When do we teach daughters to fight back?

[Jimbellselmbath]

Dd has been in trouble in school for "fighting"
She is 12 and a little skinny thing.
The other side was a boy, a school year older, taller and bigger, she said he has already turned 14. So nearer 2 years older.
He has history for attacking girls back to primary but his parents are very vocal and protective and their boy is an angel.
DD got the better of him in the "fight"
Dd said he started it and she finished it like we had always told her to do.
None of the above was disputed by either side.
DD was placed in isolation for a week although lockdown happened so she did 2 days. The boy got nothing although he was in school.
What has really riled me is the teacher was so bothered about her retaliating, that was the source of her punishment.
Having had time to think about it I am not happy.
So dd shouldn't retaliate? Should she do so when she's older?
If an older boy kicks her in the fanny on the bus, should she wait until the next day to report at school? What if he's not from the school? What about an adult? Should she sit quietly and take his abuse? At what age can a girl fight back? I want to go to his house but dd would die of shame
I have no faith in the school

The boy got nothing? Wtf?

Escalate.

I think she was right to defend herself.

By escalate I mean complain to the head, then the governors, then offsted.

The school want to teach her not to physically fight, hence the punishment. But if he started it, he should have got the same or worse than she did.

And fwiw I agree what she did was right...I'm just saying that's the school's perspective.

Kicks her in the fanny? Are you for real? Vile phrasing.

I'm interested in these conflicts too. IMO girls need to be able to defend themselves against male attack, there are no white knights around in dark alleys.

@Housebuyer2021

Kicks her in the fanny? Are you for real? Vile phrasing.

Yes he kicked her in the fanny, it was horribly bruised afterwards. I told the head of house and she said it wasn't appropriate to show her nor send photographs (understandably, I wouldn't take photographs but all communication was via telephone )

I think it's massively complex actually. She was lucky to 'get the better' of him in this situation, and I think we generally don't teach our daughters to fight back because it doesn't serve them well.

I think it might be worth having a chat with the pupil support lead, but also worth considering you don't have the whole story. My school certainly wouldn't share details of another's DCs punishment.

After spending years telling my daughter's to never start a fight but to defend themselves school have undone all my work.
My daughter retaliated to another girl kicking her but she ended up in trouble.
She has said next time she won't defend herself.
Absolutely fuming but the school is shit.

He kicked her in the vagina?
I would escalate this and threaten to involve the police, given he (sexually??) adulated her.

You are right to question why she is punished for defending her self and he is allowed to get away with it.

They should have both been trouble. Do school have a policy relating to behaviour, sanctions etc? They should. I’d check this and then use their policy to discuss your concerns.
I don’t think encouraging anyone to fight back is the best approach regardless of their sex.

I would actually escalate to police if a 14 yo kicked a 12 yo in the genitals.

Jesus where do you live? I have 2 girls younger one is 12 and never heard of them or any girl they know being physically attacked by anyone let alone a boy. I’d call the police tbh.

I have always taught my kids never to bully but if someone hits them then hit back hard.

Those saying she's wrong to fight back. She would have been scared and hurt and probably panicked. Why should she have sat there and taken it?

MsTSwift, goodness, where do you live?? I had to fight a few times as a teenager, and it does not seem rare now.

Can a teacher protect them 24 7, ? Only you know what's best op, but we all went through the system of schooling, we all know what school can be like

I would take school out of the equation and report him to the police for assault. I would report him every single time he laid a finger on her.

@LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett

I think it's massively complex actually. She was lucky to 'get the better' of him in this situation, and I think we generally don't teach our daughters to fight back because it doesn't serve them well.

I think it might be worth having a chat with the pupil support lead, but also worth considering you don't have the whole story. My school certainly wouldn't share details of another's DCs punishment.

His punishment was fairly obvious when he wasn't in the isolation room with dd but was in all normal lessons with another child from DDs primary whom she is still close to. DD knows that he has form as her new friends are from his old primary school.

@Housebuyer2021

Kicks her in the fanny? Are you for real? Vile phrasing.

Yes, it is horrible.

They need to stop treating it as a fight and treat it as sexual assault.
Generally it's fine to say be the bigger person and don't retaliate but if it involves the genitals it takes on a different aspect.

I was at a relatively rough comp myself and my two at girls only state school in south west not ever come across older boys punching girls no 🙄. Occasional fight between girls but unprovoked assault on a girl by an older boy is pretty serious. I would report to the police without hesitation.

She absolutely should have faught back. And you should have raised hell at the school. He kicked her so hard between the legs that he bruised her? I'd have called the police to the school tbh. He's 14 and that's serious assault.

She should fight back and you should cover her back like a rabid fucking wolf.

Schools always take action against those who retaliate, it's a way of containing possible fights, but the aggressor is punished more.

What happened to your daughter was terrible and you should take it up with the HT. It is possible that the boy was sanctioned, and you don't know what it was, as this would not be discussed with you.

Sorry for the phrasing, I am not English and we are based in Liverpool. That is what we call the area, fanny, genitals, whatever, you know what I mean

@Housebuyer2021

Kicks her in the fanny? Are you for real? Vile phrasing.

How should the OP have said this?