Some really selfish people!

[parlourpalm]

This was said by someone on the news:

"We just made the decision to leave based on the fact that my parents said come, and we couldn't bear the thought of no fresh air and a toddler going rogue round a small flat for the foreseeable," she said.

There are loads of us facing this exact situation and are just bloody well dealing with it.

Lockdowns aren't there to end the virus, we have them to prevent an significant impact on the NHS... Interesting.

Timandra Harkness wrote a thoughtful piece about this.

unherd.com/2020/12/what-would-you-sacrifice-for-the-nhs/

However, I think where I differ from her is in thinking we're in lockdown to protect the people who need the NHS for whatever reason - eg, accident, cancer, diabetes as well as COVID–19 - and to ensure that in the near future the resources are available to care for them.

Agreed that the NHS should not declined to this level. But all of that feels like a very different conversation and one that should be had.

Lockdowns aren't there to end the virus, we have them to prevent an significant impact on the NHS

Yet we come out of lockdown worse than when we went in

When did that happen?

@EmbarrassingAdmissions

Lockdowns aren't there to end the virus, we have them to prevent an significant impact on the NHS... Interesting.

Timandra Harkness wrote a thoughtful piece about this.

unherd.com/2020/12/what-would-you-sacrifice-for-the-nhs/

However, I think where I differ from her is in thinking we're in lockdown to protect the people who need the NHS for whatever reason - eg, accident, cancer, diabetes as well as COVID–19 - and to ensure that in the near future the resources are available to care for them.

Agreed that the NHS should not declined to this level. But all of that feels like a very different conversation and one that should be had.

I think it's disgraceful that people have voted Tory for years knowing that they are cutting the NHS but are now berating people for leaving their houses to protect the NHS.

If anyone who is berating people for leaving the house have voted Tory, they need to have a serious look at themselves. They are expecting people to sacrifice their freedom to protect the NHS, but they couldn't be bothered to put a cross in a different box to protect the NHS in the last few elections.

Nikhedonia, you are wasting your breath. There are nice tories, but they are not very intelligent. There are intelligent tories, but they are not very nice. There are no nice, intelligent tories. It is just one of those things. Either way, you can't argue with a tory- the normally respond with something along the lines of "Jeremy Corbyn, anti-semitism, IRA, Corbyn, Socialist, COMMUNIST, we didn't fight the war for this"

My father was a nice, intelligent Tory for a while. (He reverted to Labour after a bit, though.)

More people would obey the rules if they made sense.

This makes me so, so mad. Whatever the detailed rules are, they are all based on one simple principle: to reduce the number of times people are in close contact with other people. This virus spreads through human close contact, so the rules are designed to lessen this. We can't trust everyone to be sensible or not be selfish, so there have to be rules. We can't have a rule that covers every single situation, so they have to be general. It really is that simple.

@dadshere

Nikhedonia, you are wasting your breath. There are nice tories, but they are not very intelligent. There are intelligent tories, but they are not very nice. There are no nice, intelligent tories. It is just one of those things. Either way, you can't argue with a tory- the normally respond with something along the lines of "Jeremy Corbyn, anti-semitism, IRA, Corbyn, Socialist, COMMUNIST, we didn't fight the war for this"

So tolerant of other people's choices! Oh.

A very intelligent and nice woman I know rather surprised me by turning out to have worked for Boris Johnson and voted for him as leader of the Conservative party. But then, she owns a horse so is obviously a person who shouldn't be regarded as properly human, right?

She and I have had several splendid arguments about all sorts of things. Books. The value and purpose of university education. We are fine if we stay off politics.

Always amazes me how people conflate ‘intelligent’ with ‘thinks the same as I do’. People really do have an exaggerated view of their own intellectual superiority!

There are nice tories, but they are not very intelligent. There are intelligent tories, but they are not very nice. There are no nice, intelligent tories.

You could substitute supporters of any political party for "tories" and this post would still be correct.

"There are nice Labour party members, but they are not very intelligent. There are intelligent Labour party members, but they are not very nice. There are no nice, intelligent Labour party members."

"There are nice Scottish nationalists, but they are not very intelligent. There are intelligent Scottish nationalists, but they are not very nice. There are no nice, intelligent Scottish nationalists."

The simple truth is that a person who is both intelligent and nice doesn't join a political party in the first place. If they are blinded by their political conviction and do join they soon leave when they realise how unpleasant the average party member is.

I suppose you do realise that there may be people here who are members of political parties and might take blanket condemnation ever so slightly amiss?

No child should be cooped up like a caged animal if there's an alternative. I'm absolutely astounded that some people think they're virtuous for choosing to do that to their child. Fair enough if the child is vulnerable, but to knowingly & willingly treat your child in a manner that will adversely affect their life chances is abuse in my opinion.

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

I suppose you do realise that there may be people here who are members of political parties and might take blanket condemnation ever so slightly amiss?

If they are Tories, I couldn't work myself up to give even a little bit of a fuck.

And if they are members of any of the other parties, who were being equally vilified? Or did you not read the post immediately above mine?

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

And if they are members of any of the other parties, who were being equally vilified? Or did you not read the post immediately above mine?

If you are referring to particular posts, it helps if you highlight the points or use the quote function. Otherwise it's not always clear which post you are referring to.

I'm so sorry Nikhedonia : I thought that it was reasonably obvious, really.

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime

I'm so sorry Nikhedonia : I thought that it was reasonably obvious, really.

Much better that time, well done.

If it were not Christmas I would be really rude to you at this point.

That was a rude and intemperate post; my apologies. Cumulative irritation from having RTFT does not excuse but might explain.