DD (11) hates her dad - AIBU to not know what to do?

[Funkyslippers]

OH has this rather irritating habit of breathing/growling quite loudly while eating, and at other times of the day too. He's done it ever since I've known him and it bugs the hell out of me but I've learned to switch off, despite telling him about it countless times. I just try to let it go as he can't seem to help it and I don't want him to think I'm nagging.

However DD has recently noticed it and she is constantly irritated by it. She's always telling him to be quiet. As a result, she finds it hard to be in the same room as him and therefore they rarely spend any time together. Last night he asked her to play cards with him and she screamed at him to go away and said I hate you! I sat her down and said that sort of talk is unacceptable and she is going to have to try and let it go as her attitude is upsetting me and her sister as well.

OH said to me last night if she is behaving like that towards him, he feels like withholding her Christmas presents from him (an Echo Dot and couple of other little bits).

The whole atmosphere is upsetting as I had a lovely relationship with my dad (although he did irritate me a bit when I was a teen!).

I know OH is making an effort with his breathing but there are naturally some times when he forgets. Any ideas on how to resolve this conflict? What could the consequences be to her attitude?

He sits in the room panting and growling? And when you're all eating as a family together, he is sitting growling and what? Making shuffling noises like an animal?

Yeah, I wouldn't sit in the room with him either. And if your daughter is getting this stressed about it then you need to start listening to her.

There was a very similar thread previously about a daughter getting really stressed about her dad’s loud chewing... might be some insights on there too - sounds like a similar problem.

Also, not what you asked at all, but am I the only person that finds it unusual that you and your OH buy your DD separate presents? (Assuming she is your shared DD).

And if he can stop, but then sometimes forgets and starts doing it again, then it isnt medical. Is a disgusting habit which is impacting on others around him.

Making animal noises when eating is disgusting.

If he withholds presents will he tell her there are presents she can't have or will he just not give them (and then what? Put them in a cupboard?)

I hate the excuse of mysphonia. The op has noticed it as well so evidently the issue is with her partner. As someone who lives with a loud breather/chewer/snorer is both bloody irritating and worrying. People aren't meant to breath so loudly other people notice, it's either a sign of a health issue or it may lead to one down the road (never mind what it does to your oral hygiene). It's amazing how it's usually men with this problem and women getting told it's their problem by getting annoyed by it. I see it an another way of man-spreading, 'I am man, all must hear me breath/chew'. Nah, either go to the doctors or learn to breath through your damn nose.

However, @Funkyslippers, your daughter was unacceptably rude. At the end of her tether perhaps (she wouldn't be the first) but she shouldn't speak to her dad like that. I hope that you've made it clear to her that in future anything that may be irritating her in such away can be talked about. And get your partner to go to the bloody doctors .

It might not just be a simple medical issue. It could be a result of dyspraxia, for example. How is his physical coordination generally? You say it happens at other times than eating; could it be a tic? Growling noises are listed as possible tics.

I'd say it's important to make your daughter aware that some people do have reasons why they can't control behaviour like this, and that to punish them for it is unkind.

Jemima - we buy presents from both of us, but he also buys a few extra if he sees something she might like whilst out shopping

I can’t worked up about kids saying I hate you. Seriously. It’s normally just an expression of frustration and kids are people too. I’d recommend “well I love you” as a response.

Kids shout I hate you. It happens and it’s a bit pathetic that your DH would consider taking away Christmas presents for if.

But also, he growls? You live with an actual human adult who makes random growling noises and you’re all just expected to put up with it? People train their dogs out of that shit.

I imagine it is really irritating that he growls. He needs to stop or go to the GP if he can't stop.

Do you think it's an annoying habit or a medical condition?

@TheyWentToSeaInASieve

As a parent, I wouldn't be inclined to behave decently towards a rude child. I think he would be well within his rights to punish her -- whatever form that normally takes (withholding Christmas presents is fine). It's just not acceptable behaviour on her part. She needs to apologise and mean it, and then you can decide what to do. He sounds like a nice dad, with a health issue. You wouldn't blame someone for a birth mark in an awkward place, would you? A lot of these things are difficult to control.

As a parent, I am always inclined to behave decently towards my kids regardless of what they may have done as that does rather appear in the job description - you know - "be decent". FFS

Withholding Christmas presents is never fine. there are things to be sorted out, but bringing spite and revenge into it isn't going to help. Anyway, OP doesn't sound like the same sort of parent as you @TheyWentToSeaInASieve. Thankfully.

Your daughter is going to struggle if she can't be around anyone doing something mildly irritating.

@TheyWentToSeaInASieve But he doesn’t acknowledge it’s a health issue? It’s one thing if he goes to the doctors and is getting treatment, then it’s unacceptable to complain. But if you shared a house with someone with a smelly infection, and they didn’t take steps to treat it, would you really expect everyone to refrain from getting irritated with the smell? I hope not.

I found my dad’s loud breathing and squelching semi open mouth chewing disgusting as a teenager to the point I spent zero time with him anymore. I got my own cutlery set just to avoid having to think about how he ate. We have never fully recovered our relationship. I wish he had acknowledged the problem and worked on it, rather than deciding that I was talking nonsense. I felt unheard and like my feelings and preferences didn’t matter. I would have made fewer mistakes as a young adult if I had more confidence that my preferences were important. It wasn’t just the chewing, but it starts like this, and quickly none of the child’s preferences or comfort are considered. Teenagers say they hate people, that’s expected, but as adults we all have the responsibility to rise above it. The little things matter!

To quote a favourite mumsnet phrase you have a dh problem
What you’ve described would drive me nuts and mixed with hormones etc I wonder if other people have made comments to her
Send your dh to the doctors and tell him not to be a child about giving presents

Does he have sleep apnoea at all? I have it, and apparently am likely to have always had it according to my consultant. I forget to breathe in the day time as am as at night. In the day time once my brain remembers to breathe I often gulp or breathe heavily to compensate for the breaths I've missed - I don't know I'm doing it most of the time and it can be alarming for others when I suddenly take a big breath - when I'm eating is a really common time for me to hold my breath. My mum says I held my breath as a child all the time but thought it was a habit and I knew I was doing it - my consultant thinks this was early signs of sleep apnoea. It is terribly severe and although I use a cpap machine at night it doesn't help in the day. It could be possible that your DH has a similar thing.

It is annoying though with noisy eaters. My dad is quite a noisy eater and slurps tea - it does irritate me but I'm no better so I can't really moan!

Another hand up for misophonia. I suffer with it terribly. It also tends to start in teenage years.

I couldn't bear to be in a room with my dad when I was a teen due to his heavy breathing.

I can't bear whistling.

But gross eating and i want to fucking twat someone. The rage is so bad.

Its fight or flight and I remove myself from every situation where I am feeling the rage.

He's the adult and the one with the issue which very likely can be resolved - as per pp if it's habit he needs to cut it out! If it's a medical issue he needs it treated!

I have bad sinuses and am aware I can make noises/do things as a result of them. I make sure I temper them as much as possible around others eg if I need to clear them (which is a pretty gross process) I do it away from others.

Withholding gifts is a shitty thing for an adult to do, he's clearly resistant to taking ANY responsibility for his issue even though there are now at least 2 people he supposedly loves who are telling him it's very annoying/upsetting and making him very difficult to be around even to play a game!

Yes she behaved badly too and should apologise for that and not do it again. But she shouldn't be expected to just put up with this.

He needs to grow up and stop denying the problem and deal with it!

You MAY ask him to go to dr? I'd be having a proper conversation with him about the possible cause - saying he needs to be totally honest, is it a bad habit or is it a medical thing? If it's medical he must go to the dr (as much for his sake as hers/yours)

Also, not what you asked at all, but am I the only person that finds it unusual that you and your OH buy your DD separate presents? (Assuming she is your shared DD).

Yes I find that odd too

I see it an another way of man-spreading, 'I am man, all must hear me breath/chew'

Agree with this

My ex eats like a pig at a trough < seriously NOT envy

Nothing medically wrong with him just appalling eating habits! Cuts it all up at the start then forks it all in at speed and barely stops to chew, mouth open to point half chewed food falls out at times! Gross!

People train their dogs out of that shit. true though

I think she's being really rude. Shes of the age where she needs to learn that mum and dad are real people with real feelings and whilst you'll always love her, she needs to show respect in order to have a good relationship together.

I would encourage your partner to have a chat with her. Be open. He should tell her that she's hurting his feelings and while he'll do what he can to reduce the noise, she also needs to appreciate that it's his house and she needs to be more understanding. Telling someone you hate them, especially when they do so much for you, is really unkind.

Your daughter is going to struggle if she can't be around anyone doing something mildly irritating.

Growling when eating and at other times is more than mildly irritating.

I just didn't get on well with my dad as a child. Everything he did enraged me. We are very different people and he didn't act like I wanted him to as I grew up. It took till well into adulthood for me to go easy on him. I don't honestly know what my problem was. He's actually the kindest, most generous, fairest person. He's just a bit eccentric and awkward. Quite rigid and clearly has some particular personality traits. Nothing that ever actually did us harm but I hated so much how he wanted the doors closed, or strict table manners, or how he couldn't throw a ball but wanted to do crosswords instead.

So sometimes there's no clear reason for the rage of a child/teen. But I should have been given hell for how I treated him. It shouldn't have been tolerated but I think it just perplexed my mum and she didn't know what to do to fix it.

I think he's being very cruel to her, my mother had intense nervous tics and they actually made me so ill as a child I couldn't be in the same room as her. The sheer irritation of this perpetual tic got under my skin so badly I'd cut myself with blades at your daughter's age as a way of releasing the awful tension I felt and now as an older woman I have to keep explaining away an armful of razor blade cuts.

She can't help the way she feels, it a type of misophonia which in itself is a brutal and mentally damaging phobic condition. It can cause some people to have breakdowns or commit suicide when exposed to this on a daily base and they can't escape from it.
She is showing clear signs of distress.
Maybe instead of punishing her for this he could get off his backside and go to the GP to see if anything can be done about his condition, if he's growling and heavy breathing all the time it's probably affecting his heart and blood pressure - is he overweight?

Your daughter should not be screaming "i hate you" at her dad and I don't blame him for not wanting to give her some of her presents.

You need to get a medical opinion on the noises (it would drive me batty)
And you need to tell your daughter that sometimes we have to put up with things we don't like and not to be a rude little madam.

Why the hell has he not been to the Drs? Why do you enable this anti social behaviour?

Your DD was rude shouting & telling him to shut up etc

BUT I don't blame her, just because you have chosen to let him spend years annoying you, doesn't mean she should have to.

Obviously she could have dealt with it differently, but she's 11 & has probably been trying to ignore it/work out what to do

It's an indication of how entitled he is that he hadn't tried to get it fixed/change his habit.

& it's entitled that his conclusion here is that he should withhold her Christmas presents not that HE should stop behaving in an annoying tucking way.

As for you wondering if it's right or not & not saying anything because you don't want to 'nag' FFS. It's not 1950, stop behaving like it is.

Everyone but your husband has misophonia so he is BU.

Are you really sure that's what's upsetting her? Especially since you say they've never been close... Ask her what it is that she finds difficult about him, and please actually LISTEN to what she says. It might well be something totally unreasonable (she's 11) but you won't get anywhere until you really do understand her perspective, even if it seems silly. It's just so unlikely that, assuming she is neurotypical, her dad asked her to play a game, she screamed back that she hated him, and the only reason is literally that he breathes too loudly.