Do you think the English, if given a vote, would vote for independence from the rest of the UK?

[Kendodd]

Yabu - No they wouldn't
Yanbu - Yes they would

The break up of the UK seems high chance to me, maybe 60/40 to be voted for within the next ten years. They don't ever seem to ask the English what would you personally vote?

Given that it's hard to keep willy waving if you cut your dick off, I suspect most of these idiots prefer Scotland and NI to remain part of a union dominated by England.
Not because they have precious ideas about being a sacred Union but because it's hard to be a self important twat if you aren't able to boss people with how BIG you are.

England are the main component of the Union, they can't leave the Union.

However, if they were to dissolve the Union they would need to provide adequate help going forward for the other countries.

I believe NI & Scotland will leave within the next decade and will be supported by the EU.

No, the union is stronger together, particularly the mainland. We don't need more reasons to be insular, we don't need an even bigger mess than Brexit - and frankly, what is 'English' anyway?

Am I? My dad is Scottish, my mother's family, Irish. I could have an Irish passport if I wanted one; I'll definitely be able to apply for a Scottish one if we keep close to current rules and we do split. My cousins on my mother's side are Irish/Welsh. None of us would meet 'English' citizenship requirements in the event of a dissolution - although we were born in England and live here, none of us have an 'English' parent or grandparent.

And yet - mum's family moved when she was tiny. So did dad's. Neither of them remember living anywhere else. Superficially, neither of them have an accent other than North West English. I (and my cousins) were born in England and have never lived anywhere else.

Assuming a similar position to that of EU citizens now in the UK, I'd be applying for a passport from a country I've never lived in, which - if I tried to move there - would not recognise me as a native - and then paying for a visa to continue living in the country I was born in. I'd have to prove I had this visa to continue to be legally allowed to work in a role I've had for 12 years. The alternative would be English citizenship via the spousal route, but I'm not an immigrant and the cost of that is 1000's and 1000's of pounds.

This isn't the EU, which has only been around for a few decades, and where there are people alive who remember it not existing. The implications run through everything. It would take decades to unpick it all, and the cost and the time would be horrific. The consequences for 100's of 1000's of people, of all nations, of ripping away national identities and right to live and work, would be horrific.

For what?

Independence for Wessex
and Mercia
bring back the Deurotriges

I don't think it will come about as a result of violence, @AdultierAdult. It will come about when there's a border poll in Ireland and in NI that show support for it. I think it will be a pragmatic vote. Yes, a lot of people in Ireland will baulk at the economic impact of absorbing NI into the official Irish state and a lot people in NI will baulk at becoming Irish. But as the effects of Brexit continue to show themselves and as the UK becomes increasingly insular, as NI realises that they are seen as nothing but a troublesome relative by the powers at Westminster, there will be a shift. It will involve a lot of give and take on both sides and major changes in what Ireland looks like and how it's governed. But I do think it will happen.

After seeing the millions of posts on here about how awful Londoners are I’d consider a vote for an independent London.

Brexit and Covid have laid bare differences between England and the rest of the UK. Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are seen negatively, when they're seen at all.hmm I agree with @dreamingbohemian A propaganda campaign run like the Leave campaign would have a field day

Are they? Why are they seen negatively and by who?

I do know that Babdoc...my brother is one of them...doesn't change how I feel...sorry...

@Ceara

Loving how some posters read, "would you (if English) vote to leave the UK?" as "would you (if English) vote to boot Wales and/or Scotland and/or NI out of the UK?"

That's kind of what it means.

England voting out of the UK would be like leaving a party in your own home. It doesn't make sense

@Hammonds

Brexit and Covid have laid bare differences between England and the rest of the UK. Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are seen negatively, when they're seen at all.hmm I agree with @dreamingbohemian A propaganda campaign run like the Leave campaign would have a field day

Are they? Why are they seen negatively and by who?

Are you even reading this thread

@ListeningQuietly

Independence for Wessex and Mercia bring back the Deurotriges

Made up words! Fake patronymics!

@BidensWingWoman

I would agree with this. Devolution for England to get on par with the other UK countries

Funniest thing I've read in a long time!

A) the vast majority of mps in Westminster are representing England so basically the votes go their way anyway

B) the mps for the devolved Nations are not able to vote on matters that are devolved

So for you to get par, you'd need a system where the votes of your mps are essentially meaningless on matters that aren't devolved 😂

You're easily amused then.

There is a disparity at the moment around issues that are devolved other than in England. Westminster wouldn't deal with those matters so not sure what point you're trying to make

Yes, I think they would. Because people are contrary and easily wound up. It would be easy to paint a picture of the other nations "bringing us down". If people DGAF about the Irish border, and a really high percentage of Leave voters/Tories said that the break-up of the UK including loss of Scotland was worth it for Brexit, then yes obviously those bonds between UK nations are not really that strong for most people. Certainly if the other nations wanted to leave I don't think it would be seen as our business to stop them. Why NI still wants to be with us I've no idea.

This thread also makes it apparent how little of a clue some people have about NI's place in the UK.

Westminster wouldn't deal with those matters so not sure what point you're trying to make

I'm not sure what you are saying here. What doesn't Westminster deal with?

@AdultierAdult

Surprised at the poster above who thinks NI would rather leave UK, definitely not the sentiment I've come across here though lots of disappointment over Brexit and concern of the repercussions. My Irish family in ROI don't seem to think the Irish want NI back, either, for economic reasons. Just don't see how it could work. I grew up in England though and have limited understanding of the whole context.

Depends who you ask, there is a growing momentum for a 'New Ireland' is many Northern and border areas.

Personally I think that NI should have a period of independence (supported by EU) then gradually reunited under a shared government.

I would like Northern Ireland and Scotland to go and Wales and England to stay together, unless the Welsh are strongly against staying.

Scotland is like a boyfriend who constantly threatens to split up with you but never actually does.

I would hate to lose Scotland or Wales, but I’d vote for independence from Northern Ireland, it causes so many problems for the rest of the UK

The ignorance!!! That can’t be a serious post?

If you don’t think Scotland bring anything to the uk just think about why was Davey boy so desperate to hold onto us? He nearly shot his pants when he realised it might go the opposite way to what he wanted. He offered Scotland all sorts of stuff like an abusive partner, then went back o it all and ‘punished’ us. Our voices aren’t heard as we get lumbered with whatever England want, we’re stuck paying for a nuclear submarine that could wipe our whole country out but it’s here because it’s ‘only Scottish people’ that would be killed if it went wrong. I got told on here that England are the ‘most important’ of all the uk nations so we have to put up and shut up. Then again happy to take our money but grudge every penny sent back north. We’re in debt but we have no borrowing powers so how can any of that debt be ours?

@bellinisurge

Given that it's hard to keep willy waving if you cut your dick off, I suspect most of these idiots prefer Scotland and NI to remain part of a union dominated by England. Not because they have precious ideas about being a sacred Union but because it's hard to be a self important twat if you aren't able to boss people with how BIG you are.

Who are ‘most of these idiots.’? If its aimed at posters who have commented on wanting to stay part of a union I think your anger has warped your process of thinking.

Most people just think of Wales and Scotland is just some where nice to go on your holidays...

BoJo equally keen, hence his trip to Scotland recently despite being in lockdown. And the bizarre notion that sending Prince Edward to live in Edinburgh will help strengthen the Union 🤔

@Stripesnomore

I would like Northern Ireland and Scotland to go and Wales and England to stay together, unless the Welsh are strongly against staying.

Scotland is like a boyfriend who constantly threatens to split up with you but never actually does.

That's because the UK keep gaslighting them. 'Stay, we're stronger together' 'We'll Never leave the EU',

We probably are stronger together, but there are more important qualities in a country than strength.

Westminster wouldn't deal with those matters so not sure what point you're trying to make

Oh, I think you are saying that devolved issues aren't dealt with in Westminster. The devolved parliament's deal with them in their respective countries, but Westminster deals with them for the non-devolved nation i.e. England...

@Moonmelodies

What next, Orkney independence? Yorkshire? Isle of Wight? Dyfed?

I'd vote for independence for Yorkshire.