Smacking a child on the hand

[Warzone100]

I've name changed because I don't want this following me around mumsnet.

My much loved three year old is aggressive, he attacks me, DH and his 20 month old sister. It's important I include this info for context, he has autism. He's only semi verbal but has a reasonable level of understanding.

When he does attack he is capable of inflicting significant harm. He has bitten DD leaving deep marks, headbutted her, shoved her into the corners of furniture, thrown things at her head. You name it he has done it. As a result of all of this, DD has conditioned herself to run to me or DH as soon as DS becomes agitated as she knows she'll be the first in the firing line. Me and DH get it too but our main concern is DD getting hurt and it's just not possible to keep them away from one another at home.

Aside attacking others he smashes up the house. I've had to use endless polyfiller on the walls where he has thrown things, he has smashed countless plates and cups, he has pushed my television off the unit and broke that, smashed up his tablet device that my late father bought for him. He has even smashed a glass candle holder on DH's head causing him to bleed.

Despite my best efforts I cannot curb the behaviour, this is because he has so many triggers you couldn't possibly pre empt an outburst to prevent one. For example: if his tower of blocks falls down or his tablet runs out of battery, if it's time to get out of the bath, if he's told "no" to anything at all.

I have tried all of the traditional forms of meltdown management such as creating a safe space, sensory lighting, calm down music, soothing him, giving him some space, positive reinforcement and ignoring negative behaviour, plenty of 1-1 time with either me or DH. We have tried everything reasonably possible to help and support him and it's breaking my heart, the older he gets the worse it becomes. If he continues this way then by the age of 10 he's going to have put one of us in hospital.

This evening after him pinching DD and twisting her skin so hard she had an instant bruise, trying to bite her (i got between them first) charging at her ready to headbutt her (all because his toys fell off the table) I'm ashamed to say I momentarily considered smacking him on the hand with a firm "no! we do not hit"

It was my hope, in the moment, that it would shock him and be a deterrent the next time he goes to attack.

I didn't do it, but came very close.

We tell him all the time not to hit and to use kind hands but it doesn't make any difference, still we persevere.

I'm not a cruel parent and I've never laid a finger on either of my children, DS was our rainbow baby and is so, so loved. I'm just incredibly overwhelmed and feeling hopeless and scared for not only DD's future but his. We are treading on egg shells every day so that we (mainly DD) doesn't get attacked or our property smashed. He's three for goodness sake.

If there is help to be had then we don't get any, he was diagnosed in October and O.T waiting lists are at least 12 months long.

Would I have been a bad parent if I did smack him on the hand the next time he does it? I've lost count of the amount of times I've heard people say that this generation are unruly because they have no discipline, I've always rubbished the implication that children need to be spanked to be taught how to behave but now I just don't know. nothing is helping and he's getting worse.

You want to hit him and then say "No! We do not hit!"

Yeah, that will work.

I think some kids do respond to more physical explanations, especially when they don't have the words for their feelings.

During tantrums, holding them in a hug and telling them that you are here and that they are going to calm down now works for some children.

I also find holding their hand when they've hit works well. Unlike hitting a hand (which has seems contradictory) holding a hand and saying "we don't hit" gives a clearer message and is not violence in any way. If a child bites, hold your finger against their lips and say "we don't bite." If they pull hair, show them to stroke your hair instead. Etc. So sometimes they do need a physical response or physical guidance.

Often a child who is lashing out is communicating an unmet need. When my children behave aggressively, I try to cuddle them more, more tickles, kisses, even just brushing their hair for a bit longer. Obviously in a way which is age appropriate and not irritating them! But being there for them in a more tactile way.

Children have different needs to adults. They do need us to use our bodies to redirect them, move them out of harm or trouble, be a barrier when needs be, be an anchor and physically holding them, playing with them, cuddling them etc. To restrain them on occasion, too.

I think especially children with autism can struggle to communicate their needs. But that means having to do a bit of detective work. The child who pinches, might want to have a squeeze cuddle. the child who bites, might prefer blowing raspberries. The child who hits might need some high fives.

What will a light smack do?

If it’s so light it won’t hurt then it serves no purpose.

If it’s hard enough to hurt it’s abusive.

He already has communication issues. How will telling him ‘we don’t hit’ and hitting him be at all helpful? He’ll be utterly confused.

A loud stern voice and clear command would be more effective than a smack on the hand.

My sons also have autism and it’s very difficult finding the strategies to deal with it. I’m not trying to be obstructive - I’m just saying that smacking isn’t the answer.

@evenBetter

What are people gobbling off at me? 😄 it absolutely is assault. HTH

Because your comment is so inflammatory and unkind considering how desperate and unhappy OP clearly is. I agree she shouldn’t do it but I can also empathise that she is in an awful and deeply stressful situation and doesn’t need people saying she “wants to assault disabled children”. It’s totally unnecessary. HTH!

@Warzone100

I mean the simplest solution is to take everything else out of his bedroom. Leave the bed and the play pen and let him crack on

Every sympathy OP. Just posters who haven't had such a difficult child simply can not understand his hard it is to parent such a child.

@hiredandsqueak

My son with autism was similar at that age until he was about eight. You have identified triggers but have you identified what happens afterwards? Ds used to attack all of us with little to no provocation. I worked out that he liked the shouting out "Ouch" and dd crying so did it to get the results. We addressed it by giving him an alternative means to get the same result so if he hurt me I'd say nothing but if he stroked or tickled me I'd yell ouch. I had a recording of dd crying, if he threw beanbags at targets on the wall instead of toys at our heads I'd play dd crying. I provided strips of paper for ds to tear, play doh for him to gouge his fingers, big cushions for him to wrestle, balls for him to kick and the rewards would be a yell or crying. In time as he got older and better able to communicate the aggression stopped.

This is incredible advice. You need to give him another out for his anger, something that you can praise him for choosing to do rather than attack you

You're doing an incredible job OP, remember that

@Warzone100

Just to make crystal clear to the PP who mentioned it being illegal, I was referring to a light smack with a firm "no"

I would never hurt him so long as I live.

But for it to work, it does need to hurt a bit? That’s the whole point. People also talk about giving them ‘a shock’, well it’s only a shock if it hurts.

That’s fine if that’s what you decide, but just think it through.

@AurorasGingerbreadHouse

I think some kids do respond to more physical explanations, especially when they don't have the words for their feelings.

During tantrums, holding them in a hug and telling them that you are here and that they are going to calm down now works for some children.

I also find holding their hand when they've hit works well. Unlike hitting a hand (which has seems contradictory) holding a hand and saying "we don't hit" gives a clearer message and is not violence in any way. If a child bites, hold your finger against their lips and say "we don't bite." If they pull hair, show them to stroke your hair instead. Etc. So sometimes they do need a physical response or physical guidance.

Often a child who is lashing out is communicating an unmet need. When my children behave aggressively, I try to cuddle them more, more tickles, kisses, even just brushing their hair for a bit longer. Obviously in a way which is age appropriate and not irritating them! But being there for them in a more tactile way.

Children have different needs to adults. They do need us to use our bodies to redirect them, move them out of harm or trouble, be a barrier when needs be, be an anchor and physically holding them, playing with them, cuddling them etc. To restrain them on occasion, too.

I think especially children with autism can struggle to communicate their needs. But that means having to do a bit of detective work. The child who pinches, might want to have a squeeze cuddle. the child who bites, might prefer blowing raspberries. The child who hits might need some high fives.

And this too

Oh, love, I really feel for you. You wouldn’t be a monster if you smacked him on the hand, but it wouldn’t help.

It’s scandalous that he’s not getting SALT or OT but not surprising, given how budgets have been butchered.

In the meantime, have you done any of the parenting courses on offer for parents of autistic children? We found the Barnardo’s Cygnet course run through our LA quite useful. And also the Triple-P Stepping Stones course (more for the discussion with other parents than the course material).

If you’ve exhausted all the avenues of support listed on the local offer page of your LA, it would be worth self-referring to social services via the MASH team (your LA should have addresses on their website). Sometimes they can get families in crisis more support than the usual SEND folk can. You can ask for a child in need assessment and a carer’s assessment.

I wouldn't judge you... you have a lot to cope with. But I don't think it will help either. I think you need to focus on 2 things: i) getting your DS the help he needs... it sounds like you're trying your best, and ii) keeping your DD safe and out of the firing line - whether that's a tall stairgate over a downstairs room, a room divider or a large playpen arrangement, you need to figure out a way to give her a safe space to play in.

Beyond that, there's been lots of good advice from pp above and do be kind to yourself, you're doing your best .

My heart goes out to you. It must be very difficult for all of you to manage day in day out.

Smacking his hand won't help. You will be teaching him that violence is ok.

I would put your efforts into pursuing more SEN support. Perhaps more nursery time for your daughter so she can have more time without the fear of being hurt.

I'm not sure what options are available as my knowledge or Autism is limited, but no, I don't think smacking his hand will make a positive difference 💐

Will reply more shortly just going to do bed time.

I appreciate children can lash out as a result of unmet needs but that isn't the case with DS, we meet all of his needs as best we can.

As I said these outbursts come from inconveniences to him, like his device going dead or his tower of blocks falling down. Things that can't be avoided.

It sounds incredibly hard op and no judgement from me but i agree with pps, it won't work and will likely escalate his agression. I am sorry i have no advice, i don't think i would be able to cope in your situation, you sound amazing and i have nothing but admiration for you.

Firstly your dealing with a very very tough situation and will know from his autism that he's having the meltdowns as he's struggling to process/communicate/it's all getting too much.

I don't think it will help though.
I suggest finding local autistic support groups on Facebook or elsewhere that can offer advice and tips on how to help deal with it. You might find that he is directing it more at his sister as he sees the attention and that adds to his frustration.

Does he respond to a favourite toy being removed? You might have to do it a few times for him to get that if he attacks his sister then he gets it taken away. It's something which worked for my friends autistic son but each child is different with it.

@AurorasGingerbreadHouse he could still bang his head off the walls and floor tho :(

It's insane to hit a kid and then say "we do not hit". Eh? What sort of message is that teaching him? It's okay for Mummy to hit but not for him? That ain't gonna fly in a kid's mind.

It sounds like a really difficult situation but hitting him to teach him not to hit really isn't the answer.

@Warzone100

I don't mean unmet needs as in not fed/clothes/loved. I mean the unmet needs a child struggles to communicate like needing you to be their weighted blanket, to help them regulate their breathing and heart rate, to help them feel anchored to the floor and more emotionally regulated. I was explaining it in a more simplistic way, but often the detective work is harder than that. His need seems to be for things not to go wrong? So you need to help him to know that that is ok and he can deal with it in a different way. With my child it was holding him through a lot of it. He didn't have a way of communicating beyond lashing out and tantrums, but I had to find a way to help him through. That would have been a disaster with my other child, who needs peace quiet and space to calm downs

My child was a biter. I had 12 months of no/removing/time out . Consistently. I finally lost my temper when he drew blood on me (had happened before) . I bit him back... I didn’t mark him but he felt it. He never bit again. My view is sometimes children don’t understand the implications of what they do, as in it hurts. All my child understood was he got the toy/he got attention. So whilst I would not say this was my best moment as a parent, and wouldn’t recommend, it isnt something I overthink either.

You want to teach your DS not to hit by hitting him. Right. Well that’s not going to work is it.

I think you should speak to GP / HV as you’re in need of more support.

Hitting him won’t help.

I was hit as a child and ended up really struggling with hitting other kids because that's what's was modelled to me. Someone is "misbehaving", hit them. Getting in trouble for that was confusing and upsetting

I don't think you've had the right kind of help or sufficient help with your dc @Warzone100 - I know it's exhausting when the wait lists are huge and you're treated as a nuisance.

I don't think a tap on the hand would help, but I'd completely understand getting pushed to that extent in your shoes.

How does your dc sleep? I second posting on SN chat and also if you've got local fb groups for autism, join those, and phone some related charities for advice.

It took me ages to find the right strategies and a lot of the standard ones failed as every child is unique in their own way.

I have done it myself out of desperation when my own toddler son (who I don’t think is autistic) wouldn’t stop hitting, kicking and pushing his baby sister and I was scared he would really hurt her and nothing I had tried was working.

So I totally understand why you are considering doing it.

But honestly, it won’t change anything. It stopped him momentarily but soon after he was hitting her again. He just didn’t connect one thing with another, actions and consequences.

Also it’s hard to teach a child not to hit when you are doing it yourself. And it was heartbreaking when he later said “Mummy hit me” in a cute sad little voice.

I have not yet found a solution but I find that moving him to a different room and talking to him and hugging him can help. Obviously this might be more challenging with an autistic child.

I hope you get the help you need, your situation does sound really difficult.

This is insane. Lightly smacking a child on the hand is not "assault". The world has truly gone mad.

Yep

The only thing that resonates to me is that if you did hit you'd be increasing distress to an autistic kid, even if I'm not calm myself I find both dc can react worse.

Even shouting if a child is in overload is transmitting to them that they are right to be scared. I have a robotic calm voice I switch on with a LOT of practice.

All of the folks bashing on about the usual mn bun fight about smacking have missed the real issues.

You also need respite, I know where is that going to come from eh? Virtual unmumsnetty hugs to you.