To expect child maintenance?

[greysa]

Posting here for traffic.

Currently pregnant, not in a relationship with the father nor were we ever in a relationship. We have the benefit of not having split up or holding any sort of bitterness or resentment that that may have caused. We are friends and he is excited about becoming a dad for the first time. His parents are equally excited and have bought lots for the baby already.

Obviously we don’t live together, but he is adamant that he wants to be as involved as he can be. I have a good job but their maternity policy is rubbish so I will only be getting SMP for my mat leave, and I am anticipating struggling financially to begin with. I’ll probably only be able to return to work part time too, and I assume he will continue to work full time so shared 50/50 custody won’t be feasible.

I’m worried that by bringing up the topic of him paying child maintenance, that he’ll be offended and think I’m implying that he won’t do his fair share if that makes sense. I don’t want him or his family to think I’m being grabby, but I also need to try and plan for how I’m going to manage on my own, at least for the first 6-12 months.

AIBU to expect child maintenance payments to begin with on the basis that he won’t have baby overnight etc and I’ll be doing the majority of the care? I was thinking it could then be reviewed based on how often he has her overnight etc, and how much the parenting is really shared. It’s hard to gauge it at the moment before it actually happens as I’m not 100% sure what will happen with my work, and his. Never thought I’d be in this situation so have absolutely no idea what’s normal or reasonable, and he and his family really have been lovely and supportive and I don’t want to rock the boat if it turns out I am being unreasonable!

Well he can’t start changing nappies whilst it’s in utero can he?!

Precisely my point. It’s easy when it’s all theoretical. It’s a lovely fantasy for him at the moment, he’s not having to do anything much yet he can’t even be arsed to get to a scan on time.

He won’t discuss finances or practical arrangements, he won’t take even a relatively small financial hit to take paternity leave. It’s all words and talk’s cheap. I really hope he’ll put his money where his mouth is but if I were OP I wouldn’t be holding my breath.

I think the scan experience gives you an important insight into his priorities & shows you, unfortunately, that he can’t be relied upon to put yours & the baby’s needs before his own. Please don’t allow him to control your birthing experience - that’s stressful enough without you having to navigate his ego!

Also, the fact that you implied his interest in the pregnancy waned after you stopped sleeping together is a worrying red flag. He may step up & be the amazing dad he thinks he’s going to be (I certainly hope so), but you have to put things in place to protect yourself & your baby in case this doesn’t happen. Once you’ve got your head round doing this alone (which includes getting the money your baby is entitled to formalised), you remove his power & it’s up to him to prove he can be a great dad as you won’t need to chase him.

The more you send him long texts explaining everything in detail, the more he’ll view you as ‘pestering him’. I think you need to make it really clear that you’re making your own plan - ‘this is what I am doing & if you want to be involved - you need to do x, y & z.’ Then don’t contact him for a while & see what he does. His response (or lack of) will tell you all you need to know. Best of luck OP - whether he’s by your side or not, I’m sure you’ll do an amazing job x

@Kitewoman

oh, he will be also entitled to up to 4 weeks unpaid parental leave annually. granted, unpaid but many parents have no alternative to take some unpaid leave every year. It's unpaid but who said having s child is great for the bank account.

Of course he’ll opt to take unpaid leave when he’s snubbed paternity pay.

Of course he’ll opt to take unpaid leave when he’s snubbed paternity pay.

you are probably right. it was more meant as information for the OP. many parents don't know about it esp new ones. It may come in at some point.

by the sound of it and how is is avoiding to make any financial commitments, I would plan for the statutory minimum in child support and how to manage it incl childcare myself (e.g. UC and the childcare element). Doesn't sound like it will be going well.

If you’re having a baby together, where your lives are now going to be entwined forever, then you need to be able to speak honestly with each other from the off. There will be many difficult decisions and situations during your child growing up. Sit down with him and be honest about what you need from him. This is a huge commitment for you both, and you need to be on the same page from the start.

I don’t understand the desperation to attack him.

Then can you please leave it to those of us who do? This is a serious situation going on.

@GeordieGreigsButtButtZoom

I don’t understand the desperation to attack him.

Then can you please leave it to those of us who do? This is a serious situation going on.

Just because I don’t agree with your POV doesn’t mean I should be excluded from the discussion, or that my contribution is any less valid.

You appear to misunderstand the nature of a discussion.

Oh good luck op

You appear to misunderstand the nature of a discussion

Well you by your own admission can't understand what's wrong with the idiot who's failing in all his duties before they've even properly begun, and seem to think the problem is that the rest of us are just "bitter" for some unexplained reason.

OP is in a serious situation here and the guy is causing her trouble. If you don't understand that, as you say you don't, PLEASE leave it to those who do.

I’m finding all perspectives really helpful. I’ve had mixed responses in real life, with more people saying things like ‘at least he wants to be involved’. My own mum said ‘ah well that’s fair enough’ when I told her his response about him wanting to go halves and seeing her as much as possible. She also implied that maybe I’ll be lucky and he’ll want a relationship with me once the baby is born, completely disregarding the fact that I don’t have romantic feelings for him and definitely do not want to be in a relationship with him! It feels like an old fashioned attitude and I was really surprised that she came out with that, but it also is helpful in preparing myself for similar responses from others. The advice I’ve received here is really eye opening, and I’m so grateful. I feel much more confident and assertive in standing up for myself and making sure that I am doing the right thing in the interests of my baby, rather than worrying about what people think of me.

@Livelovebehappy

If you’re having a baby together, where your lives are now going to be entwined forever, then you need to be able to speak honestly with each other from the off. There will be many difficult decisions and situations during your child growing up. Sit down with him and be honest about what you need from him. This is a huge commitment for you both, and you need to be on the same page from the start.

And this is why you should think hard about automatically putting him on the BC. He will be able to have real influence over your and your child's life at a whim. It may all be fine, but the scan incident and your description of him as being oppositional for the sake of it isn't promising.

Just scanned through the thread. He seems a bit - transactional. Yes, "costs" on maternity leave don't include childcare, and what's actually coming out of the bank is nappies, making sure you eat loads if breastfeeding, formula if you bottle of mixed feed, and clothes. But you still need to pay your bills for the house in which the baby lives.

I suspect unless you do very literal 50/50 with week on week off, he won't pay half of nursery/childminder and he'll also think that this sort of approach should be logical and obvious to you.

with more people saying things like ‘at least he wants to be involved’.

It's distressing that this is seen as such a praiseworthy thing for a man with regards to his own child.

But at any rate, thus far the indication is that he doesn't want to be involved in any useful, meaningful way. The previous references to "pay per view" were bang on, and the fact that he won't take a two-week hit on income but fails to grasp that you'd be taking the same hit for much longer, is really worrying.

I'm glad that you're realising you're only being sensible and responsible in pinning him down over these things. Anyone who tries to make out that you're being unreasonable in any way for expecting the willing father of your child to appreciate what's happening and make proper plans for it is not acting in your best interests.

I would think twice about naming him on the birth certificate. It’s something you can always do later once you see how he’s stepped up, it’s not something you can change and it automatically gives him a lot of control and entitlements.

If I was him I would expect 50:50 care. I think it’s unfair to not expect that request from him. He can use childcare just like other full time working parents.

@Coffeeandcocopops

If I was him I would expect 50:50 care. I think it’s unfair to not expect that request from him. He can use childcare just like other full time working parents.

With a newborn baby ????

If you are not putting his name on the birth certificate why do you expect him to help bring up the baby? I understand giving the baby your surname but to deny him to be named as the father is hypocritical when you expect him to financially contribute.

The OP has said he is going on the birth certificate.

@GeordieGreigsButtButtZoom

You appear to misunderstand the nature of a discussion

Well you by your own admission can't understand what's wrong with the idiot who's failing in all his duties before they've even properly begun, and seem to think the problem is that the rest of us are just "bitter" for some unexplained reason.

OP is in a serious situation here and the guy is causing her trouble. If you don't understand that, as you say you don't, PLEASE leave it to those who do.

I didn’t say either of those things. As you’ve done with the OP you’ve totally blown my comments out of proportion.

I merely observed that some are finding non issues to beat this guy with, like using AL and that leading OP down the path of picking fault with everything will only guarantee she isn’t happy with the outcome and sour relations. That approach isn’t conducive to a good co-parenting relationship. There’s an awful lot of inferences surrounding the Dad’s actions and motives, factually it’s actually a different matter. It would seem people are happy to warp OP’s reality based on their own bitter pasts.

How is that helpful? OP can only lay the foundations but she needs to be responsive too. She can’t just keep going in at him and demanding assurances that on MN terms he can’t possibly provide.

@greysa

I’m finding all perspectives really helpful. I’ve had mixed responses in real life, with more people saying things like ‘at least he wants to be involved’. My own mum said ‘ah well that’s fair enough’ when I told her his response about him wanting to go halves and seeing her as much as possible. She also implied that maybe I’ll be lucky and he’ll want a relationship with me once the baby is born, completely disregarding the fact that I don’t have romantic feelings for him and definitely do not want to be in a relationship with him! It feels like an old fashioned attitude and I was really surprised that she came out with that, but it also is helpful in preparing myself for similar responses from others. The advice I’ve received here is really eye opening, and I’m so grateful. I feel much more confident and assertive in standing up for myself and making sure that I am doing the right thing in the interests of my baby, rather than worrying about what people think of me.

Sounds positive OP. I’m glad this thread has been helpful to you.

Perhaps he's looking to use his annual leave rather than paternity leave just now as with current restrictions its as good a way as any to use it up.

OP, I'm not going to derail your thread with a bunfight. But please be wary of anyone who constantly excuses bad and irresponsible male behaviour, especially with regards to your co-parent, by making out that you're being unreasonable or irrational, or that those who see it for what it is are just the stereotypical, unexplained"bitter women". It sounds as if you've had a bit of this in real life, so this is a wider point, and it does come up a lot all over the place. You'll see it again.

It's exactly how women get pressured into accepting bad behaviour long term, as you're being pressured into doing now, leading you to wonder if you're being a cow by wanting the man to act as sensibly and responsibly as you are. Meanwhile, men are praised for as little as "wanting to be involved" with their own children.

Stand your ground, as you're doing. You are about to become parents; it isn't going to get easier and it isn't just your life he will impact with his determined uselessness.

I agree we can't know this man's motives, whether he's just naive or lazy, or whether he's being more deliberately difficult.

But that doesn't change the fact that his actual behaviour is not encouraging. Whatever his reasons, he's being hard work and that doesn't bode well.

The two things that stood out to me were the OP saying if she didn't contact him she would never hear from him until her due date, and the way he made her scan appointment all about him, to the point that they were late. Those are really not good signs.

It's not about finding every little fault in him, it's recognising red flags when they appear.

@dreamingbohemian

I agree we can't know this man's motives, whether he's just naive or lazy, or whether he's being more deliberately difficult.

But that doesn't change the fact that his actual behaviour is not encouraging. Whatever his reasons, he's being hard work and that doesn't bode well.

The two things that stood out to me were the OP saying if she didn't contact him she would never hear from him until her due date, and the way he made her scan appointment all about him, to the point that they were late. Those are really not good signs.

It's not about finding every little fault in him, it's recognising red flags when they appear.

I don’t disagree. Although Geordie is determined to make inferences about my posts and assertions that just aren’t there.

I was just encouraging OP to exercise caution in finding fault with every little thing. Somethings are non issues and if you start regarding them as issues you’re going to make them where there aren’t any.

Picking your battles is important IMO. I speak from experience of being part of a blended family. It’s much easier when everyone gets along than when there’s constant nit picking and needless fault finding.

anyone who constantly excuses bad and irresponsible male behaviour, especially with regards to your co-parent, by making out that you're being unreasonable or irrational

I’ve encouraged OP to be more objective. This is a very far fetched conclusion of posts.