To have become a Brexiteer yesterday?

[Mentum]

I was so Remain, I was devastated when we left. But the EU trying to steal our vac and casually invoking Article 16 has really left me aghast. I can't believe they are lashing out this way, I don't understand why.

We voted to protect our interests, they are simply following suit.

Tbh, I think it's more of a negotiating stance - our gov needs to get it's act together and decide where our alliances lie. We can't be best buds with US and EU and China etc, that's not how it works and the EU was making this clear.

Plus, I think they've now withdrawn this anyway?

Brexit will still hit us very hard, but yesterday's actions were not those of a trustworthy partner. I actually think the EU might have finally found a way to heal some of the rifts from 2016.

It’s hard to know exactly what’s going on behind the scenes. The vaccines are like oil in the 20th century or water in the 25th. The EU will consider vaccine exports a matter of the security of the whole bloc.

But it was interesting to see the Remainers (I voted Remain but am not ‘a Remainer’ as I accept Leave won) all freaking out about Johnson’s decision not to join the EU procurement scheme, when actually they didn’t know what they were talking about and it was a total shambles.

They haven't withdrawn the sinister 'notification' nonsense. No vaccine company in the world is yet manufacturing at full capacity, so no contract for the EU or us will be completely met.

Of course you were, dear.

Because our Tory Government have proved themselves to be so trustworthy ? Brexiteers were sold a total economic disaster based on lies.

Why did we think for one minute that the EU would give a shiny shit about the UK after the way we have treated them and what we have said about them?

YANBU. You are entitled to any opinion you want

Boris Johnson's covid record is shameful. He has caused tens of thousands of deaths by trying to save Christmas.

But he put the right people and money behind vaccines. The EU messed it up.

I’m a leaver, from my point of view I believed it was best to leave and I’m glad we have.

Now this has happened with the vaccine though that doesn’t mean IT WAS the right decision to leave. We just got lucky with this.

There is going to be bad things that come up in the future which would make leaving a mistake.

No one has ever “left” before. There will be pros and cons, you have to take the rough with the smooth and right now it’s smooth, which is nice, for the U.K. as a whole.

This is the reality of being out of the EU. They will pursue the best interests of the EU of which we are not a part.

What makes you think we are 'trusted partners'? That's a bit naive. We're out in the cold. With our blue passports.

Boris Johnson's covid record is shameful. He has caused tens of thousands of deaths by trying to save Christmas.

Would people have stayed apart for Christmas if the rules had required it? I’m not sure. Just as I’m not sure people would have complied with a summer lockdown when cases were low.

I genuinely do think Johnson is doing his best. I’m not sure Starmer’s record would be better and I vote Labour.

I was on the fence. But now definitely glad we left. I’ve been reading the other threads and I can’t believe how some people are trying to justify the EUs actions. It’s like listening to Lord Haw Haw... EU calling Eu calling...

I used to live in the EU, I have friends in Germany, Denmark, Holland and Sweden. I see the rioting already, and the EU proving that being unaccountable to the electorate can only lead to one thing. I hope it implodes gracefully without loss of lives. I just cannot see how the EU can behave like this and not see how the world is watching and businesses must be quietly thinking about how good for business the EU is if they are so willing to publish confidential contracts. I was pretty sure our government would be the first to break the brexit agreement, yet it is the EU who created ROI/NI border fiasco LESS THAN A MONTH later.

I hope president Biden does something positive to calm this down.

What do Macron and Merkel have to say over the debacle? They are very quiet are they distancing themselves from the EU too?

I am by no means a supporter of our governments response to the pandemic. They deserve to scrutinised and held accountable for failures. But at least we get vote them all out at the GE. This is what my father had been going on about for years and I think I owe him an apology, because I thought he was just using it as a weak excuse to justify Brexit.

Welcome to the club. I'm hoping someone will open the Brexit Arms again so all the new folk can gather and share a drink while we watch the EU car crash.

However well Brexit turns out, hardline remainers will never concede one single good thing came from it, even when some positives are glaringly obvious.

However shite it is, hardline Brexiteers will never admit all the negatives, no matter how fucked up things get.

The vast majority of others, who weighed up a difficult argument and made a decision based on what they thought was best, didn’t disown our family and friends who thought differently and then got on with our lives, can see both positives and negatives but have learned to stay the hell away from any sort of reasoned discussion on here.

You won’t get what your looking for on here OP.

@Whitecup4 have you read this. The U.K. vaccine success is far more than ‘luck’ and that attitude is doing a vast disservice to the many people involved.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2021/jan/29/we-had-to-go-it-alone-how-the-uk-got-ahead-in-the-covid-vaccine-race

It’s always been known that the EU is an awful neighbour if you aren’t part of it. That’s why neighbouring countries have always been desperate to be part of the club. When inside you are treated to many advantages, when outside you are not give a second thought. If you are outside and close by then it’s a very hard life.

It’s a reality hard to reconcile with the Remaniners’ image of the EU as a beacon of compassion, cooperation and inclusivity. But it’s a political reality. A trading block can only work if it fights hard for the rights of its members and puts those high above the needs of other states.

Everyone getting cross because the Eu threaten to invoke part of an international agreement. The same people had no problem at all with the British government threatening to break part of their international withdrawal agreement.

Yes I think you are right Whitecup4. This is just the first of countless arguments still to come. I don't think we can say it's just luck though, Kate Bingham has done a brilliant job.

after this i hope Scotland will never want to leave UK.

I don’t mean luck, I am very aware we actually do have world leading scientists and the tremendous work and effor that has gone into it.

I meant luck that having this has gone in our favour against the EU, and not for it.

I think Merkel is keeping her powder Dr, but Macron as lost the plot. He has started to smear the Astra vaccine in interviews today which is very worrying as France is so antivax.

@whitecup4 But the EU weren’t unlucky. They were incompetent.

@Mentum yes that is definitely sour grapes from Macron and a very dangerous thing for him to be saying and against the EMA approval too. What the hell is he thinking.

It’s so funny that because you speak negatively about the EU fuck up you have to preempt it be listing all the things you hate about Boris other wise you get posters jumping down your throat!

The EU fucked up massively then behaved an an embarrassingly up unprofessional way. Yes they have shown their true colours.

If we had still been in the EU we would not have had the millions of people in the U.K. already vaccinated, we would be suffocating in red tape.

I’m glad we left when we did! My granny has has both her jabs ☺️