To think remainers should have got behind mays deal

[Mysusie]

Just that really. Surely it would have been better to support a moderate brexit that she offered rather than supporting extreme positions such as that if the Lib Dem’s. Aibu to think it was an error not to sign up the the chequers deal?

Hear, hear!

The only people to blame for this shitshow are those who voted for it and those who instigated it

THIS a million times over. This is your doing, Tories and Leave voters. Every poor business who is floundering, every industry which is failing, every person who is or will struggle due to Brexit. This is all on you. You owned your “win”, you’d better step up now and own your incredible fail.

But because of the refusal to any compromise on the remain side it fed straight into Boris and ERG hands.

Nonsense. Remain opposed May’s WA because it was an open door for her ERG successor to do precisely what Johnson has done. Had May’s WA gone through the deal would always have ended up where we are now - as the ERG were planning to ditch the NI backstop once they got May’s successor into power.

In fact that they wanted was a managed No Deal/Aus rules but were turned down by the EU, and with Trump out of power the had no support from the US. The ERG has unrealistic fantasies of ditching the EU completely and getting a fast deal with Trump.

All Remainers could do is fight for sanity until the last moment to give Parliament and the populace the chance to come to their senses. Which they could have done. Things could have been different. If our populace were not so thick and are MPs so pusillanimous. It was not inevitable that we ended up in economic quicksand.

are

Our.

But because of the refusal to any compromise on the remain side it fed straight into Boris and ERG hands.

There was never any chance of a "compromise" and it's fucking gaslighting to pretend there was. SO fuck off with that too. If there had been a cross party parliamentary committee appointed to look into making Brexit work for everyone, then it's possible that remainers could have fucked things up. But as things were WE WERE NEVER ASKED. Not once. Despite numerous suggestions, offers and pleas- particularly over Northern Ireland.

But no. It had to be a Tory Brexit. And that is what you got.

And in an even worse outcome for leavers, the further we get from what is already being called "Bidet" (as it's only just about fit to wash your arse in) the more people will grow up saying "Mum/Dad. You know that momentous decision the UK took in 2016 that affected every single blade of grass in the Kingdom ? Why did only one side ever get to decide for everyone ?"

Tory Brexit - your Brexit. You own it.

Not sure it it's the slow emergence of the US from their four years of stupor that highlights just how shit things are going here, but if it was possible I might be more cross than a year ago.

@unmarkedbythat

But because of the refusal to any compromise on the remain side

Oh, bollocks, there was plenty of openness to compromise on the Remain side. It wasn't the leavers supporting or proposing the various "Brexit but without making it into a total clusterfuck" options mooted- Common Market 2.0, remain in SM, remain in CU, etc, was it?

Stop trying to make us take responsibility for your fuck ups, for goodness sake. We didn't want this, ask for it, vote for it, elect people who wanted to enact it. We argued against it. You cannot now tell us that it is our fault. You lot knew what you were voting for! You won, get over it.

Err - pretty sure we are over it. It's Remoaners that keep bringing it up and weeping and wailing - just like this thread, yet again.

Happy to own it. So far so good!

It's Remoaners that keep bringing it up and weeping and wailing - just like this thread, yet again

The OP doesn’t read like a poster who voted remain?

And no weeping or wailing either

Yes - show me a remainer who would not have compromised on soft Brexit?

MPs took an indicative vote on soft Brexit options and there was not sufficient support in Parliament.

The country was rail-roaded into hard Brexit by a bunch of dim-witted head banger hard righters with help from Lexit MPs.

It represents a failure of our democratic system that Remain simply did not have sufficient representation in our primary democratic institution.

Err - pretty sure we are over it. It's Remoaners that keep bringing it up and weeping and wailing - just like this thread, yet again.

Happy to own it. So far so good!

You’re not happy to answer my question on your plans for addressing the almighty ness numerous industries are now in due to Brexit.

If you fuck up trade and the economy, if you take away peoples’ rights - all whose lives have been touched by your stupidity will have something to say about it - that’s not ‘wailing’ it’s fury.

@TatianaBis

Err - pretty sure we are over it. It's Remoaners that keep bringing it up and weeping and wailing - just like this thread, yet again.

Happy to own it. So far so good!

You’re not happy to answer my question on your plans for addressing the almighty ness numerous industries are now in due to Brexit.

If you fuck up trade and the economy, if you take away peoples’ rights - all whose lives have been touched by your stupidity will have something to say about it - that’s not ‘wailing’ it’s fury.

You're right - I'm not going to sit here and answer all your what if doomsday scenarios. It's currently working - am sure there will be bumps in the road but we got that as part of the EU too. At least we can now fix the bumps ourselves.

It represents a failure of our democratic system that Remain simply did not have sufficient representation in our primary democratic institution.

It's so much worse than that. Now it's been established that .000001% is enough for a majority, lets wait and see what other decisions can be made for a "majority". My betting is why do women need a vote ? After all if 51% of the population are men - that's a majority isn't it ?

I welcome a rebuttal to that which isn't a variant on "don't be silly". Because "being silly" a year ago would be to suggest the president of the united states would suggest taking bleach to cure a virus. And since we crossed that Rubicon, nothing can ever be discounted as being silly ever again.

Remember I type this in country where a member of Parliament has stated that fish are happier because of Brexit. So you lose your "don't be silly pass" ages ago ....

Leavers should have held a follow-up referendum of May’s deals vs remain in the EU. Then remainers and leavers would have had an opportunity to vote on that deal based in its merits.

You're right - I'm not going to sit here and answer all your what if doomsday scenarios. It's currently working - am sure there will be bumps in the road but we got that as part of the EU too. At least we can now fix the bumps ourselves.

I’m not talking about ‘doomsday scenarios’ I’m talking about current fuck ups: fishermen going out of business, farming losing its primary funding in 3 years, financial services having no passporting, the loss of £6 billion per day trading in EU stocks etc - what are you personal plans to fix all of these?

Not to mention - what will personally do to address my loss of rights to FOM and move easily to France? How will you fix that Mrs Doyle?

I was absolutely devastated that the vote was to leave. However, I was firmly in the camp of if that's what you want crack on. I was not anything to do with it. To now blame Remainers is absurd.

Bloody stupid remainers wanting to keep the status quo. Obviously our fault and sweet FA to do with the swivel eyed loons in Leave. How's the fish and turnips going? Everyone happy now?

@TatianaBis

Not to mention - what will personally do to address my loss of rights to FOM and move easily to France? How will you fix that Mrs Doyle?

I don't need to! It's not my job to! It's what the majority of people who voted for in the referendum chose. As a famous singer once said, you can't always get what you want. Loser's consent.

Ok, so you admit to all the problems, and yes of course you can't fix them yourself. How do you think broken Brexit can be fixed, or are you too selfish to care?

There's a difference between consenting, that is accepting the democratic vote and its consequences, and silencing oneself to the point where one is pretending to agree with the 'winners'.

This is a democratic country sort of and so remainers have the right to express their displeasure at the way things are going right now. We do not have to 'get behind' anything. We never did. It would have made no difference anyway, since after the referendum all the decisions were made in Westminster.

So while remainers like me won't go out and set fire to things or riot, we will keep telling you 'Told you so' at every Brexit fuck-up that happens. Looks like we'll be busy.

I’m not saying it’s your job, I’m asking you how you would personally address the loss of fishing trade my loss of rights your vote has caused?

Presumably you have some idea, as no-one would be stupid enough to vote for something they couldn’t see a feasible way to make work would they?

Not "currently working" for these people is it Mrs. Doyle?

Jimmy Buchan, chief executive of the Scottish Seafood Association, said last week: "The industry in Scotland has basically ground to a halt, and businesses that employ hundreds of people in communities around our coastline are losing money. In some cases they are close to going under. It is time for our governments to get a grip of what is now a full-blown crisis."

@brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Leavers should have held a follow-up referendum of May’s deals vs remain in the EU. Then remainers and leavers would have had an opportunity to vote on that deal based in its merits.

What, like Jacob Rees Mogg suggested ?

@Jason118

Ok, so you admit to all the problems, and yes of course you can't fix them yourself. How do you think broken Brexit can be fixed, or are you too selfish to care?

Hmm - where do I "admit to all the problems"??? I've said there are a small number of bumps in the road. The ardent Remainers are the ones claiming there are all these problems. Maybe actually read what people say not what you want them to be saying.

@pointythings

There's a difference between consenting, that is accepting the democratic vote and its consequences, and silencing oneself to the point where one is pretending to agree with the 'winners'.

This is a democratic country sort of and so remainers have the right to express their displeasure at the way things are going right now. We do not have to 'get behind' anything. We never did. It would have made no difference anyway, since after the referendum all the decisions were made in Westminster.

So while remainers like me won't go out and set fire to things or riot, we will keep telling you 'Told you so' at every Brexit fuck-up that happens. Looks like we'll be busy.

Fill your boots. And we'll keep on with life, wondering why you are working yourself into such an unnecessary frenzy over something that was long ago decided by a democratic vote.

It is time for our governments to get a grip of what is now a full-blown crisis.

Past performance suggests he needs a Plan B.