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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Was DD overreacting?

370 replies

christmascaroller · 16/12/2020 10:40

Last night we (DH, DD15 and I) were watching something with Fairytale of New York in, and DH said "isn't it ridiculous that they can't say f*ggot anymore". DD told him that it was a slur (which I don't disagree with btw) and that he shouldn't say it even in this context. He said that it was perfectly fine for him to say as he wasn't being homophobic. My AIBU is this: when he said that it was fine to say, DD said "just admit that you're a bigotted twat instead of wasting your breath"!! I told DD that this was unacceptable but she stormed out and hasn't spoken to us since.

YABU: her reaction was perfectly justified
YANBU: she shouldn't be using language like that over a word

OP posts:
Byebye1to1 · 17/12/2020 20:42

Not read all posts but the worrying thing is that 25% of responders say it’s not unreasonable for DD to call father a twat when expressing her opinion. I work in secondary school and it’s the product of these 25% that cause all the behavioural issues and prevent others from learning.
Bottom line; needs to learn (be taught) some manners.

MariahCarey · 17/12/2020 20:58

The 15 year old is behaving like a 15 year old in lashing out at her father, and of course there should be consequences for her rudeness and she should be educated to articulate her arguments more calmly.

However, the father is an adult, and as her father he will be well aware that "faggot" is a homophobic slur, and that his daughter would be upset by it, and yet he stubbornly and rather provocatively continued to say it to her face. No excuse for this behaviour.

Celestine70 · 17/12/2020 21:05

It's definitely her generation. My daughter is always accusing me of being a bigot if I say the slightest thing that is not politically correct. This results in conversation about free speech, agreeing to disagree etc. We don't see eye to eye and I consider myself extremely liberal.

grannyinapram · 17/12/2020 21:10

@pizzaandcats

I have obviously been making the words to this song up as I go on as I have just had to Google the use of the word slut in the song! I had no idea Confused I thought it was "old southern drunk" hahahaha
I thought it was old slovenly drunk 🥴
akittencalledjesus · 17/12/2020 21:10

Well, of course faggot is offensive when taken out of context. However, heading back to the real world where context should be relevant, the song is a fight between a couple in a different era during different times. In the context of the song it is clearly not used to offend gay people.

Meanwhile the misogynist shite that comes out of the world of music nowadays is perfectly acceptable.

But then you can't be truly woke if you consider things like context or reality.

akittencalledjesus · 17/12/2020 21:12

@Charley1984

To clarify I don’t care if the version with the slur is played or not, I’m just very suspicious of straight (or cishet) people who get overly defensive about it not being offensive
  1. CIS is a slur
  2. Context is relevant
Localocal · 17/12/2020 21:32

Sorry, but DH didn't just use the other f-word, did he? He expressed disgust that it's not ok to use the term, a homophobic slur, anymore, which in my book is indeed a bigoted attitude. I think she was right to challenge him for lamenting the days when you could insult gay people with impunity.

Maybe your daughter didn't need to use the word "twt" to him, but then he didn't need to use the word "fggot", which is way worse. So I don't think he has a leg to stand on in criticising DDs language.

If I were her mother I would be proud of her for having principles and standing by them, even if she could have been a little more calm and measured about it. But if you can't flounce off in anger at 15 when can you?

JerryGiraffe · 18/12/2020 00:31

Her opinion is her opinion, however she behaved like a brat speaking to her parents like that. I also think that the lyrics have to be taken in the context in which they were written. People really do like feeling hard done by and offended these days!

Leannethom85 · 18/12/2020 00:43

I've noticed teenagers are offended by everything and absolutely ashamed of nothing - depicted by their social media attention seeking 'woe is me' posts, that are littered with curse words that leave alot to be desired.
True its not a term that should be used in modern society but neither is calling her father a tw@t...

trixiebelden77 · 18/12/2020 00:49

Not sure why it would be ‘exhausting’ to think about things and reflect?

I mean, I don’t assume the people in this thread falling over themselves to demonstrate that they’re regularly using the word to mean meat products or when lighting a fire are exhausted by their stupid and embarrassing behaviour.

Fatladyslim · 18/12/2020 01:30

@hobbyiscodefordogging

Isn't it strange that "faggot" has had to be dubbed out of that song but the misogynistic slur "slut" is ok to stay in? 🤔
That would be because women ain't worth shit in this new world of acceptance.
Fatladyslim · 18/12/2020 01:42

Notice they still say 'fags' for cigarettes though.

berrygirlie · 18/12/2020 05:38

There are a lot of really disparaging posts against young people on here Hmm what's that about?

Hunnihun2 · 18/12/2020 06:01

It depends. Is your DH actually homophobic? Where has your DD got the idea from that he is?! Because I’m if that’s the impression she has I can understand how she overreacted.

FunkBus · 18/12/2020 06:10

Heads would have rolled had I spoken to anyone in my house like that.

She needs to learn to keep a civil tongue in her head even when she is wound up.

Personally I think in that context, the word is fine but can understand her opinion too.

FunkBus · 18/12/2020 06:12

"To clarify I don’t care if the version with the slur is played or not, I’m just very suspicious of straight (or cishet) people who get overly defensive about it not being offensive"

How do you know the sexuality or cisness of anyone involved?

FrenchFancie · 18/12/2020 06:12

@MariahCarey

The 15 year old is behaving like a 15 year old in lashing out at her father, and of course there should be consequences for her rudeness and she should be educated to articulate her arguments more calmly.

However, the father is an adult, and as her father he will be well aware that "faggot" is a homophobic slur, and that his daughter would be upset by it, and yet he stubbornly and rather provocatively continued to say it to her face. No excuse for this behaviour.

This... exactly this. I recall a similar conversation with my father when I was about 15 or 16. I’m now 40 and whilst I acknowledge that calling him a ‘massively bigoted wanker’ was inappropriate, he remains to this day a massively bigoted wanker.
Catscatsandmorecats · 18/12/2020 07:00

It does sound like maybe your DH has expressed bigoted opinions before or that your DD has some reason to be more upset by his reaction to it and she's not in the wrong for calling him out or being upset by the word. She does need to learn not to snap in an argument but she's a teenager. I'd be much less concerned by her reaction than by why she was so upset by what your DH said.

On censoring as PPs have said understanding the context of the song and how it is written at the time it was not wrong to use that language, however Sean McGowan is fine with it being censored. Kirsty McCall also used to sing an amended version live that omitted that word. Radio 1 have censored it because they understand their audience, Radio 2 have not, because they understand their audience.

I really do think though you are asking the wrong question about whether DD overreacted about a word, language can be very powerful and her reaction was to her Dad expressing a bigoted opinion, if he was doing it in an angry manner then that's even worse. I think you should be concentrating on your DH's reaction and/or why it upset DD so much.

Barmychick · 18/12/2020 11:24

Remember asking someone in America if they sold fags years ago...could have heard a pin drop

ancientgran · 18/12/2020 11:27

I remember Peter Cook getting into trouble in the US for making a remark about having a fag in his mouth. He probably did it deliberately though.

Apologies to those too young to remember Peter Cook.

Madamum18 · 18/12/2020 13:07

Disagreement is not the same as being obnoxiously rude!! YANBU

Wheresmykimchi · 18/12/2020 13:14

DD was wrong to speak like that but I agree with her. Neither words should be used in this day and age. But I like the song.

LovelyIssues · 18/12/2020 15:51

She is being ridiculous. When that song was released it wasn't meant as a gay slur. I'm Irish and we regularly called our siblings faggots Hmm people have too much time on their hands and will find anything to be offended about.

LovelyIssues · 18/12/2020 15:52

She also is the one who in fact sounds like a tw*t Grin

Wheresmykimchi · 18/12/2020 16:04

@trixiebelden77

Not sure why it would be ‘exhausting’ to think about things and reflect?

I mean, I don’t assume the people in this thread falling over themselves to demonstrate that they’re regularly using the word to mean meat products or when lighting a fire are exhausted by their stupid and embarrassing behaviour.

Quite.