Who should pay?

[Fudgewhizz]

Scenario: Sibling A lent Sibling B a car seat (a good one) to help them out when they had a baby, as money was tight. It was made clear that they would need it back when they had another child.

Sibling A had another child and asked for car seat back, giving several months' notice (obviously). Sibling B had been using seat for 18 months by this point. Covid hit, car seat couldn't be returned in person so needed to be couriered.

It took Sibling B another six months to get round to sending the seat, citing not having found a replacement seat / big enough box to send in / too expensive to send / too busy. Finally got round to sending it (had had it two years). In the meantime, Sibling A has been using car seat that is about to expire (apparently they have a shelf life, after which time the plastic degrades) and will soon be outgrown.

Car seat arrived filthy, with part of the harness worn away due to incorrect usage (twisted belt causing friction in the wrong place so badly fraying), and inadequately packed. Has clearly been chucked around by couriers - standard, and should have been packed better as this is to be expected. Had no padding round it and had obviously been rattling round in the box. Dirt and potentially harness could have been resolved (if harnesses available as a spare part), seat being thrown around cannot as there's no telling what unseen damage has been done (which is why they advise to replace seat if it's been in even a minor accident).

Sibling B is refusing to contribute at all to cost of new seat, citing money issues and that it's not their responsibility at all, and they've already spent money sending it back. Sibling A also has money issues and can't really afford to replace a seat that they were counting on using and would have been able to had it been packed properly (or if they'd not lent it in the first place - lesson learned there).

I mean, it's obvious which sibling I am, but who is right? Who should have paid for sending it back, and should sibling B offer to contribute to a new seat? Wear and tear and dirt fair enough, seat unusable I think not so much.

Hmm
I don’t think you should have lent it if you couldn’t afford to replace it. Especially to someone as flaky and careless as B.
You are clearly not going to get any money back. Just learn the lesson never to lend to B again.

@Fudgewhizz can also see you've had another thread in the past about how dh family have wrecked things you have lent them. I think your need to get a fucking grip, stop causing arguments and grow up!

OP what exactly was the point of this thread if you just get angry at anyone who disagrees with you?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3909958-to-not-lend-anything-to-dh-s-family-again

Here's another one of her threads about lending things and apparently came back wrecked

If you borrow anything you do so knowing that if you damage it you make it good or replace. The risk associated with getting free use of an item without having to pay out the money to purchase it is that you may have to pay something eg repair or towards a replacement in the event that you cause damage. In addition you return the item in a timely fashion.

@Mammaaof Instead of nitpicking on people's threads, and trying to make them feel worse about something they're already upset about instead of just giving your opinion once and leaving it there, why don't you go and try to be nice to someone? I feel that would be a better use of the compassion I'm sure you have stowed away somewhere, now, don't you?

@PlanDeRaccordement thank you for sharing that info, we almost bought that car seat.

OP, wouldn't a courier invalidate the warranty on the seat unless it was in its original packaging? You can't even take a car seat in checked baggage on a plane without it being deemed as crashed.

Regardless, I think A and B were BU to agree to use a courier, A should buy a new seat, B should have given the courier money to A and that should have been the end of it. But I think A should maybe be a bit less annoyed at B because B did go to the trouble of trying to courier it. But B was silly to do that without sending a picture of what the seat was now like, since if it's that damaged, it was probably obvious. And it does seem like B maybe held onto it this long to avoid having to buy another seat. But did B know A was imminently planning another baby rather than just intending to have one at some point in the nebulous future? Because if so they never should have accepted the car seat (and A shouldn't have offered if this is the case).

So maybe both A and B should draw a line, chalk it up to experience, never lend each other stuff again and move on like nothing happened, since both have been burned here.

Why not just buy another car seat? You don't need to buy a really expensive one.

Honestly, you can't expect a car seat to be used for 18 months and not come back in a bit of a state.

@Fudgewhizz I can see from your other threads you like everyone to agree with you, clearly your not upset as you 100% think your in the right. Throwing toys out your pram now or car seat😂😂

I don’t think anyone is strictly wrong, but don’t lend things to people who have very different attitudes to stuff. Tbh I’m more on your sibling’s camp, but because of that I would never borrow off someone!

I wouldn’t consider a car seat to be something that “should” last a long time, purely because it’s for everyday use and will be heavily battered around. You clealry took excellent care of it, but as you’re a bit precious about these things (not meant meanly, genuinely wish I was more like that!) it was a terrible idea to lend it. And tbh I think when someone lends you an item like this semi-indefinitely you don’t really think they will ever actually want it back. I think there’s a good chance they didn’t take the request for it back that seriously because it seems a bit of an odd situation, especially considering how much transporting it would cost, and how far away you are.

I also think any damage in transit can’t be wholly blamed on them. Packages are treated pretty crappily at the best of times. If it’s dirt that you’re worried about then yes that may be because of bad packaging, but TBH it sounds like it even if they had packed it brilliantly you would still have cause for concern about it being damaged.

All in all I don’t think the item “owes you anything” anymore, it’s lasted through 2 kids. I think your sibling is probably pissed about you wanting it back, the expense of sending, and the logistics of this all.

@cinammonbuns it's not the disagreeing, it's the name calling I'm retaliating to - cheapskate / disgusting etc. Many people have disagreed but been nice about it, or just factual. I don't mind that, that's fair enough and it's what I asked for. I just don't get why people have to be so bitchy.

Just buy a new car seat. After 2 years of spills and accidents I would have written it off anyway. If you knew you needed a car seat all those months ago did you not think it would be better to save up incase your brother let you down?

@Onjnmoeiejducwoapy thank you, this sort of reply is much appreciated. I don't mind people disagreeing, I just mind getting called names.

To be fair, looking at your other thread I do have to ask why do you keep lending your stuff when you clearly want it to be always in excellent condition and back when you want? They’re kind of mutually exclusive, in 90% of cases! I would never lend an item I actually wanted back, unless it was to someone I 100% trusted and who lived near me.

So.you lent you're dropping something and aren't happy with the condition even though babies shit and puke and get food in carseats. Youre thread you've posted you complained about a baby grow second clothes do eventually lose colour especially when white and babies poo and are sick. I think you need to stop lending stuff or.give them away and not expect them back.

Be less helpful! Put stuff you like in the attic!

Dbro* not dropping bloody autocorrect.

@Teardrop2021 exactly I linked the op old thread to show this isn't just a one off and nothing can stay immaculate for 2 years with children

@Onjnmoeiejducwoapy because I'm an idiot! I would have learnt from the first one but I lent it all at the same time (to different family members). It is apparent from the responses here that this isn't a normal thing to do..! (I'm not neurotypical so I don't always know what's normal and I tend to find out the hard way)

I agree with the recent posters. You should stop lending stuff out. You clearly have expectations of the condition it should be in on return that don't match with those of the people you are lending to. I would be the same up to a point. I try to look after stuff and some of my friends & family have damaged things I have lent out & I have been upset, so I don't lend to those people - I would however give them things that I no longer wanted back.

Honestly OP if you have a car and plan on taking a child out in it, you're going to need a car seat. Why on earth are you and your sibling planning to have children you can't afford the basic equipment for?

Incidentally - me not being neurotypical is also why I'm so fastidious about looking after things (that and lack of funds for replacement). I only realised recently that not everyone does this. Had I realised before, I wouldn't have lent the stuff out. I was just trying to be helpful.

Tbh at this point I'd be happy if he just stopped being so awful to me :(

@Iminaglasscaseofemotion Well I didn't foresee there being a global pandemic that would decimate my industry...

I wouldn't have asked for it back after 18 months TBH, but since you did, B should pay 50%- they've saved a fortune not having to but their own.