To start a new conspiracy theory thread

[Sbowiegirl]

Loved the last one!

Another weird little fact. The technology to clone human beings exists. Rh- cannot be cloned. I have no idea why.

There IS something very different about the lack of rhesus protein. I don't pretend it is special or alien or god like. I don't believe any of those things.

Yeah, maybe it is just a random outlier.

Anyway, once upon a time Hillsborough was a big conspiracy. Until it wasn't. We are lied to constantly.

@TravellingTilbury

Has anyone read the book 'Beyond a Pale Horse' by William Cooper (I think)? I have seen it referenced and it sounds interesting but it is hard to find a copy. The 1991 copies are even harder to find (and more expensive).

I haven't read it yet but it is always mentioned by some artists I follow. Soundcloud link for the audio: m.soundcloud.com/wre-4270911/behold-a-pale-horse-audiobook Might also be a copy on the Internet archive : archive.org/search.php?query=Behold%20a%20pale%20horse Another good book is Dark Alliance by Gary Webb, Blurb: Gary Webb was American investigative journalist, Pulitzer prize winner. He examined origins of the crack cocaine trade in Los Angeles and claimed that members of the anti-communist Contra rebels in Nicaragua had played a major role in creating the trade, using cocaine profits to support their struggle. He also suggested that the Contras may have acted with the knowledge and protection of the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Webb was found dead in his home on December 10, 2004, with two gunshot wounds to the head. His death was ruled a suicide by the Sacramento County coroner's office. After a local paper reported that he had died from multiple gunshots, the coroner's office received so many calls asking about Webb's death that Sacramento County Coroner issued a statement confirming Webb had committed suicide. In the "Dark Alliance", drawing from the newly declassified documents, undercover DEA (Drug Enforcement Administration) audio and videotapes that had never been publicly released, federal court testimony, and interviews, Webb demonstrates how US government knowingly allowed massive amounts of drugs and money to change hands at the expense of communities."

@bottleofbeer

Another weird little fact. The technology to clone human beings exists. Rh- cannot be cloned. I have no idea why.

There IS something very different about the lack of rhesus protein. I don't pretend it is special or alien or god like. I don't believe any of those things.

Yeah, maybe it is just a random outlier.

Anyway, once upon a time Hillsborough was a big conspiracy. Until it wasn't. We are lied to constantly.

I agree that we are lied to a lot. The Hillsborough tragedy and subsequent cover up had a big impact on me. Human error is terrible but understandable. Covering up is unforgivable.

Thank you @BelleHathor.

I'm sorry TravellingTilbury, it was horrific and apparently we don't even know the full extent yet. A woman from the justice campaign gave us a talk in uni but couldn't say too much as the case was ongoing (and he got away with it again) she told us that if there were real convictions she would come back and tell all. Obviously she can't do that now.

Re the Titanic: I read that fires in the coal bunkers of steamships were normal, and they were designed with this in mind. I remember watching a docco that presented this as a big revelation. It wasn't able to show how a bunker fire caused the ship to sink. Apparently the inquest didn't talk about the fire.. big cover up .... Yeah, except that's perhaps because the inquest thought it entirely unimportant.

@bottleofbeer - PLEASE just read this article. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK2269/

@ThumbWitchesAbroad

I read that article - I always just thought blood was red!
There's obviously a bit more to it.

Yep. Hillsborough, Gosport, Contaminated Blood Inquiry - as @bottleofbeer mentions, we get lied to a lot and it usually takes an unofficial 30-year rule to be observed for the truth to come out, even if it ever does. Paedophilia in the Church, both CoE and Roman Catholic, both in Rep or Ireland and the UK, is another one. Also in various football clubs, of course.

It's not just mistakes being made, not even just the cover up. It's the tone of sheer vindictiveness and vilification directed at those who've been wronged. It's the fact that anyone making the case on their behalf will be made to feel not just wrong or misguided but as if they're some wicked riff-raff - and this continues right up to the wire when the Prime Minister - usually some posh boy - stands up in Parliament and proclaims that a wrong has been done.

On top of that, there's the fact that nobody - I mean nobody is held to account in any way, nobody is fined or does jail time.

On the subject of Hillsborough, btw, it's usually made out that Kelvin Mackenzie behaved like a jerk in running the story about unproven allegations of Liverpool fans at Hillsborough, and that The Sun paid the price in lost sales in the area subsequently.

I now take a different view. The Sun was more likely directed to put that story out to cover up for the negligence of South Yorkshire Police on the day. It's a classic misdirection ruse, used in so many other areas where victim-blaming can be utilised. The idea is, you're meant to think, well, who cares what happened to them? They sound like scum and had it coming. Victim-blaming is State protocol.

There's been mention of Madelaine McCann on this thread. Well, the mods needn't be alarmed at my mention. The first week the press didn't have it in for the inept Portuguese police was the first week said police put it about that the parents might have been culpable. And as they were the police, they got believed wholesale.
Same strategy with Milly Dowler's family - her death actually occurred because of the ineptitude of Surrey Police. So it's only natural and state protocol that after she dies, they tried to put her dad in the frame for the murder, and only began to focus on Levi Bellfied - the actual killer - with some reluctance after the Met got involved.
I've experienced this shabby Surrey strategy myself after I took one of their care homes that nearly killed my Mum to the local press - Social Services went to task and declared war on me, using my elderly mother who by now was at another care home - the Reigate Beaumont - as bait. It took me ages to figure out it was them behind it, because they pretend to be your new best friends and all that.

So re Caroline Flack - and again, this isn't a massive conspiracy allegation, just the way it works - we are asked to believe that it was a former partner of a Met officer who emailed the picture of her blood-soaked flat to The Sun! And not just the Met itself, in return for a tasty fee. Because Met officers are always emailing pictures of a crime scene to their former partners, aren't they? I mean, most of us would settle for a note of apology and a bouquet of flowers.
That led to her suicide. It's likely both the Met and the CPS wanted to go ahead and prosecute this celebrity case because of the kick-backs they'd get from The Sun - that's just how it works.

That may also be the reason they went after Paul Gambaccuni, Lord Bramell and Sir Cliff Richard - not just that these unfounded allegations v possibly were misdirection to distract from more credible allegations of a State-run grooming racket in Manchester, Rotherham, Rochdale, Telford and Oxford over several decades utilising local Social Services and in tandem with the local police (all this is in the public domain, the press just hasn't made a narrative out of it), but also because celebrity stories in the press mean someone gets their palm greased. Ker-ching!

If anyone's interested, Vice have just put out a three part docuseries about the Qanon thing - watched it last night.

Very interesting, but alas we don't know who Q is yet .... some credible theories though.

They interviewed a former CIA intelligence officer who begs the question of the definition of intelligence, and Congressman who found himself being described as a devotee of Big Foot Erotica by people who missed the point of a book he wrote examining why Big Foot is a phenomenon, not the veracity of the myth, spectacularly.

Best quote was while they were interviewing a woman at a pro Trump rally, who was being urged not to sign a release form for said interview, the doubter pretty much said:

"It's Vice, don't do it, you'll be a meme by morning"

Anyway, hope it may interest some other "conspiracy analysts" out there

Another film for conspiracy type stuff - dark waters with Mark ruffallo. It’s quite slow but very good. I think it was the same producer as spotlight (though I think spotlight was a better movie. Dark waters is quite slow).

On thé question à PP had further up thread about why these conspiracies tend to have an anti Semitic element, there was an article the other day in relation to the US senator. The explanation is that once you start believing conspiracies that there is some shadow elite controlling the world, it’s only a few clicks on google before you start getting to all the old school anti-Semitic conspiracies like the protocols of the elders of Zion etc. These myths (lies) have a tendency to stick around, even though they have been disproven multiple times. The whole thing now from QAnon about celebrities stealing baby blood is so close to the old blood libel which dates back to the 12th century. Protocols of the elders of Zion has been proven to have been written by the tsarist police but it’s still circulating and believed. I remember when I was at university in the early 2000s it did the round of the NUSA conference one year. My friend and I had to send our local NUSA rep references in history books (eg A People’s Tragedy by Orland Figés) to show that it is known by historians to have been fabricated (full disclosure, I was a history student so that was also just what I did. Make people read history books).

One book I thoroughly recommend on Conspiracy Theories is The Mammoth Book of Cover-Ups; The 100 Most Disturbing Conspiracies of All Time by Jon E. Lewis.

Of course, the title begs the question - what's the difference between a cover-up and a conspiracy? Because the former is totally commonplace among all manner of public bodies - local authorities, for instance - and no big deal at all, while a 'conspiracy' suggests fanciful, large-scale unproven allegations.

Anyway, this book runs through over a 100 conspiracies or the like, everything from 'Alien Abudctions' to 'Chemtrails' and 'Chappaquidick' and 'Chechen Bombings'... though to 'Titanic', 'Watergate' and 'Malcolm X'...

What's good about this book is that it's written with a discerning eye. Each one comes with an 'Alert' rating from 0-10, basically suggesting how credible each one really is, 0 being crazy batshit, 10 being proven. After a while one finds oneself hurriedly checking out the rating at the end... There are some oddities - the Holocaust deniers get a big fat zero (fine by me) but then Nazi Moon Base gets 1 out of 10. Well, don't get me wrong but I'm not sure that the idea the Nazis managed to build an actual moon base in the dying days of World War II is 10 per cent more plausible than the Holocaust never happening, still it's a matter of degrees I suppose.

He also goes easy on the Freemasons, giving them the brush off to the point where you might think, okay, why are they getting off so lightly? Was this whole book sponsored by the Masons as an elaborate ruse! lol

The book was written in 2007 so is way out of date. There's no mention of well-documented proven cover-ups such as Hillsborough, Gosport, the Contaminated Blood Scandal, paedophilia in the Church, or the UK grooming gangs that were State-authorised via local police and local authorities. You get the impression these kind of things are overlooked because they do pretty much give an idea of just how corrupt the State is and has been, rather than escapist conjecture.

Oh, and sorry, that suggestion was for @TravellingTilbury !

Very interesting and thanks for all the suggestions. I've got a lot of reading to do! Absolutely agree with your earlier points Newspaper Taxis.

Interestingly, my mum was and eldest daughter is Rh - and I have funny anti-e not d, antibodies in my blood. DD has had to have attention after each of her pregnancies, and mine with her was very closely monitored. My next two were less monitored as the anti-es had got less. I have never been able to understand any of it!

i know im not allowed to go into it but

madeleine mccann

jill dando-none of it made sense

After watching the keepers on Netflix , There are some similarities between Jill Dando and the murder of Cathy Cesnik. I’m not suggesting they are linked, But they both were murdered just as they were about to blow the whistle on child abuse.

Well, I don't know, is there any actual evidence that Jill Dando was going to blow the whistle on child abuse? Or am I opening a can of worms here?

If she were, wouldn't she have left notes and so on? Research? Did all that get stolen by the police?

I like the conspiracy theory that hot dog and hot dog bun manufacturers are in cahoots. One sold in packs of 8, the other packs of 12, so you always have some left over and have to buy more of the other.

The US presidency is now predetermined to give each party eight years in power. But the (hidden) powers that be can override this rule in the event someone proves unsuitable. That's why Bush got in in 2000, despite all the wrangling, because it was their turn. That's why Obama got in, it was the Democrats' turn. It's why Trump beat Clinton in 2016 despite almost nobody thinking he was a better candidate, and why Trump still believes he won in 2020. It was still the Republicans' turn, he was promised victory. Had he been a "normal" president he would have won, votes would have been found that supported him. It was just the elite who truly control things found him too unstable and so brought the Democrats in four years early.

I also think some mass shootings - not all, and I'm not even sure which ones - are probably staged or at least exaggerated to bring in tighter gun controls. But I'm willing to accept that this theory is more that I can't fathom the motives and justifications people fool themselves with to think carrying out such an act is acceptable.

That last part also explains why some people think 9/11 was faked (I don't). It's just incomprehensible that people would be stupid enough to even believe such an attack was a good idea, let alone to then go through with it.

No, Barry George wasn't guilty, I read a book about it. The police pinned the crime on him because of public pressure for a conviction. Let's face it, Jill Dando was in the public eye and played a high profile role in bringing dangerous criminals to justice. The murder appeared at the time to be a professional hit and I still think that's a real possibility.

So, not a conspiracy, just an unsolved murder.

Interesting, that post I was responding to was deleted. I expect mine will be too now. I don't understand why, though?

@ Mittens030869 no I don’t understand why either.

There was a documentary on this a few years ago, after the conviction was quashed, and the police officer interviewed maintained that he believed the individual to be guilty. If that is said on public television - on the bbc then I fail to see why a post about it would be removed.