Smacking a child on the hand

[Warzone100]

I've name changed because I don't want this following me around mumsnet.

My much loved three year old is aggressive, he attacks me, DH and his 20 month old sister. It's important I include this info for context, he has autism. He's only semi verbal but has a reasonable level of understanding.

When he does attack he is capable of inflicting significant harm. He has bitten DD leaving deep marks, headbutted her, shoved her into the corners of furniture, thrown things at her head. You name it he has done it. As a result of all of this, DD has conditioned herself to run to me or DH as soon as DS becomes agitated as she knows she'll be the first in the firing line. Me and DH get it too but our main concern is DD getting hurt and it's just not possible to keep them away from one another at home.

Aside attacking others he smashes up the house. I've had to use endless polyfiller on the walls where he has thrown things, he has smashed countless plates and cups, he has pushed my television off the unit and broke that, smashed up his tablet device that my late father bought for him. He has even smashed a glass candle holder on DH's head causing him to bleed.

Despite my best efforts I cannot curb the behaviour, this is because he has so many triggers you couldn't possibly pre empt an outburst to prevent one. For example: if his tower of blocks falls down or his tablet runs out of battery, if it's time to get out of the bath, if he's told "no" to anything at all.

I have tried all of the traditional forms of meltdown management such as creating a safe space, sensory lighting, calm down music, soothing him, giving him some space, positive reinforcement and ignoring negative behaviour, plenty of 1-1 time with either me or DH. We have tried everything reasonably possible to help and support him and it's breaking my heart, the older he gets the worse it becomes. If he continues this way then by the age of 10 he's going to have put one of us in hospital.

This evening after him pinching DD and twisting her skin so hard she had an instant bruise, trying to bite her (i got between them first) charging at her ready to headbutt her (all because his toys fell off the table) I'm ashamed to say I momentarily considered smacking him on the hand with a firm "no! we do not hit"

It was my hope, in the moment, that it would shock him and be a deterrent the next time he goes to attack.

I didn't do it, but came very close.

We tell him all the time not to hit and to use kind hands but it doesn't make any difference, still we persevere.

I'm not a cruel parent and I've never laid a finger on either of my children, DS was our rainbow baby and is so, so loved. I'm just incredibly overwhelmed and feeling hopeless and scared for not only DD's future but his. We are treading on egg shells every day so that we (mainly DD) doesn't get attacked or our property smashed. He's three for goodness sake.

If there is help to be had then we don't get any, he was diagnosed in October and O.T waiting lists are at least 12 months long.

Would I have been a bad parent if I did smack him on the hand the next time he does it? I've lost count of the amount of times I've heard people say that this generation are unruly because they have no discipline, I've always rubbished the implication that children need to be spanked to be taught how to behave but now I just don't know. nothing is helping and he's getting worse.

You're having a tough time, no doubt.

I'm ashamed to say I momentarily considered smacking him on the hand with a firm "no! we do not hit"

It's not going to work though is it, hitting to teach a child not to hit.

As a mum of a boy with autism on the sever end of the spectrum...... no never hit!
Use you PECS or Makaton. Remove from the room to a safe space and reinforce no.
Hitting will only make you feel guilty and like you've lost control! You haven't..... it's just life is different!!!

Our son has mellowed and his sister is now a good playmate...She is 9 and he is 11...but functions 18-24:months.....

No help to offer; but I'm so sorry for what you're going through.
It must be scary worrying for DD's safety.

Bless you, that sounds so difficult. I wouldn't judge you if you reached the end of your tether and did smack him, but honestly it will only make things worse. DS has autism, thankfully his outbursts have never been as violent as the ones you describe, but he did go through a stage of trying to hit / push his little sister, and will still hit me in meltdown, but it's getting less frequent.

The turning point for us was DS learning words for emotions, so instead raising my voice (which he wouldn't pick up on) I'd say "I'm angry that you through that" or "I'm sad that you hurt me" with exaggerated facial expressions or false crying (sometimes not that fake, it was a stressful time). I'd also name his emotions so "I can see your angry, but we don't hit" and eventually he starts using the word as well.

Now a lot of the time instead of hitting he can shout "I'm angry" then we have some strategys to express anger non violently. He favorates are either a dinosaur rampage (walk round room stomping and rawing together) or big bad wolf (I tell him to "huff and puff and blow out your angries" then pretend to be blown). It doesn't work if he's really upset, but can often defuse a situation before he gets to that point.

Also, is he at nursery? You say that either you or DH are around all the time anyway, but even if you don't need the childcare, a brake can be a life line. DS's at one connected to a school, and the senco has been great.

To be honest in the situation you have described when I was a child I would have got a smacked arse not a hand. He's out of control and sorry to say sounds dangerous which at age 3 must be very hard to deal with OP and my heart goes out to you. I agree with you though that sometimes you do have to wonder if the lack of disciplining in this generation is breeding worse behaviour than if they had experienced the sort of discipline our generation or our parents generation had

Not a popular opinion but I agree.

It sounds like your son is presenting behaviour that challenges as a communication. Sensory overload can be enough to generate this.

I haven’t read the whole thread but there are therapies that can help and a whole host of strategic interventions. Do you have help from SaLT or OT? Zones of regulation, total communication systems etc can all help with enabling your son to communicate. He is young so you may have to wait for lo the possible support but would refer to GP and/or social care to get the support you need.

If he is limited in terms of expressive language the sooner you can start using Alternative and Augmentative Communication (AAC) systems the more change you have to reduce challenging behaviour.

@AwaAnBileYerHeid

To be honest in the situation you have described when I was a child I would have got a smacked arse not a hand. He's out of control and sorry to say sounds dangerous which at age 3 must be very hard to deal with OP and my heart goes out to you. I agree with you though that sometimes you do have to wonder if the lack of disciplining in this generation is breeding worse behaviour than if they had experienced the sort of discipline our generation or our parents generation had

Not a popular opinion but I agree.

Ditto

As previous posters have said, behaviour is communication (especially when you don't have much verbal communication), so the lashing out and hurting are indicative of a need not being met somewhere - and this isn't a slight on you, it may be a need you wouldn't even consider a 'need' (toys lined up, all on the table, feeling different in terms of sensory input etc.), things a neurotypical person might not even consider at all!

Obviously your first action when there is physical aggression or responses is to remove him from the situation - this might be through restraining him (it's not as scary as it sounds on a 3 year old: essentially a good solid hug, keeping his arms by his sides and your head back away from his - to prevent a head-but (accidental or otherwise), and sitting on the door (so he can't kick out). There are courses that are run in schools for restraint training, so there's bound to be something similar for parents? If not restraining, then removing him to a place where he has a sensory input - all the ideas of play dough, paper to tear, bottles with water/oil/glitter to shake, a weighted blanket/toy of some sort, maybe something to rock on/in (as previously suggested on the thread) - to calm down.

You say he isn't very verbal, but he seems to understand quite a lot - have you heard of social stories? They are written for a specific purpose (i.e. reacting to toys falling off the table), and are personalised to a named child. They are read regularly and during a period of calm, and reinforce/explain what might happen and the ways to solve a problem or recover from a mishap. They're very simple, but do need lots of repetition. I wrote quite a lot over my teaching career - they're quite straightforward, and I'm happy to help if you want to give it a try.

Basically, for an autistic brain, the unknown and unplanned is incredibly frightening, as there just aren't the same set of skills to transfer from one situation to another, or to theorise out what might happen. I say this as an autistic adult, by the way, I'm not being deliberately negative! So an extreme outburst - if you don't know what else to do - is the only thing you know, because in your mind it is extreme.

I'm sure none of this helps short term, but you will get there. Keep badgering your GP and any other services you can - the squeaky wheel really does get the grease unfortunately.

This, incidentally:

To be honest in the situation you have described when I was a child I would have got a smacked arse not a hand. He's out of control and sorry to say sounds dangerous which at age 3 must be very hard to deal with OP and my heart goes out to you. I agree with you though that sometimes you do have to wonder if the lack of disciplining in this generation is breeding worse behaviour than if they had experienced the sort of discipline our generation or our parents generation had.

Infuriates me. He's not choosing to 'be naughty', it's a response that - to him - is equivalent to the level of distress he is feeling. It might not register to anyone else, because it isn't distressing to them, but it's not a choice. It's not about discipline and behaviour - autistic children and adults can display poor behaviour choices, of course then can, but sensory overload and/or meltdowns won't be 'cured' by harsher discipline, they'll just leave the autistic person feeling there is nobody who can help them when they feel completely helpless.

If you have Facebook ask to join The SEND VCB project. Family support group. Run by an amazing lady called Yvonne. I have an asd violent child although a good bit older than yours and I found this support group amazing for help and advice.
You are not a bad parent and you are not alone. Be kind to yourself x

To be honest in the situation you have described when I was a child I would have got a smacked arse not a hand. He's out of control and sorry to say sounds dangerous which at age 3 must be very hard to deal with OP and my heart goes out to you. I agree with you though that sometimes you do have to wonder if the lack of disciplining in this generation is breeding worse behaviour than if they had experienced the sort of discipline our generation or our parents generation had

This is such bollocks. Discipline doesn’t equal physical punishment.

My children are well disciplined, know what is and isn’t acceptable and I’ve never hit them.

I was never hit. I didn’t go off the rails. Children act out when there is a lack of connection and understanding - obviously this can be extremely difficult with autistic children.

Autistic children need a different way of being disciplined.

@ZoeTurtle

You want to hit him and then say "No! We do not hit!"

Yeah, that will work.

Yeah, she gets it. Fucking hell, give it a rest.

Thank you so much for the replies, I'm not upset by the less kind comments as I can appreciate how bad I might look for my OP.

I can see what you are all saying about a smack on the hand making matters worse, I agree with you actually. I was just so overwhelmed in the moment and fearful that DD was going to be badly hurt, it felt like the only thing left. I won't be doing it.

He does attend nursery two days per week but he masks alot there, they've never seen the type of behaviour he exhibits at home. They were shocked when he banged his head on the floor for the first time. I told them they haven't seen anything. He is being referred to an educational psychologist which I hope will help teach both him and me some coping strategies.

RE private therapies, we could scrape together some cash if we tighten our belts. It just depends how much these things are. I was looking into private SALT and the lowest figure I found was £50 per session. We could afford maybe two per month but it would mean cutting back alot. We live in one of the most expensive parts of the country, rent and don't earn much over NMW.

I like the sound of social stories, that is something we haven't tried yet.

Also going to look at the Facebook groups suggested.

I think you've answered your own question in your post - one day he'll be bigger and stronger than you, hitting him might provide you with a temporary release of your totally understandable frustration and anger, the time will come whwn if you hit him you'll end up fighting him physically, and he will win. It's not sustainable. So there's no point starting it now.

Having said that my heart utterly goes out to you. I can't imagine how horrible it must be to see your beloved child struggle so much every day, or to be hurt by him, or worst of all to see him hurting your precious girl. I am so very sorry. I would definitely go back to the GP and say that as a family you aren't coping and he and you are all not safe. That you NEED more support, maybe medication, something because you can't live like this - quite apart from how hellish it is for you it is unsafe for your daughter. As you recognise, he is badly hurting her and one day it will become a matter for social services if he hospitalises her.

I wish I had any experience I could offer you, but all I can send is my very best wishes. You are not a bad person for thinking it; but you didn't do it. And that makes you both a good parent and a sensible one in my view xx

I'm watching one of the webinar videos from The SEND VCB page now.

I'm also going to take on board all of your brilliant advice here.

Thank you, I feel a bit less alone for posting even if I have made myself look awful

I'm ashamed to say I momentarily considered smacking him on the hand with a firm "no! we do not hit"

I’m sorry and I know this topic doesn’t go down well on MN. I would of done it OP.

Your child sounds very unruly. The posters that are saying separate the kids it’s like saying you should of been watching the kids... it’s not possible (every minute of the day).

Only you know your child OP and you can judge weather your child knows that he is being purposely naughty at times.

That is one of my fears yes, that he hurts her so badly social services get involved and I lose one or both of them.

If I were a social worker with no SN experience I would take a dim view of a situation where an older child is regularly hurting the younger one, they may even see it as abuse.

It is in a way, isn't it. Although he has special needs he's hurting her

@ AwaAnBileYerHeid love your post I fully agree. It made me chuckle.

Autistics work on logic. You cant hit him to teach him you dont hit. It's entirely nonsensical. Doesn't make sense.

Social services are not there to swoop in and take your dc, so don't worry about that. I think most people with experience with dc with ASD understand that some dc hurt others at times. But now you know it is a risk you need to taken action to keep your youngest safe, and that might involve managing the dc in seperate areas unless you are supervising closely. Have you given that any thought?

You sound like a great parent, and you’re doing your best.

The only thing that worked a bit for us at 3yo was to physically put him in the garden, and also to teach him to punch the sofa (we helped him out). As he’s got older he’s found his own, less violent, outlets.

Hope you find something that helps soon. You are not alone.

As I said these outbursts come from inconveniences to him, like his device going dead or his tower of blocks falling down. Things that can't be avoided

Actually this doesn't mean that there are no unmet needs. For example - you stub your toe on your average day, and you swear quietly. You stub your toe on a really bad day when everything is going wrong and you are really upset about other things and you scream swear words at the top of your voice and start crying. The reactions to things going wrong are a barometer as to how he is feeling generally.

I agree with all the posters who say slapping the hand won't work, it won't. It might well make things worse as it will fuel the angry responses.

i think that the best thing you could do is get professional help from a clinical psychologist. You might think that you have tried everything and that might be the problem - or there might be better strategies and things you could differently with routine. I think that this would be better than to try to put in place yet more strategies as given by posters here, as the clinical psychologist can do a more thorough assessment and will have extensive experience and expertise.

@evenBetter

What are people gobbling off at me? 😄 it absolutely is assault. HTH

Why did you “gob off” at the OP?

Or does it only work one way?

It's not possible to keep them apart. There is only one of us here at any given time and both need to be supervised. I can't leave DS in the bedroom alone because he could (and does) hurt himself by banging his head off the floors and walls.

DD being so young can't be left on her own either.

Our home is very small and we just don't have an abundance of space. We have one area which doubles as a living room one side and kitchen on the other, then bedrooms and bathroom.

I can't leave either child unattended in any of these rooms.

If we had a through room or two living areas we could make adaptations to do that with a stair gate perhaps but we don't have that luxury.

Moving isn't an option for the foreseeable. I'm frustrated at the living arrangement but it's the reality of London unfortunately.

Don't feel bad OP I think anyone with experience of SN children fully understood the position of feeling from your original post.

Like anything in life there will be those who fully understand, those who want to understand and those who judge straight away.

My close friends son is quite severe although verbal. I have nothing but admiration and awe of how they get through everything and still have smiley days.
Use the support networks, harass your HV/Dr etc etc but never forget that you're doing great in an extremely tough situation that many don't understand and see as being naughty or unruly.