To mind that DSS wants to have children so they can go to the wedding?

[snowisfallingallaroundus]

I suddenly feel old and judgy and didn't think I was.

DSS has been with girlfriend for a number of years. Lovely couple. Bought a house together last year and now announcing they are planning to start a family. Great. They then start saying they want a family before having a wedding as it would be more fun for the kids to be in attendance and involved.

I've surprised myself at my reaction. I've said nothing to them (and never would) but in my head I'm going WTF. House, kids then marriage? If marriage is important do it before children. You don't deliberately plan it the other way. Oddly them not getting married but having children didn't elicit any reaction in me.

AIBU? Am I old and out of touch? Is this how things are done now? Any insights into why I'm feeling such a reaction?

I would feel exactly the same. I can’t help but look dimly on having kids without being married. I just think it’s wrong. I know it’s probably an unpopular and old fashioned view but it’s just how I feel. I’m not ancient either, early 50’s. There’s plenty of room enough for us all to have our differing opinions though. It’s wise that you haven’t said anything though. I definitely wouldn’t have said anything to him either.

For what it's worth I totally agree with you OP.

To me it indicates that they regard children as some sort of accessory, rather than a wonderful but extremely serious responsibility, and I'm afraid I find that extremely depressing.

If that makes me a judgemental old bat then I'll own that!

I agree with the OP. I would never voice my opinion but having a huge white wedding with your children as guests after being together for years is, quite frankly tacky.

I can see it both ways and probably very much depends on their friends demographic!
If most of their friends have children they are less likely to spend all night out. Also post children they are less likely to spend mental amounts of money on a wedding.

But having a toddler I would not want my wedding day with him about he would be a nightmare! I personally enjoyed my wedding before child and a fantastic honeymoon without children!

Does it matter?

I meant take the wedding seriously, not the marriage.
It's like have a housewarming party and expecting a big fuss and presents when you've already lived there for years. No one doubts that it's your house but it's still a bit pointless and will cause a lot of eye rolling.

I think times have come full circle with this one. I had DC before we were married, and they were 20 and 18 when we married. I think it’s generational. It wasn’t particularly “cool” to be married in the late 80s or 90s. But people in their 30s getting married now get married before DC.

@KillerFlamingo

I meant take the wedding seriously, not the marriage. It's like have a housewarming party and expecting a big fuss and presents when you've already lived there for years. No one doubts that it's your house but it's still a bit pointless and will cause a lot of eye rolling.

Weddings don’t have to be big white wedding affairs, though. I think that is what a lot of posters are picturing, but a lot of people prefer small, intimate, registry office ceremonies and a restaurant lunch, or similar. Maybe that’s what OP’s DSS & his DP want: A relaxed lunchtime ceremony with toddlers and a quick buffet.

I think it's bonkers but I had the wedding I wanted so would never comment on others doing it their way. I might be tempted though to have a chat to the girlfriend/partner to make sure she knows that she needs to be protected financially before making a final decision.

Too many people still think that being a 'common law wife' is a thing.

No doubt you'll be flamed, but I agree with you. Only have to look at the number of threads on here from women trapped in miserable situations with useless/selfish/abusive DPs, DCs, no financial security and no legal rights.

My friend did this and l found it a bit odd but then l think if you are concerned about any fertility issues then getting pregnant can't wait whereas getting married can. And actually these days l don't think it is a big deal at all.

Too many people still think that being a 'common law wife' is a thing.

So true. The problem is that it actually does exist in some jurisdictions (Canada , for example). Not in the UK though!

It's up to them of course. I've been invited to two weddings when the bride and groom already had to children together. In both cases I joined in wholly with the excitment of the bride whilst my inner voice was questioning why all the fuss was needed when they were already a committed family .It all felt unnecessary. Equally I see that they wanted to celebrate. It is probably is an age thing!

My DB planned to do the same, their kids are now 7 and 5 and they still haven’t got married, I’m not sure if they ever will 😬

YABU, OP. The world has changed, move with it. My best friend married in 2015 with her 3 kids in attendance. They've since had a fourth. They're the strongest, most committed couple I know. There's more than one right way to manage commitment and relationships.

@snowisfallingallaroundus

I suddenly feel old and judgy and didn't think I was.

DSS has been with girlfriend for a number of years. Lovely couple. Bought a house together last year and now announcing they are planning to start a family. Great. They then start saying they want a family before having a wedding as it would be more fun for the kids to be in attendance and involved.

I've surprised myself at my reaction. I've said nothing to them (and never would) but in my head I'm going WTF. House, kids then marriage? If marriage is important do it before children. You don't deliberately plan it the other way. Oddly them not getting married but having children didn't elicit any reaction in me.

AIBU? Am I old and out of touch? Is this how things are done now? Any insights into why I'm feeling such a reaction?

You're sooooooo old and judgy.

My Mum is properly old fashioned and would never have done this but she has said lots of times that she wishes we could have come to her wedding. These days it’s fine. No need for moral judgements. Financially better if they got married first but only if they break up or someone dies (hopefully neither will happen). And they are planning to do it in the end - I hope it all goes as they want and they have a lovely celebration which include their new little family.

Just talk to them about the legal side of things and how it affects the breakdown of relationships. Its very important but I doubt they want to hear.

Christ there are some judgemental fuckers here. It's not the 19th century any more.

So true. The problem is that it actually does exist in some jurisdictions (Canada , for example). Not in the UK though!

Cohabitees do have legal rights in some situations in Scotland. A perfect example why no one should ever base a legal decision on Mumsnet advice.

I've been on so many threads on here where a woman with a partner and children has posted about financial security issues, only for lots of posters to pile in with, "why on earth didn't you get married BEFORE the children. I just don't understand women who do this.... etc...." so I'm surprised by many of the responses here. I wonder if it depends on when/where you post.

I'd say you're being unreasonable if it's a moral judgment you're making, but reasonable if you had concerns about other things, possibly. If it was your daughter in this situation I'd be speaking to her about making sure she aware of all the financial implications of not being married, depending on what plans are re. working, childcare, pension, etc.... in case the relationship weren't to work out for any reason.

Hopefully someone on your DSS's fiance's side will have a word with her about not becoming a SAHM without making sure she is financially secure. You could speak to your DSS I suppose to make sure he's aware of these kinds of issues.

I'd say it shouldn't be a big deal what people want to do re. marriage, but in reality - usually for women - it can be, if they're not clued up enough.

DS gets a bit miffed that DD was at our wedding and he wasn’t as he came along later. It was lovely to have her there, she was the star of the show, a position I was delighted to relinquish!

It wasn’t necessarily planned that way but basically..

*Today 18:05 extentioncord

You don't deliberately plan it the other way.

Except they are*

THIS!

On the other hand there is something special about the wedding being when you start your life together full of hope and you don’t know what will happen. Even more so if you move in together after the wedding but getting very rare these days.

It wouldn’t have been my preference, but then again when I got married I was not planning on having any children. But I wouldn’t get worked up about someone else doing this.

I personally don’t think I would have more fun with my kids there at my own wedding. You either have to be making sure they are looked after all the time, keeping and
eye out for them, or you need to ask someone else to do that, which wouldn’t exactly be a fun wedding for them. I love my kids and love spending time with them, but I prefer to do my socialising without them. I never relax for example at a bbq with them.

I am not a conservative or religious person but marriage is one thing I do have somewhat old-fashioned views about. I really don't understand why people intentionally do it in the 'wrong' order.

I think people get the concept of 'marriage' mixed up with the concept of 'a wedding'. Most people aren't preparing for marriage, they're preparing for a wedding. It's more about having a big fancy event than it is about the lifelong commitment part of it. In OP's case, they're clearly fixating more on the idea of throwing this event that they have in mind with their future kids in attendance, and less on the idea of being married to eachother. That's why you get people waiting to get married until they've saved up umpteen thousand pounds to have a massive event. If people really cared about getting married, they would have a more modestly priced wedding straight away, rather than a lavish event that costs a year's salary, several years down the line.

TBH if you're already making the commitments of having kids and a mortgage together etc, what's even the point in spending all that money to celebrate getting married, when getting married is not really adding much to your commitment level by that point, you might as well just stay unmarried if you didn't care enough about about it 5-10 years previously.