Do you think the English, if given a vote, would vote for independence from the rest of the UK?

[Kendodd]

Yabu - No they wouldn't
Yanbu - Yes they would

The break up of the UK seems high chance to me, maybe 60/40 to be voted for within the next ten years. They don't ever seem to ask the English what would you personally vote?

[quote ChancesWhatChances]@mellongoose did you ever consider that those devolved nations are actually countries in their own right invaded by England? Did you ever consider that the devolved nations might not want to be under the control of their oppressor nor contribute in any way to the furthering of England? England has systematically ensured that the other countries in Britain detest them, England will end up very alone if the citizens continue this way.[/quote]
I prefer to look forwards not backwards.

The nations within the U.K. work better as a union. I feel the Union could do with recognising give and take from all sides. Not the parent/child relationship we have now.

Surely that would give pride to all nations working in union and in harmony.

The nations within the U.K. work better as a union

How can you know that?

@LexMitior, update on Keatings. Lord Malcolm has agreed the appeal should be heard before the election in May, likely the first week of April.

Appeal will be heard on 6 April, at 10.30am.

Ah, that is interesting news. I suggest we leave our fingernails alone until that time, or they may be down to stumps!

@HirplesWithHaggis

We agree again! I'll be voting ISP on the list, haven't decided whether to hold my nose and vote SNP on the constituency, leave it blank, or spoil it with a "stuff your GRA and Hate Crimes" message. So sad to see the party that always had independence at its core lose it like this. :(

For me, the core of SNP has always been rather uncertain in terms of a policy except independence, because they were prepared to weathervane on other policies.

I also think that those who are waiting for a well thought out basis for independence with the SNP leading the process will never get it (plan for what happens after a vote to leave is what??). Partly because the success of independence depends on the terms of the split.

I cannot imagine if the SNP were to win independence and lead the negotiation because it would be bad choice between saying "we want to work with you" or saying "we demand" with a political party whom professed to despise Westminster and its PM. It is all well making hay now with that but if you want to talk to these people later? It will take years. Those years will be to the disadvantage of Scotland.

Its possible that Scotland may be independent with a generation - but I think odds on the SNP will never manage it or indeed they will have rethink as to how they get out and how they manage that (curiously the plan is a bit thin and the devil is in detail). They need perversely to get some friends in Westminster because they need to leave it. They have made a bad job so far. You will never be able to finesse Westminster or get something by demanding it only. Many politicians thought they could otherwise. They failed.

If there were to be a vote for independence it should be a multi stage process. The independence parties (SNP et al) will need to drop the entire independence thing and work one "What does independence look like" which I would have hoped (learning from Brexit) would be multi party and ultimately put to the people. After which you have your first election under the new constitution.

On the basis there are tonnes of English speaking countries around the world that have trodden that path one way or another, there should be a lot of references to work from ...

On a related note, it will be interesting to see how Bermuda fares with the will of the people here.

www.royalgazette.com/politics/news/article/20210219/cannabis-legalisation-up-for-house-debate/

Burt warns London over cannabis licensing act

The Premier said last night Bermuda’s relationship with the UK would suffer serious damage if a law to licence cannabis production failed to get Royal Assent.

David Burt said there were indications that the Governor would be unable to give assent to legislation that contravened Britain’s international obligations.

But he added: “This legislation will pass … If Her Majesty’s representative in Bermuda does not give assent to something that has been passed lawfully and legally under this local government, this will destroy the relationship that we have with the United Kingdom.

...

“I say that because it can not be, it can not be, that locally elected governments lay out their election manifestos, go to the polls, have broad public support … and it be for someone who represents people 3,000 miles away to tell the country ’no, you can not’.”
(contd)

Frankly, if you are relying on legal quibbles about 'once in a generation' referendums to stop an independence movement based in resentment of divides in inequality, then you have already lost. Badly.

It means you’ve already lost the real legitimacy of the consent of the governed. I can’t believe that a national leader would fall back on this. I struggle to believe a lot of the ineptitude of our times, or understand how anyone can hope to gain from this. 5000 years of written and well-known human history, of temporarily stable states and collapse after collapse after collapse, yet ‘Homo Sapiens Sapiens’ learns nothing.