To have become a Brexiteer yesterday?

[Mentum]

I was so Remain, I was devastated when we left. But the EU trying to steal our vac and casually invoking Article 16 has really left me aghast. I can't believe they are lashing out this way, I don't understand why.

I actually think the EU might have finally found a way to heal some of the rifts from 2016

I think you’re right @Mentum. I voted remain too and for the first time yesterday wondered whether Leave voters could have been right.

As a remain voter I've been gradually sliding towards the brexit position through all their behaviours over negotiations and was appalled by yesterday.

I think I'd vote to remain outside the EU in a future referendum now.

@redsquirrelfan I don’t think that those four countries willingly ‘chose’ to relinquish the negotiations to the EU and they certainly won’t ‘choose’ if in the same situation again. Germany has already gone outside and done its own deals after seeing the shitshow.

@Emeraldshamrock
I did feel for the UK initially with Brexit

No you didn't. Judging by your name you've got a massive chip on your shoulder that results in slavish support of the EU. I know because I've got plenty in my own family coming at it from the exact same angle, my dad included 😏

I accidentally hid the poll and now I can't see what the vote is. Plops.

[quote Mistigri]@Blessex

C'mon. Why was the U.K. govt absolutely insistent on a hard-as-nails Brexit? Because they don't want to be tied by EU rules of food, environmental and employment standards in future trade deals.

We've already had talks just this week of a review of worker rights (back-pedalled for now). You can google yourself, but you don't refuse to sign up to a minimum set of standards because you want to improve them (the way EU standards work, exceeding them is not an issue).[/quote]
One of the reasons I wanted to stay in the EU was employment rights. It was always one of the reasons many Tories didn't like EU membership because it meant they couldn't exploit the plebs even more than they were already.

I was just surprised that the review didn't start until about two weeks into January.

I think they'll do away with things like working time and rights for agency workers as soon as they can, but will keep other rights for at least a couple of years.

The very first thing the Coalition government did in 2010 was to say you had to be employed for two years rather than one, before you could bring a claim for unfair dismissal. And that was with the Libdems tagging along.

[quote CrotchBurn]@Emeraldshamrock
I did feel for the UK initially with Brexit

No you didn't. Judging by your name you've got a massive chip on your shoulder that results in slavish support of the EU. I know because I've got plenty in my own family coming at it from the exact same angle, my dad included 😏[/quote]
Wow
It would not occur to me to associate that beautiful username with politics!

There are so many good reasons for knowing that Brexit is very, very bad for the UK. One poor decision from the EU which they have quickly reversed does not change any of that.

My understanding is that member states could make their own arrangements but chose not to.

This is correct.

Except Hungary, which as I said has approved the Russian vaccine.

@Mistigri my DH is Dutch. The Dutch wanted to make their own deal with AZ and came very close to it. They didn’t ‘choose’ for the EU to take over and take 3 months longer.

If we had not had Brexit we’d still be waiting for a vaccine. You can’t deny that

Disagree.

The UK was never one to sign up for solidarity, rarely have, hence all our opt outs.
We would still have insisted on doing our own vaccine procurement program, esp on the back of the PPE debacle throughout europe.

We would have had more pressure to share in our good fortune but thats not a bad thing.

Ireland ‘chose’ to order the AZ jab in advance of the EMA approval and were told no they couldn’t by the EU.

@Arobase

There are so many good reasons for knowing that Brexit is very, very bad for the UK. One poor decision from the EU which they have quickly reversed does not change any of that.

Yes. Although it is astonishing that they even mooted it as a possibility.

And lets not forget there are millions of EU citizens in the UK (not including NI). They seem quite happy for them to die/get ill from lack of vaccine because they're not residing in an EU member state?

@Emeraldshamrock

This is only the start of the tug of war congratulations to the UK for the successful vaccine it is unfortunate they couldn't share when the EU snoozed on ordering. I did feel for the UK initially with Brexit now they have the power the colours show. The future recession is more worrying they UK and EU are acting like powerful spoilt DC/divorce 💑 when the relationship breaks.

If the UK's procurement process had failed and the EU's succeeded would the EU have charitably shared out supplies? I think not. All of those European politicians complaining about a lack of 'solidarity', where was Germany's solidarity when it blocked the export of PPE to Italy?

The UK has not shown any colours. Our leaders have maintained a diplomatic silence on this while the EU squabbles with AZ.

Love how this vote is exactly the same split as the referendum!

@Bluethrough we would still be waiting for the vaccine and watching France and Germany taking the doses ahead of the U.K.

We just got lucky with this.

Yes.
99 out of 100 decisions Johnson and the government make are bloody awful. One just happens to work out. Pure chance. They’re still generally incompetent.

@UntamedWisteria

Love how this vote is exactly the same split as the referendum!

Oh thanks, that answers my question.

But OP they have reversed that decision so you can revert to be a remainer again

If the UK's procurement process had failed and the EU's succeeded would the EU have charitably shared out supplies? I think not. All of those European politicians complaining about a lack of 'solidarity', where was Germany's solidarity when it blocked the export of PPE to Italy

Didn't Germany take in a lot of Italian patients when Italy was on its knees? And from France?

And sent equipment to the UK (or at least offered to, it might have been that our government said no at the time)

@ParlezVousWronglais except this isn’t luck.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2021/jan/29/we-had-to-go-it-alone-how-the-uk-got-ahead-in-the-covid-vaccine-race

@Mistigri

If we had not had Brexit we’d still be waiting for a vaccine. You can’t deny that.

Nope, wrong on all counts.

Everything the U.K. has done in terms of accelerate emergency approvals could have been done within the EU. Hungary - an EU member - has given authorisation to the Russian vaccine.

When we were members we were good little Europeans. We might have complained a lot but we always followed everything to the letter. Had we remained, a government led by the likes of Cameron or Starmer would have gone along with the European procurement. Hungary is run by a populist leader with little regard for the rules.

@DdraigGoch When we were members we were good little Europeans. We might have complained a lot but we always followed everything to the letter. Had we remained, a government led by the likes of Cameron or Starmer would have gone along with the European procurement. Hungary is run by a populist leader with little regard for the rules.

Bang on. And more eloquently explaining what I was struggling to.

@CrotchBurn

Emeraldshamrock
I did feel for the UK initially with Brexit

No you didn't. Judging by your name you've got a massive chip on your shoulder
Wow that is some leap on the username showing true madness there.