Would you support a new English lockdown?

[demitrimendeleev1]

Just that really
Yabu- I wouldn’t
Yanbu- I would

I wouldn't. I think we should focus far harder on how to live with the virus. Endless lockdowns seem to stem from a false idea that if we still at home the baddie virus will go away. It won't. What we need to do is minimise spikes so NHS can cope. What causes spikes? Jeffing lockdowns! People boozing and congregating and hugging in the days before lockdowns and straight after them.

We need life to be very stable and even, and to focus on not spreading the virus. Masks, antibac etc. Help out people who are vulnerable and need to shield. But we need to have an economy, an education and a life worth living. The virus will not go away. It will mutate. We need to focus far more on how to live safely and responsibly with it and not seesaw between drastic measures and partying hard/eating out to help out. It's so bloody obvious.

I would.

I don't want to see ambulances queueing outside hospitals for hours on end because the NHS is overwhelmed and more people dying unnecessarily as a result of not getting prompt treatment in emergencies.

I think they should certain have hospitals dedicated to Covid type illnesses, or separate wings/wards/treatment areas for possible Covid cases, so that other treatment can continue in a timely fashion though.

I would not support schools shutting. The rest I can live with but it will ruin further peoples lives......the cure is worse than the disease here.

Since March, the only places I have been are the range and Asda. I haven't taken the children out for any form of outing. Everything we have done has been home based and we have just kept busy at home

God your poor children

Unless you are CEV to keep healthy children locked up with no interaction with the outside world is barbaric and cruel. That’s awful.

And for what? To protect randoms who wouldn’t give a shit about you from getting the virus?

To be clear we have stuck to the rules and taken our children out and about within those.

@Flowerpot345

"Yes because I dont trust people to follow the tiered rules. Lockdown is a clearer message."

I agree.

Me too. Of course, people would still need to comply for it to be effective, and I'm afraid an awful lot of people don't.

Lockdown and throw money at the vaccination programme would is the way to go imo. I know the economy will suffer, but an economy can be rebuilt.

Lives can't.

*Lockdown and throw money at the vaccination programme would is the way to go imo. I know the economy will suffer, but an economy can be rebuilt.

Lives can't.*

Poverty and a trashed economy also costs lives.

I don't want to see ambulances queueing outside hospitals for hours on end because the NHS is overwhelmed and more people dying unnecessarily as a result of not getting prompt treatment in emergencies.
This already happens, I live between 2 major hospitals, both of which are often on black alert, 1 especially more so than the other. This isn't new, no one was bothered about the ambulances queuing or the state of the NHS prior to now

I think they should certain have hospitals dedicated to Covid type illnesses, or separate wings/wards/treatment areas for possible Covid cases, so that other treatment can continue in a timely fashion though.
The nightingales then? Except there's no staff for them unfortunately

@hopingforonlychild

www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-europe-53498133

I think my BBC source is slightly older so take your 8.6% as being correct.

I had to look up the UK's and it's sketchy (and also continually falling) but we're around 25%, which is catastrophic by comparison.

The point I was trying to make is that their claimed failures are based on them feeling they've let people down i.e. the elderly. This is true to some extent but they will have saved a larger proportion of their population from the misery we're all facing.

IMHO, the difference in death rates isn't a failure when considering the bigger picture. If the difference between us and Sweden was into 5,10,20% then absolutely but it's been nothing like that.

The trouble with all of this is that no-one really listened or learnt from Italy. That's the real tragedy and has highlighted that none of us have adequately protected the older generation who are the most vulnerable.

All this locking down nonsense is precisely due to a lack of action at the critical stages.

@Neron

Two months of shutdown, get everyone immunised, move on Move on how exactly? With a trashed economy, hospitality and travel industries decimated, mass unemployment, not to mention the mental health crisis that has arisen, the loss of homes etc.

The way we did after the Great Depression followed by WW2: by borrowing.

It makes sense when interest rates are low, and it makes sense if inflation is high. As high interest rates AND high inflation is a pretty rare combination, it's not a huge gamble.

The way we did after the Great Depression followed by WW2: by borrowing
But how will it work though? How do people borrow money, when they don't have a job? Jobs aren't going to suddenly appear. If those unaffected financially start spending their money again, where exactly are they going to spend it? In large companies that avoid paying tax? Those little business people bleat on about supporting have gone, they aren't open.
These are my genuine musings BTW, I don't see how we can suddenly return to normal upon receiving the magic vaccine. People and businesses are in ruin

I’m afraid it’s a No from me. Too many people are losing their livelihoods, education, mental health, too many people being killed from suicides and no treatment for other illnesses.
So many more people will end up being totally reliant on the benefit system but there won’t be a benefit system left if there’s nobody in employee to pay into the system.

The way we did after the Great Depression followed by WW2: by borrowing

Do you realise how much already?

Also the fact that the NHS is overwhelmed every single year due to a lack of funding has now been spun into “human disaster”. As someone said on here before, they have had nine months to prepare for this. We are seeing covid and flu patients as they are now one. Someone on here also predicted that the inevitable flu season casualties (this happens ever year- people get flu in winter) would be used as “evidence” and sure enough, it is being. All I ask is for fair, measured and realistic reporting instead of scaremongering, spinning and projected figures. Allegedly Whitby has warned the concerned but libertarian Prime Minister of disaster. Those aren’t facts. That’s conjecture. Please google the NHS hospital figures in your area and decide for yourself. I’ve stuck up for this government most of the way through this pandemic, but I can’t agree with the fact spinning, conjecture and rumours they are using to terrify us.

Whitty not Whitby

Very good post ohgetoveryourself

Thanks Jo, if we had some of the wise mums netters in government we wouldn’t be in this mess!

@ohgetoveryourself

Whitty not Whitby

THANK YOU. I was trying to think of the name of Whitby when I was talking to DH about it earlier and it completely escaped me 😂

Anyway... Back to the thread.

I would have more understanding of an overwhelmed NHS if there were not constant complaints and if the dots joined up between commissioned services. During the pandemic there must surely be an argument to ensure the best that can be done for patients is done even if that is just good quality palliative nursing once risk assessments have been made.

I'd also like to see more clarity about defining dying with and of Covid. I know of an elderly person who died in a nursing home who had never had Covid. Yet the family had to call it out at a very stressful time and were told it might have been if there hadn't been a test. The family stood their ground and discovered that for expediency the paperwork for Covid deaths had been significantly truncated and it was less administrative trouble to put Covid than to put something else and have to complete three times the paperwork!

@MercyBooth

Well we saw how the hysteria in the media played out. Government using the media to scare and emotionally blackmail the public into compliance with headlines like MUTANT COVID, but they didnt foresee how other countries have reacted. Serves them fucking right for using the media in that way. French are now demanding testing but apparently there is no idea of how to arrange this logistically . Time for Leveson 2 perhaps. To run alongside the inevitable public enquiry.

I thought this, too; that the presentation of this new 'mutant strain' was geared to a) attempt to soften the blow of T4, and b) to take the oncoming train wreck of Brexit off the front pages.

Instead, it caused the rest of Europe to close its borders with us, like a Brexit dry run. And yes, this new version of CV is already in most of Western Europe; it's just that some are behaving like we did in Feb, in denial that this thing could ever affect us!

So other countries have reacted to news headlines rather that the fact that this has seriously concerned scientists and that they have raised their concerns with WHO

Right ok

As the daughter of someone who committed suicide 2.5 yrs ago I am SICKENED by Covid sceptics using the suicide rates as a banner under which to hide their personal dislike of being inconvenienced by Covid restrictions.

The suicide rates in this country have been shocking for decades, largely due to a huge cultural stigma and absolutely parlous mental health services, which everyone who has voted Tory at any point were clearly happy to let die as long as their taxes stayed low.

Are people who are committing suicide due to the effects of Covid (as if there is ever s straightforward single reason why a person takes their own life) somehow more worthy and important than those who have always been among us and ignored and neglected, those with long term incurable mental health problems who needed support?

Don't you dare use those who are suffering in this way and their families to hide what is basically an ideology of devil take the hindmost.

I'm not a covid sceptic, but I am my baby have suffered because of hospital treatment being cancelled in the last 9 months.
I've also suffered with my mental health as a result so I do see how suicide statistics are relevant.
There are no statistics on what happened to us sadly. Just invisible suffering.

Nah. Life goes on. We all die some day. Let's prioritise the economy and spending time with the people we love

No difference to me except dd in y12 would be home.
Schools and childcare should close like Scotland.
A proper lockdown like other countries had would have sorted it ages ago. These half hearted lockdowns achieve nothing.