BIL and SIL - do we call them out on this?

[Nutbutter]

We’ve just had our second baby 2 weeks ago. DC1 is 18 months. It’s been quite tough in lockdown with no support as all our family live far away and DH is working long hours. The exception is BIL and SIL (DH’s brother and his wife), who live a 15 min drive away. Before BIL was with SIL (he’s been with SIL 4 years and married for 2) we were really close. We’ve always been friendly towards SIL but don’t think she likes us and we only see them now when initiated by us. BIL is happy to let her control his social life and it apparently doesn’t include seeing us much!

Anyway, since the baby was born BIL has only texted congrats. All other family members have sent presents and cards and called us for facetimes, and all our local friends have dropped round food and come to say hello to the baby on the doorstep. I feel really offended that BIL and SIL basically haven’t acknowledged their new nephew. To be clear, it’s not the lack of gift that’s upset me but the fact that it shows they don’t care about us, which I find really sad. By contrast, when their other brother had a baby earlier this year BIL and SIL travelled the significant distance to see them.

I feel like we should speak to them and basically ask if there’s something we’ve done to offend them. DH just wants to let it go and accept that his bro doesn’t want a close relationship with us anymore.

So as not to drip feed, they are expecting their first baby in the new year. I was really hoping the cousins could be close.

I think you need to drop this one @Nutbutter. You won't change them and anything will simply get in the way of the relationship. If BIL wanted to do something for his brother he would. I'd focus less on BIL and SIL and try to find opportunities for cousins to get together - accepting for the next decade that includes them, but in time they can have their own relationship too.

What to inlaws (grandparents) think?

I think one of the most important lessons new parents can learn is that not everybody is, or even has to be, as interested in your baby as you want them to be. It sucks, but it is how it is and calling them out would be so cringey

@luckylavender no we’re not in touch with his ex. Would have liked to have been but would have been too weird in the circumstances! We haven’t spoken to her since their breakup 4 years ago.

@Irisheyesrsmiling PILs probably have no idea, and we would never say anything to them about it. They always update us on how BIL and SIL are when we speak to them though (which is how I know the pregnancy etc is going well) so maybe they know we’re not in regular contact. I should also say that DS1 absolutely adores BIL whjch is why we make such an effort to keep up contact.

Really shocked by some of the replies on here.

It costs nothing, takes seconds, and isnt affected by the bloody pandemic to send a nice text message or have a quick facetime call.

The OP wasnt asking for presents, visits and gushing as some people are making out.

Its extremely heartless and nasty of your BIL and SIL to not have even acknowledged the photos of their new nephew.

Disgusting behaviour from them despite people trying to justify that with stress over work and being heavily pregnant.

OP I see that you still want to, in my opinion, display normal behaviour when they have their child and i completely understand that. But please dont go out your way to do this. Try to withdraw.

Iv experienced similar with very disappointing effort from my mum to my DC. Its taken years to get here but this year my effort for her birthday and Christmas will match that of hers to my children.

it feels really petty and like iv lowered myself to her standards but perhaps she will now see how hurtful it is.

@Nutbutter - so hard. I honestly don't know what to say. It's hard to see people not care as much as you hope they would. Hoping post pandemic things improve for you all!

I think perhaps the birthday party is colouring how you feel?

SIL might not like Op or her husband, but the party was for BIL & surely then who he would have wanted there?

They could probably "justify" it by saying the baby or no other family, but they could have asked just Op's husband.

Taken in isolation the not fawning over baby probably wouldn't be noticed.

But you can't force them, Op.

@wowfudge and @ViewsAreMine SIL volunteered to me that they conceived first month trying. It could be a lie I guess but they know I’ve had multiple miscarriages so not sure why she would lie about it. They’ve also had loads going on since their wedding with changes in job, big holidays and house purchase so makes sense that they wouldn’t have tried for a baby before now. Again, don’t think they’d be jealous that we are having baby 2. Assume they’ll go on to have another later - they’re both young.

Totally possible there’s stuff going on that we don’t know about, but PILs keep telling us they’re both really well.

Anyway, I’m really just answering these qs because I’m trapped under a feeding baby. I agree it’s best not to say anything and should just accept they’re not interested atm.

@diddl

I think perhaps the birthday party is colouring how you feel?

SIL might not like Op or her husband, but the party was for BIL & surely then who he would have wanted there?

They could probably "justify" it by saying the baby or no other family, but they could have asked just Op's husband.

Taken in isolation the not fawning over baby probably wouldn't be noticed.

But you can't force them, Op.

@diddl it was a surprise party organised by SIL so BIL had no input into the guest list. She told BIL she thought we wouldn’t have wanted to come because of the baby but didn’t check that with us first. We would definitely have come!

I actually think it’s possible that she really did think that we wouldn’t want to come though. I’m a lot less upset by that than by their (non) reaction to the baby, I think because I feel sad for my baby at the thought that his aunt and uncle aren’t interested. Hormones definitely playing a part too.

I think you have to just let things lie for now. And certainly don't rush round or be gushing when baby arrives, they clearly don't want it. Don't force the cousins close in age thing either.

@Bluntness100

Out of interest, how do you/would you behave if your sibling had a baby?

I think if it was the middle of lock down, second child. and I was a Covid risk I’d do what they did to protect you all

Don’t think it would occur to me you’d need an immediate gift and couldn’t wait,

It's not a question of 'need'. If you couldn't see the family (and had no idea when you could) you'd send something. Or most people would.

MN can be a separate universe sometimes.

OP, congrats on your baby! I haven't read the replies but I couldn't read and run.
I know how you feel. I was in the same situation and I was very hurt at the time, but I never mentioned it to DH. It took so much energy to try and keep it to myself.
I eventually confided in a close friend and it was like a weight was lifted. I decided to stop thinking about it. I have my own friends and family, so I give my time to them.
That was years ago now and I am glad that I didnt react to it for the sake of my Dh. You have my sympathies. There really is no excuse for their crappy behaviour, but I would advise you to accept the situation and dont waste any energy thinking about it.
Enjoy the time with your new baby. Take lots of pics and videos xxx

I don't think you're unreasonable to expect a bit more input than a single text, given what is usual in the family.

I do think you may be a bit unreasonable in expecting calls, presents etc within 2 weeks of birth during lockdown ...

YABU OP.

@bluegreygreen

I don't think you're unreasonable to expect a bit more input than a single text, given what is usual in the family.

I do think you may be a bit unreasonable in expecting calls, presents etc within 2 weeks of birth during lockdown ...

Just why does lockdown prevent a phonecall??

@Nutbutter I’m flat to the mat wfh. I’m not pregnant, but I have kids that normally live away from home back here and it’s challenging. I have family shit going on that I don’t want to share with my boyfriend’s brother because we aren’t close and it’s not his business.

I don’t have the headspace to take on to phone anyone.

I wouldn’t be in a group chat with my husbands brother like she is. I would leave. So she’s doing more than I would already

If your husband and his brother want to be in touch they will be.

What I mean is. As far as my in laws (they’re not, but you get what I mean) know, everything is fine in my life.

I was really hurt years ago when I had my second daughter. She was born a few months before my DSIS’sfirst child. I travelled back to my home country with my two daughters when the baby was 8 weeks old to spend thanksgiving with my family and introduce new baby. My DM thought it would be good idea to plan baby shower for my DSIS’s soon to be burn baby and I could introduce my baby at this party (other than my DH, I have no family in England).

Some people just don’t think second baby’s (or even later babies) arrival are as special as first born. This may/may not be contributing factor

But don’t “call them out” as it would only add to any difficulty with getting close

You could take the high road and when they have their baby, be supportive. You could take an active role in keeping in touch for the children to develop a cousin bond.

I get how you’re feeling, but you can’t force people to feel the same way you do.

Congratulations on your baby

I don't think it does. I was thinking more of visits to the house etc - sorry I wasn't clear.

I've been working throughout COVID (NHS). It's been a very strange time with changing schedules etc and a couple of weeks can easily pass before I realise - and very easily before I would have a present sorted. I would definitely have been in touch more though.

@Calligraphy572 and @Irisheyesrsmiling if you RTFR, you’ll see OP has already said she won’t be saying anything, so she has ‘let it go’ as ‘dropped it’.

YABU. The birth of a baby isn’t a big deal to anyone except the parents and grandparents.

Expecting other people to go out of their way during a pandemic no less is ridiculous.

To be fair neither we, nor OP, know the BiL's and SiL's side of the story here. But it's interesting that when there's a breakdown of understanding or communication between a male relative and his wife, the man's family of origin always assumes it's the woman who is to blame.

This will sound unhelpful to the OP, but they may both be keeping their distance for reasons that seem good to them. In general I suspect it would take more to make someone back off entirely from a relationship with their partner's family of origin than merely the knowledge that you have little in common and don't particularly like each other. It's not too hard to maintain occasional contact and the basic civilities in those circumstances. When schisms move beyond this there is usually a bigger reason. And it's only been two weeks: you don't know yet that it is a schism.

What is the case, though, is that if BiL is lax in communicating with his own brother then this failing is his alone.

OP it has to be hurtful when someone shows less commitment to any relationship than you expect. It's bound to feel like a rejection, which as social animals we are primed to painful and to take very personally. I don't blame you for the way you feel, but agree with the recommendations of most posters that it's far better to say nothing.

Congratulations on your new little son

Two brothers have babies. One brother gets a visit from a third brother. The other only gets a text from the third brother. Is that it? OR do you mean SIL’s brother had a baby and got a visit and BIL’s brother (your husband) had a baby and only gets a text? I just want to clarify, since I wasn’t sure which it was. If it’s the former, yes, it’s possible you’ve done something to offend her or she just feels more comfortable with the other brother, and if it’s the latter, then she’s prioritizing her own family, which sucks, but isn’t unheard of and probably has nothing to do with you.

YANBU in feeling that something is off. From everything you've said, they want to distance themselves and avoid fostering close ties with your family. Whereas you're looking at the 15 minute drive as a positive, they may see it as a threat. Some people are like that. They might be worried that if they keep up the ties you're going to be in and out of each other's houses all the time.

Personally, I would also consider a text from a sibling to count as the very bare minimum.

You would be unreasonable to mention anything. Put aside any visions of cousin closeness - this is not what they're aiming for. Be polite and do the minimum back until such a time as they choose to take a step forward. If they don't, that's fine too. You can't force anything.

@RightYesButNo

Two brothers have babies. One brother gets a visit from a third brother. The other only gets a text from the third brother. Is that it? OR do you mean SIL’s brother had a baby and got a visit and BIL’s brother (your husband) had a baby and only gets a text? I just want to clarify, since I wasn’t sure which it was. If it’s the former, yes, it’s possible you’ve done something to offend her or she just feels more comfortable with the other brother, and if it’s the latter, then she’s prioritizing her own family, which sucks, but isn’t unheard of and probably has nothing to do with you.

It’s the first one - DH is one of three brothers. Their youngest bro (who lives a couple of hundred miles away) got a visit from BIL and SIL (plus a load of gifts and social media posts about how BIL and SIL adore new niece), whereas we just got a text. None of SIL’s siblings have kids yet.

As I’ve said I don’t expect a visit, especially given lockdown, but the comparison between their reaction to other BIL’s baby and our baby is striking. Both second babies btw. And the fact that they went all out for other BIL makes all the comments about “no one cares about other people’s/second babies” irrelevant here.

Other BIL is lovely but very different from DH and BIL - he’s much younger and stayed in their home town. DH and BIL are only a year apart, went to the same uni and then moved to the same city after graduating, which is pretty far from home. BIL lived with DH and then DH and me for years in our early 20s, whereas we only tend to see younger BIL a few times a year.

@MarieIVanArkleStinks you make some good points. The issues did start when BIL got together with SIL but could be coincidence. Tbh I think the issue is primarily with BIL rather than SIL - if he really cared he’d put the effort in. What I’m not clear about is whether it’s coming from a place of laziness or whether there’s an issue. Similarly, if it is laziness, I’d expect SIL to step in as she seemingly does with all his other social stuff, but she hasn’t. Again I’m not sure whether this is because she has some problem with us or whether it’s just that she prioritises her own friends and family. That’s really why I wondered whether it was worth having a conversation about it but the resounding answer has been no to that.