To ask if you feel you morally deserve your wealth

[Nc1028]

No judgment, genuinely interested (and bored!)

Read about the idea that people want to have money but also want to believe that they morally deserve the money. For example, those who earned their wealth are more likely to believe they deserve it because of hard work, whereas those who inherited wealth are more likely to feel guilty. Stay-at-home partners also tended to feel guilty if their partners are high earners/have inherited wealth when they haven’t earned/inherited wealth themselves. Everyone try to emphasise on their productiveness, not wanting to be cast as “rich and lazy”.

Wondering what people think?
If you have money, do you think you deserve what you have?
Do you think people who have a lot more money deserve what they have?

(Light hearted. Yes your money is none of anyone’s business but money is such a taboo topic, fun to talk about)

I don't think I'm more worthy of wealth but equally don't feel less worthy of it. It's just the lucky hand I've been dealt. I did make some choices among my luck that have led me here but I knew I didn't want to not be wealthy so I looked for certain types of opportunities.

And we're not stinking rich, just very comfortable.

In answer to your question, yes I do believe I deserve everything I have, because I am in the position to help people (which I do regularly)

I am very grateful for what I have, and also happy that I can change the lives of others.

@Cam77

A generalization, but there are two kinds of rich people - A) those who create real products/services/employment. I don’t think there is any moral issue here as long as no monopolies are created and adequate portion of wealth is redistributed via taxation.

B) those who just play/manipulate the financial markets, often with the option of government bail out if it goes tits up. Those who just buy up sold off public services for a pittance and then offer no improvements or try to monopolize smaller start ups. Those who place profit above fair treatment of workers and the environment. Those who manufacture/sell arms.
Plenty of ethical issues there.

Definitely with this ^^

I have made personal sacrifices and given up hedonism in my youth to build firm foundations and it has paid off. Constantly I strive to make sure that all my business dealings are honourable.

The question I subconsciously carry around with me is not "Is this wealth being made honourably?" it is more that I ask myself "Can I spend or give this money away knowing it has been honestly earned?"

No.
I don’t consider myself wealthy, I have to work for a living. I’m still paying off a mortgage, but I live in a nice house in a nice neighbourhood with two kids in private school.
I was lucky to be born in a rich developed country. I was lucky to have parents who cared for me and love me. I was lucky to have educational opportunities. I was lucky to marry a responsible man. Etc.

None of us are self made; we all live in networks; we are communal beings. Some of us get more opportunities and disproportionate benefits from our networks. Only a fool wouldn’t be humble.

We're quite comfortable and plan to retire next year, selling our business and hoping for a buyer who will continue to employ our half dozen employees on the same terms we have offered them. We would not be happy to sell to the highest bidder if we knew their first act would be to get rid of our hand-picked staff to employ cheaper employees. And the business would nose dive if that happened, so they'd be shooting themselves in the foot.

No, the main emotions I feel about the wealth we have are freedom and guilt. We do pay a lot of tax and make big donations to organisations we care about, which helps alleviate the guilt.

I will, in a few years time, be in a very fortunate position financially - not enough to retire on, but enough to buy a house outright. It will make our combined salary (which is pretty good by any standards, but not six figures or anything insane) feel like a LOT of money.

The money will come from sale of a business, which I've been very integral to, and have devoted a huge portion of my working life so far to. Having grown up in a council house hiding from the bailiffs, there'll be an element of guilt to that - I've worked no harder than my mum did (and does) as a cleaner and dinner lady, yet I'll benefit far, far more financially. But then I will also be proud of what I've achieved so I'll 'deserve' it in that sense.

I know someone who was born with a gold Amex in her mouth and she fully believes she deserves it. Because her daddy worked so hard exploiting underpaid overseas workers and therefore she deserves to inherit it all. Now that annoys me.

My DH works very hard, my parents work very hard. I don’t really know how I feel.
I’m very clever and went to the same graduate programme as DH and worked in a similar field. I felt burnt out after two years and City life wasn’t for me. I’m working on a PhD now and have a toddler, but feel quite a bit like a SAHM or the cliche of “ladies who lunch”. It’s not great for my self esteem and I want to be earning more. But I also see that it’s great for my daughter to have a hands on parent who is around and has energy to do loads of activities etc. So I don’t know. I don’t feel I don’t deserve it because I support him a lot and facilitate his happy family life. But equally I feel a bit sick spending lots of money on things when I’m bringing in so little.

I don't equate money / tax with morality. I work hard, I earn well, I don't feel any guilt for they nor do I feel I should pay a higher amount of tax.

Hmmm not sure I'd say I'm wealthy....
but I own 1m worth of property
No help from parents, left home at 15, no degree,

I have done quite well out of property... but I think it was pure luck and sheer determination to succeed. As I left home with nothing! Also just good timing

No pension, but I save a lot, pay off things quickly, and have good credit, so if the opportunity arises I can buy more etc..... I work for myself too.
Being a single mum for the best part of 15 years!! Helps with the frugal thing
But we have a nice life so no complaints here 😀

equally it would be immoral to use the talents gifted to you, go to waste and do nothing with. the work i did and my dh did certainly was physically and mentally harder than many other job options we did not choose an easy path.
i am grateful for the opportunities that presented in my lifetime.
i deserve every penny i get.

I very much doubt that anybody with a serious amount of money in their bank account feels the slightest bit guilty, irrespective of how they came by it

Largely agree with that. If they do feel quilty, they can easily share some of it by supporting charities/good causes/ people they care about. I'd do that and be happy. The only undeserving are those who earn by crime imo.
I agree also with the well-to-do posters who say it's mostly luck. Why wouldn't you deserve luck? It's rare to be lucky on all fronts, so others are lucky with health or romantically or having a talent.
For some it's money but they may wish it was something else. So I think very few would feel really guilty.

It’s multi layered I think.

I come from a very ‘well-off’ family and had what I am fully aware was an extremely privileged upbringing. My parents were never ostentatious or flashy - but we lived in a lovely home, had an excellent education and were lucky enough to have lots of holidays etc. We weren’t spoilt, but there’s no denying I had a wonderful childhood (and not just because of money, there was a lot of love as well thankfully!) purely because I was lucky enough to be born into it.

But my parents also ensured we were fully aware that we were lucky and that those who are in an position to help others should do so - my dad has given regularly to charity for as long as I can remember and now volunteers for the food bank (aged 73!)

So in terms of the familial wealth, no I don’t ‘deserve’ it (or no more than anyone else) and yes I do feel a certain amount of guilt (if that’s the right word) that so many children live in poverty and will never have the opportunities I had.

But equally, I’ve worked incredibly hard to build a successful career in a professional role which enables me to earn a good salary and combined with DH’s salary we are able to live very comfortably (though I hasten to add we’re not rolling in it by any means!). But whilst you could say we ‘deserve’ a nice lifestyle from working hard, I am fully conscious of the fact that had I not had wealthy parents I wouldn’t have had many of the opportunities I’ve had. I’m also aware that unlike many people we have a ‘safety net’ of knowing if we fell on hard times my family could help out, and that I will eventually inherit some money. I certainly don’t ‘deserve’ that more than anyone else- it’s simply luck.

So a bit of a mix - yes there are some genuine ‘rags to riches’ stories but imo many people who do very well (materially) in life have been enabled by their upbringing / past / family situation.

Wow there are so many wealthy people on mumsnet.

Sort of.

I expect truly wealthy would not think much of my earnings but I’ve done pretty well and made it myself. No hand outs. Nice poor middle class upbringing in big family but not loads to go around but education and reading mattered. Think that helped my work ethic. I work in a profession with six figure salary and bonuses. Live up north so have a nice house in a nice area. Down to last 100k on the mortgage and will have it paid off by 43. 44 at a push. Drive modest car and have a few nice things which I’ve bought with bonuses after slogging guts out on projects. Nothing major but a couple of genuine mulberry bags and some genuine antique items from auction. Live quite rurally and have genuine barbours and good quality boots etc (covered in mud from dog walking). I don’t look wealthy and I really appreciate everything I have knowing what it’s like to have not a lot. At uni I worked my arse off and held down jobs and worked all through holidays 50-60 hours a week when my mates from Russell group uni were having adventures in Europe and round the world trips. I give to charity and am good at buying for friends and treating people to meals and first to get the round in. Happy to be in a position to do so. Job very stressful and has aged me in some respects but as I’ve got more senior have had some fabulous experiences and travel. Constant sacrifice between work and family life so it’s not all a bed of roses. On the whole I feel that it’s reasonable to earn what I do. But I do and have questioned it. Some share options paid out and I struggled to accept what felt like a lot of money.

One thing I have noticed is the surprise from friends that I’ve been as successful as I have career wise. I’m a relatively humble and self deprecating person and think it has come as a shock. People from my past have occasionally been rude about it in a “why you?” way. I have more steel than it seems on a surface level.

I don’t think I morally deserve it exactly but think on the whole I have definitely worked for it. I appreciate that there has been a huge dollop of luck involved too.

Yep.

I earnt a lot of money in the 80s/early 90s in the City. 12 hour days and rigid discipline.
Met DH who was struggling and supported him. He has spent a lifetime working 12 to 14 hour days and because he has a brain like a planet developed a niche practice.
Had 8years off and started another career - worked like stink and now director level 16 years later.
I inherited from my grandparents/father in my early 40s - they both had worked unbelievably hard and grandad and father arrived in the UK as refugees.
I look back on the discipline, the hard work, the kindness and the fairness. And also on the not insubstantial amounts of tax that have been paid.
So no, I have no issue whatsoever.

Inherited a substantial amount when my mother died which enabled me to take voluntary early retirement from work aged 58. I've had some sadness in my life - father died when I was barely an adult, was unable to have children, so in some ways I feel it is a payback of sorts.

My husband and I both started to work in the same field at the bottom , like most.
My husband got a number of promotions very quickly.
I had two children and stayed at home ( both our choice.) We had some very lean years, relying on charity shops, second hand goods and thrifty meals.
My husband then did a degree and got more promotions.
I returned to work when my youngest was five.

After 40 years , my husband has retired on a generous pension and I will have a couple of small pensions when I retire ( soon) so , yes, we deserve it.

I'm a SAHM and don't feel an ounce of guilt that my partner earns well.

In fact, if anything, I feel like I've sacrificed more for the family than he has and thus am entitled to at least half of our wealth with no guilt.

Being "deserving" of wealth is so subjective. Jobs don't always pay what they're worth. Ie a footballer isn't worth their salary. And a nurse is worth more than theirs.

@EmpressoftheMundane

None of us are self made; we all live in networks; we are communal beings. Some of us get more opportunities and disproportionate benefits from our networks. Only a fool wouldn’t be humble.

I think that's quite profound. My father is a "self made man", was an orphan, left home at 15 and made his fortune. He is quite humble in some ways, but as a very wealthy individual he seems to look down on people who had a similar background to him and then don't end up doing really well too. "If I can do it so can you" sort of attitude.

And a lot of career success comes down to luck. Right place at the right time. Face fits. That kind of thing.

We have plenty of money, all of it earned/made/saved by our own hard work.

Interesting thread

I don't really believe that anyone is more deserving than anyone else.

I used to think I had earned my money. Certainly no-one gave it to me and I have studied very hard and worked long hours in a demanding job. A lot of people would say I did earn it.

But then I think of all the advantages I did not earn

Born in a Western country
White Caucasian did not experience racism
Middle class. Never worried about lack of food, clothing or a roof over my head.
Lovely parents who cared for me and were educated themselves and supported my education and did not abuse or mistreat me
Good education
Good health

If other people had all those advantages who is to say they would not have done just as well.

So I try not to take credit undeservedly and to give back where I can to those who didn't have my advantages

If you go round believing you deserve and are entitled to stuff then in my experience you'll never be happy. Better to be thankful for what you were given.