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AIBU?

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Original poster

When do we teach daughters to fight back?

353 replies

Jimbellselmbath · 16/01/2021 23:47

Dd has been in trouble in school for "fighting"
She is 12 and a little skinny thing.
The other side was a boy, a school year older, taller and bigger, she said he has already turned 14. So nearer 2 years older.
He has history for attacking girls back to primary but his parents are very vocal and protective and their boy is an angel.
DD got the better of him in the "fight"
Dd said he started it and she finished it like we had always told her to do.
None of the above was disputed by either side.
DD was placed in isolation for a week although lockdown happened so she did 2 days. The boy got nothing although he was in school.
What has really riled me is the teacher was so bothered about her retaliating, that was the source of her punishment.
Having had time to think about it I am not happy.
So dd shouldn't retaliate? Should she do so when she's older?
If an older boy kicks her in the fanny on the bus, should she wait until the next day to report at school? What if he's not from the school? What about an adult? Should she sit quietly and take his abuse? At what age can a girl fight back? I want to go to his house but dd would die of shame
I have no faith in the school

OP posts:
billy1966 · 17/01/2021 01:17

Something doesn't sound right OP.

You needto confirm the facts.

Ask your daughter to write out in bullet form exactly what happened.

Ring the school and ask what they think happened.

Inwould want to know exactly why she was punished for defending herself and he remained in class after the assault.

Why also were you not contacted immediately to inform you that she had been hurt.

What about their duty of care to your child who was hurt?

That sounds like a very painful assault.

If it's confirmed by the school that your daughter was assaulted then this is indeed a police matter.

I have never come across this but
he definitely reporting.

Flowers
Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 01:19

The first I knew was an email from a teacher I had never heard of. I didn't respond as I had not heard my dds side yet. When I picked her up, she told me her side. That was when I responded to the email, in the asda car park there and then. Teacher called back as we got home. DD disagreed with What she had said re the incident. I emailed the teacher back with my concerns but she didn't respond. D d kept in isolation. Boy not there. The picture of the bruise was taken 2 days later once it was black

OP posts:
LadyDique · 17/01/2021 01:22

Teacher called back as we got home. DD disagreed with What she had said re the incident

Ah. So you have received a different version of events from the school.

And what was that?

Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:23

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Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:25

@B33Fr33

I can well.imagine a 12 year old getting the better of a larger attacker. The attacker has probably very little expectation of defence because I imagine a lot of victims would be in a state of shock and perhaps is a lot of people's response. Also the victim would have a massive adrenalin response, she chose to use that. At 12 I had done 3 years of karate and i was no ninja but I did floor some fucker who went for me in a park, then ran with a speed I couldn't normally muster. Adrenalin is powerful. I'm glad she hurt him. Kick up an almighty stink on behalf of your daughter, every avenue should be explored. This boy is on a fairly dark path, already violently assaulting females at 14?!
Did you read the part where they were "pissing about" and DD got the better of him?

Can you picture a scenario where a child was able to kick the DD hard enough in that area in a fire alarm in front of a fully assembled group of staff and absolutely nothing was done?

You are projecting, big time.

Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 01:27

He wasn't in isolation with dd but afterwards dd found out he was in ordinary lessons along with her friends and was for the whole time as was in isolation

OP posts:
Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:28

@Jimbellselmbath

He wasn't in isolation with dd but afterwards dd found out he was in ordinary lessons along with her friends and was for the whole time as was in isolation
Mmm.

you've stil not addressed the point about the 2 and a half hour fire alarm where they all stood aside after DD was sexually assaulted enough to leave a boot mark and a bruise and nobody did anything.
It's not washing, OP.

Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 01:31

What am I to address? Fire alarm was during lunch, which finishes at 12.30 and they were still there at 3pm, home time

OP posts:
BaggoMcoys · 17/01/2021 01:31

Do you know what the teacher has said that differs from dd's version of events?

A 14 year old boy kicking a 12 year old girl in that area is very worrying. I'd want to know what action was being taken too. I would ask. I went to an all girl's school, but that doesn't sound like normal behaviour from him, especially with him being 2 years older - which can make a big physical difference at that age too!

LadyDique · 17/01/2021 01:32

So what did the teacher say happened op?

Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:34

@Jimbellselmbath

What am I to address? Fire alarm was during lunch, which finishes at 12.30 and they were still there at 3pm, home time
Right.

And in that two and a half hour period stood outside, for a fire alarm, the boy was able to kick DD so hard it bruised and bootprinted, in front of an assembled pitch of teachers, she fought back and got the better of him (even though you've admitted they were pissing around, so that's not him starting it) and not one member of staff dealt with this other than sending you an email, and then DD was put in isolation but the boy wasn't. Is that what we are supposed to believe?

You've said that they all agreed a version of events but you've now said DD doesn't agree with the version of events. Which is it?

Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:36

@BaggoMcoys

Do you know what the teacher has said that differs from dd's version of events?

A 14 year old boy kicking a 12 year old girl in that area is very worrying. I'd want to know what action was being taken too. I would ask. I went to an all girl's school, but that doesn't sound like normal behaviour from him, especially with him being 2 years older - which can make a big physical difference at that age too!

I imagine giving all Ops posts that whats actually happened is the two of them were arsing about, he's kicked/caught her in that area (it happens, OP said herself they were pissing about) she's "got the better of him", whatever that means, the boy will have been punished in some way for his mistake but DD was isolated due to her "getting the better of him". The teacher has claimed that DD was as much to blame as he was, and they've started this nonsense about a boot print and a bruise,

Would that be fair OP?

SheilaWilcox · 17/01/2021 01:40

There's a difference between defending yourself / keeping yourself safe and fighting back.

So in answer to your question, I would never teach anyone male or female to 'fight back,' because in my mind fighting isn't acceptable.

She was at school. The sensible thing to do would be to remove herself from the situation and alert an adult immediately.

Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 01:43

All pissing about as in the whole of the school. Teachers chatting.
Boy then kicked her in her privates, bruising her badly. She retaliated so much that he didn't fight back as he knew he'd picked on the wrong one.

No teachers outside saw anything, DD went in to report to a dinner lady (A neighbour of ours that she trusted) they then made teaching staff aware who brought the boy in and emailed me. They Kept her in at break (everybody else still outside) she was sent home at home time from inside the building, other pupils had not re entered the building since before lunch

OP posts:
Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 01:46

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Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 01:59

She punched him in the chest, kicked him in the balls, punched him in the face, knocking him down then while he was on the floor, she jumped on top of him and punched him repeatedly in his face.
Thank you for picking up on the fact that while the children were shivering on the games court for 2.5 hours due to the fire alarm, staff were going about their business inside the building nice and warm, I will mention that in my complaint as the email specifically states that she re entered the building and found a member of staff, I hadn't picked up on that. Good point. Thanks

OP posts:
Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 02:01

And not one teacher claims to have seen any of it. They must have been inside. Thank you I had not considered this at all

OP posts:
ZaraCarmichaelshighheels · 17/01/2021 02:03

@RoomOfRequirement

Kicks her in the fanny? Are you for real? Vile phrasing.

What's vile is that you're more offended by words than a 12 year old being assaulted and then the school being misogynistic in their handling of it. As always.

Exactly what I was about to post. OP she’s been assaulted, I would report to the police.
Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 02:05

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Italiangreyhound · 17/01/2021 02:09

OP based on what you have just said I would be careful how you proceed.

Her retaliation was quite a lot, maybe that was what she felt was necessary and I am no way in defending him for what he did. But I believe part of self defense is being able to get away. So if she could have got away and stayed to punch or kick him, this might be seen in a bad light. Again, I am not in anyway defending him.

Before involving the police I think you need to talk to her.

peoplesafe.co.uk/resources/blogs/what-counts-as-reasonable-force-when-defending-yourself/

Thanks
Original poster
Jimbellselmbath · 17/01/2021 02:12

She acted in self defence. What should she have done, gone back into the building to report the bully who is older, male and a foot plus taller to still have been reprimanded for entering an unsafe building (staff are fine in there though) and also made herself a target for the following term?

OP posts:
Italiangreyhound · 17/01/2021 02:12

I am assuming what you have posted is all true OP. If so, I do feel sorry for everyone in this situation.

If this is not all true, I'm not sure what has gone on or why you've posted it all.

Wheresmykimchi · 17/01/2021 02:12

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earthyfire · 17/01/2021 02:15

Schools usually do nothing about bullying until the bullied child retaliates and then THEY are the one who get into trouble. I've experienced it. My DD was kicked in her vagina by three boys in the year above, school told my daughter the witnessess had allegedly said "no one was hurt" well my daughter had been hurt, she had the bruises and the one who felt the pain. My 10 year old was then left feeling scared and unsupported. As the school did nothing, I let them known that I would be reporting it to the police and the police paid them a visit, the school then decided the matter was serious.

Italiangreyhound · 17/01/2021 02:15

Jimbellselmbath "What should she have done" I think she should have escaped him, and then reported it someone in authority and you by phone (assuming she has one).

For future situations, to engage with attacker to this extend could really put her in further danger. I think you need to talk to the school.

Good luck for you and her. I think I will leave the thread now, i haven't got anything else to add and I am so sorry for this situation. Leaving the children unattended in this way is 100% not acceptable.