to set a boundary with DH about yelling at our toddler?

[lapaverde]

My daughter is 1.5 years old, teething, and in a sleep regression - she is quite a handful to deal with at the moment, especially during lockdown as we both attempt to work full time and provide round the clock childcare. However, I am trying my best not to let her see my frustration or stress. My DH, on the other hand, has quite a temper. This has already caused conflict because he accuses me of being over-sensitive, but the issue I'm asking about concerns DD. The other day she was whining and DH wheeled on her and said, with fists clenched and in a sharp tone, 'Shut up!' She immediately started crying hysterically because we have never used that tone with her, ever.

I defused the situation but later, at a calm time, approached DH and said, "I know we are under a lot of stress and she can be frustrating, but you mustn't ever speak to her that way. It caused her a great deal of upset." He responded by: 1) accusing me of being unreasonable - 'all parents lose their temper,' and 2) holding him to a higher standard than I do myself. When I pointed out -accurately! - that I have never once raised my voice at her, he said, 'Well, you've made a long list of mistakes as a parent - shall I start elaborating them?'

I'm concerned because his reaction is so defensive. Surely he can see that it's not okay to frighten a toddler, no matter how difficult she's being! He claims he doesn't remember her crying, 'or if she was, who knows what it was about.' But I can't stop seeing her shocked little face right before she started to cry. DH is constantly harping about how I am conflict averse and can't deal with normal interaction - so AIBU here?

I can see how it happened (I have done similar on occasion) but the fact that he's defending his actions is unacceptable to me.

[quote MaMaD1990]@Cokie3 see you aren't reading properly and making things up to suit your argument. I didn't say she deserved anything, in fact I think I said she needs to tell him he needs to treat her with more respect and possibly put her leaving on the table. I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.[/quote]
You don't know that her tone is what has annoyed him

That, is very clear in it's insinuation. That her tone 'annoyed him' and thus justified his behaviour. What you said is more than clear.

Again, she tried to talk to him, he shut her down and he doubled down. It's clear that you either aren't reading properly and thus inventing a narrative and ignoring what she has said (ie she tried to talk to him) to suit your argument.

And again, I note you ignore him approaching the baby with fists clenched. Even putting aside how he treats the OP, that is justification in anyone's language to leave on the spot and seek refuge.

I have grave concerns about the dismissive advice on here so am going to approach mumsnet.

I’m not at all wanting to judge those who have lost their temper with their toddler but I can honestly say that neither me or DH have lost our cool with DS who is nearly two. He’s just too little.

We have a DD who is 5 and I’ve lost my cool with her on occasion. But not when she was tiny and didn’t understand what we needed her to do.

I’m not saying it’s ok to ever shout at a child but it feels so unnatural to me to do it when they are so small and I’ve never been driven to it (despite a very challenging second born).

The clenched fists and aggression sounds worrying. If it’s not the first time I think you may need to think about insisting he gets help and if you need to leave him.

Yes, i think most parents have shouted out of frustration, but if my DH clenched his fist in anger at myself or my child, i would be livid.

It is not ok if he gets that wound up.

I think its normal to get defensive about our mistakes but he must see this is a different scenario.

If he is an agressive or angry person he needs to seek help for this or been shown the door.

His reaction to you is concerning.

When you say his temper toward you has increased over the last year or so, do you mean since lockdown and stresses or since you were pregnant?

It’s not one I jump to often, but please be aware that a lot of domestic abuse does begin in pregnancy.

Please be careful

so he wants you to apoloigse for his outburst towards his child

nah

It seems that you're in an escalating situation that isn't good for you or your DD. Now he's trying to blame you for behaviour that he should be apologising for. Sod approaching him nicely, you tried that. You're getting into "If you react to me or our baby like that again we'll be talking about divorce".

Whenever a woman says her husband has "quite a temper", what she really means is that he's an abusive prick. Denial is a powerful thing.

It's not really possible for you to set a boundary about this without actually leaving the relationship.

Given your update that he shouts at you too, and his complete lack of remorse...

I'd leave.

I grew up in an abusive household. I will never accept abusive anger in my house.

Your husband is a wimp
He'd crap himself if format of a real man so makes himself feel better by abusing a little baby!

*front

People do snap when they're pushed to the limit. You'd be hard pushed to find a parent who hasn't snapped at some point. The thing is to learn from is and realise that you have reached a certain point and remove yourself (or in your case, your husband) from the situation.

I'd be more concerned about how he reacted when you calmly brought it up later on.

In the thread title, you mention 'yelling'. Further into the post, you say 'said...and in a sharp tone'.

Which one was it? Actual yelling or a raised voice?

@lapaverde

Some of these posts are massively over the top. It's really not going to help you.

I don't think you should shout at a toddler, but it happens, it's the first time he's done it & most people are massively stressed right now

You were incredibly patronising (I know you've owned up to that), it makes people defensive m, stop backing him into a corner about admitting he was wrong. He's not going to admit it now.

Clenching your fists helps you maintain control, it doesn't mean you're about to hit someone.

IF you aren't happy with his behaviour towards you? Then get him told. Don't be so conflict avoidant, that you get yourself wound up, then use DD as an excuse to deal with it.

@daisyjgrey

People do snap when they're pushed to the limit. You'd be hard pushed to find a parent who hasn't snapped at some point. The thing is to learn from is and realise that you have reached a certain point and remove yourself (or in your case, your husband) from the situation.

I'd be more concerned about how he reacted when you calmly brought it up later on.

Are you? Most people don't react well to being spoken to like a naughty toddler.

Speaking as a mother who gradually fell into the role of 'defusing situations' caused by a man who had a horrible temper, and whose children are still suffering as a result of my choice to do that and to plead with him in private to calm the fuck down, start dealing with this situation by telling your H to leave.

You can't control this and you won't be able to cure it. No amount of mopping up will be enough to prevent the damage he is doing.

A man who loses his temper as you have described at a baby of 1.5 years is dangerous.

I've just seen your post where H demands an apology from you.

You need to leave if he won't. You need to stop now believing this is a one off. What be is doing is demanding the right to abuse a baby.

This is a power play on his part. It is absolutely abusive toward you. You need to make a stand and you need to be prepared to see the end of your marriage over this. Your relationship is heading at very high speed into toxicity.

Who owns your home? Do you rent?
What is your income? Do you have family support nearby?

You say a threat to leave would be manipulative.
If you feel you cannot leave for good, why is that?

I repeat, this is not going to get better. He is taking the relationship into a dark place because that is where he wants it to be.

So he spent lockdown yelling at you. Thats unacceptable on it's own. He has now escalated it to yellling at the baby with his fists clenched?
That is downright scary. He's getting worse and won't talk about it without being defensive. Protect your baby.

Well that's a bloody big red flag for the future waving in your face. No it's not normal or acceptable, however he dresses it up.

I don't think anyone, women or babies, should have to live with men with bad tempers who shout at and frighten them.

I wouldn't stay in a relationship with someone who frequently shouted at me, I find that totally unacceptable and that is my boundary.
I don't want my children to experience that either.

A friend's DH would give their baby a really stern look with his finger on his lips. The baby would go absolutely quiet. I saw this 10 years ago and it still disturbs me. I wouldn't be able to tolerate what your DH did. Mine loses his temper too, but always apologises later (when I set him straight). I do think that lockdown is bringing out the worst in a lot of people esp men who seem to have low tolerance for domestic chaos (which is now our permanent state).

@Hope4theBestPlan4theWorst How is that remotely helpful?