AIBU to think women should not be banned from Social media for asking the question

[Angryresister]

Many women have been suspended from sm for asking the question:
“Do you believe that male sexed people should be allowed access to changing rooms and showers for female sexed people and teenagers?”
Seems like a perfectly reasonable question which we should be allowed to ask

If you think that women aren’t being silenced - think again. This is happening it’s insidious and it’s real. We are not even being allowed to debate.

Scottish government national advisory council on women and girls

She asked for impact assessments of policies affecting women and girls

How dare she. The very cheek of her

Get out you bad woman

Once one realises that over 90% of Transwomen
choose to keep their penis and testicles

The whole inclusive argument rather falls apart.

Ok so we can’t have a discussion

Oh, the discussion is well and truly alive. Have you missed the previous 27 pages?

@WeatherwaxOn

It is a valid question. But.... What if the male sexed person has undergone various hormonal treatments and surgery to make them as physically close to a female sexed person as possible? Someone who genuinely lives their life as female. Where should they go? What facilities should they use?

The mens' room.

I've asked Fembot four polite questions so far and they haven't had the courtesy to reply. You can have a discussion with me, fembot! I am actually really hoping that someone can explain this to me so am up for good-faith debate. I've been wanting someone to change my mind on this as it's uncomfortable being on the unfashionable side. Perhaps you have the answers?

fembot123 If you choose to believe something provably false I don't think there's any point you taking part in the discussion.

@NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace

Dick

You should have your own show, mate!

What’s the matter with you @DeaconBoo, I don’t owe you anything. Can you see how many posts have been directed at me, god forbid I miss one. I don’t believe that an individual who identifies as a woman would go through the hell of not fitting in anywhere, confusion, abuse physical and verbal, hormone therapy and potentially surgery just to rape someone in a toilet. I have been roundly set upon on this thread for not having the same stance as most and it’s sad that we can’t have a discussion without abuse being hurled. I’m 😱 about this.

@Fembot123

That is not the same thing at all *@Winesalot* 🤷‍♀️ I’m not suggesting just letting men in but in my opinion trans women are women so should use the women’s toilets.

I noted this back further in this thread. There is a study that followed transwomen and transmen after transition and the transwomen still committed crimes at a rate closer to males than females.

Plus, if you look at the prisoner statistics, it shows a very high rate of transwomen prisoners are presently incarcerated for sex offences. Including child sex abuse. This is at a much higher rate than women.

People have also posted other links that pull apart these statistics or list the crimes.

Have a read of this thread too. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3348290-It-will-never-happen-resource-thread

It you have evidence that transwomen take on the female rate of crime, particularly for sex offences, I would be very interested in seeing this.

Otherwise, why do you think that males who identify as women only commit crimes of women and at the same rate as women? And what changes happened to make this so.

Sorry quoted the wrong poster.

@Impatiens

fembot123 If you choose to believe something provably false I don't think there's any point you taking part in the discussion.

This is in no way a discussion.

@Fembot123

That is not the same thing at all *@Winesalot* 🤷‍♀️ I’m not suggesting just letting men in but in my opinion trans women are women so should use the women’s toilets.

What makes a trans woman a woman? Saying 'I am a woman'? What is your definition of a woman?

Thanks @Winesalot, I will.

So you are unable to answer how you differentiate between a trans woman and a man, fembot, yet think there should be some magic law that does this.

Nothing is the matter with me - I'm ignoring your rudeness because I'm wondering if you are up to discuss the questions I've asked you. I'm not going to insult you. I'm just curious how you manage to reconcile not knowing the difference between men and trans women and yet thinking they should be treated differently.

I’ve already answered that @DancingLady

This is in no way a discussion.

You don't believe in discussion, you only want adherence to the dogma.

@ListeningQuietly

Once one realises that over 90% of Transwomen choose to keep their penis and testicles

The whole inclusive argument rather falls apart.

HOLYYYYY SHIT! Is it 90%? I'm shocked. I can't actually put into words how shocked I am. This is why debates shouldn't be shut down.

@Fembot123

I just don’t understand why anyone thinks a male/female designation on a toilet door would deter a would be rapist.

Many crimes are opportunistic.

There is a concept in safeguarding known as the Swiss Cheese analogy.

The idea being that good safeguarding is achieved via many different layers. Once you start to remove some of those layers then holes start to appear.

So the first layer would be a sign on the door that clearly indicates female only. This makes a male person entering conspicuous.

The second layer would be the social agreement than males don't go into a female space. Most people understand this and any male entering such a space might be asked by others what they are doing.

The third layer would be the ability for a woman or girl to call for assistance or report a male person hanging about in the female facilities.

The final layer is the fear of arrest and prosecution if found to be committing a crime in a female space.

This is how safeguarding works. Will it work 100% of the time? No but it's better than no protection at all.

Currently those campaigning under the guise of trans rights have managed to obliterate the first three layers of protection mentioned above so the remaining layer is looking very holey and not terribly robust.

They've managed to make it so the questioning of any male person hanging around a female facility is frowned upon and possibly a prosecutable offence because 'we can't know someone's gender identity just by looking at them'.

This is why it's a problem and it starts with taking away the signage.

@Fembot123, I also missed your answer - how do you define a woman outside of biology? What time stamp is your post, or c and p please .

@Impatiens

This is in no way a discussion.

You don't believe in discussion, you only want adherence to the dogma.

I really don’t, I’ve taken on board other points of view from posters who have framed it politely and as counterpoints but not the opinions of others who have just told me I’m stupid and shouldn’t be allowed an opinion.

I don’t believe that an individual who identifies as a woman would go through the hell of not fitting in anywhere, confusion, abuse physical and verbal, hormone therapy and potentially surgery just to rape someone in a toilet.

Many a times this has been said about other groups of abusers too. Please note, our concerns are with all males. Not any particular subset of males (ie. this is not specifically about transwomen). I have not seen any evidence that other subsets of males have stopped committing crimes at the same rate or similar kinds as other males. Therein lies the problem. How can a woman or a child tell which males are the nice people in the toilets vs the ones you have to watch out for.

And why are we telling our children that they should lower their boundaries for a subset of males (who it has not been proven are less prone to committing crimes as males are) ?

@Fembot123

I’ve already answered that *@DancingLady*

Have you? Can you forward to me please? What's a woman? I missed your answer.

Thanks @OvaHere, that’s actually helpful and interesting.

Previously the church or monarchy were the moral guardians of which views were acceptable, in the Europe anyway, then governments took on most of that roll

Well Governments didn't really take on that role, not in modern democracies. (Until this recent debate, Canada I am looking at you). But you make a good point that Twitter is acting more like the censoring role that the Church used to have. And that's not a good thing, is it? People are right to be concerned about that regression and to want to fight back against it.