moment of these rows I didn't find it hurtful, even with my family when I knew it would blow over. I think there is an attrition, and I still don't trust my sister with some deeply personal stuff. I'd like to think she wouldn't say the sorts of things she did when we were younger (when she would sometimes take the darkest, most awful things that had happened to me and use them to attack me), but the trust has gone, irrevocably. I don't want my husband to feel like that.

In any case, I've learned that a sensible, mature discussion is a much better way to deal with problems. When I feel angry or upset I take myself out of the situation until I'm calm, then think about what I want to say and what I want to achieve from a discussion. I go back to him when I'm ready and speak kindly and try to be fair and recognise what I need to do too.

I mean, my husband may not be shouty, but he isn't good at recognising problems and dealing with them. He just puts his head in the sand, whereas I am impetuous and want to fix things as soon as they come up. He appreciates that I am working hard on my flaws and tries to do the same.

Probably doesn't shout at his boss but if he got into a big argument he probably would his mum, but to be fair she'd give him back as good as she got and then they'd make up and get over it.

His perspective is that it doesn't mean anything, it's momentary anger/loss of control and then he forgets about it.

For me I feel belittled, that he has no respect for me and he's trying to intimidate me.

I just felt so undermined in front of my children - I could see there faces were shocked, I felt small in front of them and it was an awful feeling.

I can't believe I'm back in this position of contemplating ending a relationship for the same reason.

Go to counselling. Don't put up and shut up. A lot of people's mental health is suffering. You need to tell her how it's affecting you and take steps to see if she can change.

Shouting can be verbal abuse and there are helplines for men and women to address domestic violence. (Yes, verbal abuse does count as domestic violence- it's GBH of the "ear 'oles" after all!)

One of my friends partner is Italian. He is a lot noisier in conversation generally than most English people (I know its a stereotype but I think its one with truth behind it). One time we were in the same room when he was talking to family on the phone and assumed he must have been having an arguement - he wasnt, it was just a loud conversation. One of the sources of friction in lockdown has been the general noise he makes on the phone etc. This is important background. One time when my friend and him WERE having a disagreement he raised his voice a lot (basically shouted). She flinched. HE NEVER RAISED HIS VOICE/SHOUTED AT HER IN AN ARGUMENT AGAIN. It doesnt matter if someone views shouting as normal and arent bothered by being shouted at themselves. If they know for a fact that their partner hates it and selfishly carry on doing it then they are not a nice person.

Screaming and shouting is for cretins and children.

Does he shout and scream at you in front of others, your friends and family? Or does he really know that it's unacceptable behaviour and save it until it's just the 2 of you?

I grew up in a very shouty, row-y family and it was quite stressful - but it was/is also a loving and close family. I'm now in a shouty (strident?) relationship which is also loving and supportive. I'm one of the shouty and temperamental ones in the relationship! So I think it depends on temperaments and context - both of us have improved over time. But if it is all one way I think that's hard - if it is someone constantly shouting AT you. The screaming bit sounds even worse to me - like they're lost control of themselves? You shouldn't just have to accept it - it will wear you down over time.

I am a shouter unfortunately.
But like another poster has said, I don't hold on to anger, or carry grudges, and neither does my family. Even when we have a row it is over immediately and forgotten.
I know plenty of people who do not shout but they then they fall out and do not speak to their husband / family for days or weeks or even longer with some unresolved problem - that is alien to me and worse IMO.

Never go to bed angry was a moto in our house.

Would you consider marriage guidance OP? You could explain to the counsellor that you particularly want to address the issue of different communication styles during conflict situations.

He should control his anger around you and he chooses not to
It sounds like you went from one abusive relationship to another one, it’s a horrible atmosphere for your children as well

My husband and I have been together and have never screamed, shouted or called one another names etc. I’m from an alcoholic home and heard enough during my childhood to know how damaging it is for everyone in the home. We get angry but have a normal conversation about it.

I’d tell my partner that it’s not normal and I’d leave the house every time he did it. Ultimately I do believe that people will keep treating you the way you allow them to. Honestly though, the fact that you’d prefer to keep going rather than have a failed relationship speaks volumes. Life is hard, relationships shouldn’t be if both are respectful and committed to making a success.

It happening once in a while is not unusual or necessarily abusive (unless it involves threats etc), but if it's week in, week out, you have a problem.

DH comes from a shouty family, I'd say 2-3 times a year we'll have a really bad shouty argument (mostly him shouting) and while it's not fun, it is, I think, within normal bounds for most relationships - although indeed some people genuinely do never argue. But 2-3times a month or a week would be problem territory.

I think it would be an excellent lesson to your dc that you won't be treated like this.

So very much easier said than done to end a relationship, but I think it's just too fundamentally unhealthy. Who gives a crap if it's "normal" anyway? That's nonsense logic. YOU don't like it, so it's disrespectful to you to keep doing it.

It's not up to him what your boundaries are.