To have made DH apologise to DS?

[PleaseLetItBeNapTime]

Sorry if this is a bit of a ramble...

I was in the kitchen making dinner. DS(4) has dinner at nursery and isn’t really hungry when he gets home so will just have fruit/ yoghurt/ crisps and be fine. DS decided that he wanted some wotsits. DS is particularly attached to the “rainbow” shaped ones and tends to leave them to the side and eat them last if he eats them at all. We’ve had tears before when he’s accidentally broken one. Rediculous I know, but he is only just 4 and he isn’t generally the sensitive type.

Anyway, DS is in the living room with DH and I hear him crying and he sounds inconsolable. I call him to the kitchen and he tells me “daddy’s eaten my rainbow”. DH follows and his attitude is so self righteous. I asked DH to apologise. He refused and said that DS’s reaction was disproportionate. I said he shouldn’t be eating DS’s crisps without asking. DH continues to refuse to say sorry, saying it’s not a big deal. I did tell DS that DH was being naughty at that point, which on reflection probably wasn’t appropriate. I told DH clearly it was a big deal for DS and he eventually says sorry and goes off in a huff. DS calms down, goes off to play, and is fine.

I asked DH to talk to me about the incident awhile later and he basically told me that he doesn’t believe I should have expected him to apologise to DS. He thinks I was out of line for labelling his behaviour as naughty and he was hurt that following the incident DS said he didn’t want to sit next to him.

I personally think the thought that he shouldn’t have to apologise is a form of toxic parenting - we need to mirror the behaviours we expect from DS and that includes admitting that we are wrong sometimes and apologising. DH has basically ignored me for the rest of the evening and still believes I’m wrong.

So WIBU? I’m genuinely interest to hear from people who think I was who can articulate why because I’m struggling to understand how DH is so firm in his position.

Thanks

I don’t think it’s snowflakey at all. It’s about basic respect. I can’t be doing with snowflakes but I think that’s a different thing.

Eye roll at snowflake.
I agree with you op. He should have apologized for taking something nthat didn't belong to him without asking. Why didn't your dh get his own pack anyway? Taking the favourite food knowingly off of a tired child and refusing to say for doing so is really stubborn and infantile.
You shouldn't have called him naughty but I think you know that.

It does matter that it was one. Because as I keep saying even if he HAD asked for permission DH might have eaten the wrong one.
Had he eaten the whole bag and left none for DS that would be a different story.
We are not calling the small hurt child a ‘snowflake’. And DH was called naughty to his face. In front of his small child. We are saying that this behaviour creates snowflakes.

If DH said to DS ‘you are a snowflake’ that would be a bit unkind. But if he said, ‘hey look come on, it was one wotsit. Let’s look for more.’ Or as I said to DS over his Happyland saga ‘come on let’s snuggle up and read a book and we can think about this later’...

Just because a small child is hurt doesn’t mean that the small child is RIGHT. It’s possible to acknowledge their emotion (yes it’s so sad and disappointing isn’t it) without apologising for something that doesn’t need apologising for.

As I said it demeans what an apology really is.

In my book, you apologise for taking someone else’s food without asking!

@minipie - exactly! Our dynamic is the same.

He does expect logical behaviour from DS. I feel at times he does expect the behaviour and emotions of a significantly older child.

This is the kind of incidental thing which happens in most families all of the time, without it ending in a complete drama and splashed all over Mumsnet! It really won't damage your child, because his father sneaked the wrong kind of Wotsit. It's not as though he wrestled your ds to the floor and ran off with the whole bag.

It's the rough and tumble of family life which helps children to negotiate their way through the complexities of rubbing along with other people. If you had just comforted your child instead of directing the whole dramatic scene, your dh and ds might well have come to their own reconciliation over the 'incident'. Pick your battles and don't sweat the small stuff have never been more appropriate!

WTF do you think its going to achieve telling off your HB in front of your toddler? In that situation I would have cuddled the son and distracted him/ took him off to play and then discuss with HB later. Really not worth arguing in front of a child.

Your dh probably reacted like that because of the way you reacted. Way ott. If my dp did this to me over a crisp I would probably told him where to go. Similarly if my 4 year old had reacted that way I would probably tell him not to be so ridiculous.

Totally agree with this. The dynamic in the house is shown straight away in this sentence... DS is in the living room with DH and I hear him crying and he sounds inconsolable. I call him to the kitchen and he tells me “daddy’s eaten my rainbow” that instantly shows that you don't trust your DH with your son and feel the need to get involved (lots of women do this) Maybe if you hadn't called him to the kitchen they would have sorted it out quicker and in their own way. You undermined your DH instantly.

Maybe if you had left them to it DH would have said "oh I'm really sorry I didn't know you wanted that one, shall we find another" or some other such platitude (since you say he's a nice guy normally) and it wouldn't have escalated.

The escalation came from the OP, not the DH who behaved (as the majority of people would if they were told off by another adult) defensively.

Slightly off topic but, rainbow wotsits?! Where can I get these cheesy wonders? I went to Tesco tonight and not a rainbow shaped puffed corn snack in sight

Sometimes I think my eyes actually deceive me on MN. I couldn't honestly have just read some ridiculous overly dramatic nonsense about a 4 year old crying because daddy took one of his crisps, and the dad was chastised like a naughty boy.

I'm definitely going to Specsavers tomorrow. I keep reading absolute ridiculous things on here. This one is right up there.

There is no such thing as a snowflake. Its just a derogatory term used to insult. Its like saying - teaching a child that what they feel doesnt matter creates assholes.

A whotsit may not be important to you. You are not a child. Pretend for a second that you've had a rough day and you are tired. That you ve saved a glass of wine to relax with. You are really looking forward to it. And DH knowing all of the above drank it. When you show you are upset, DH minimses it and refuses to apologise.

Would we all be calling you a snowflake for being upset? I dont think so.

You shouldn't have said your husband was 'naughty,' but he should've apologized if he knew those particular crisps were meant for DS.

Did he eat one crisp or all of them? ONE crisp makes me think you're ridiculous. The pack...not so much.

Not being a snowflake in the case that someone helps themselves to something that is yours

Is to say that's not yours. You shouldn't have done that. That was out of order etc. Which is not likely from a 4yo to dad. Who I suspect would not react well.

If you're teaching your kids it doesn't matter if someone helps themselves to something that belongs to the kid.

You're not raising resilient, non snowflake children. You're raising doormats.

*"Children need to learn resilience"

In other words they need to learn that what is important to them isnt important. That people who love them can hurt them and not have to say sorry. And that basically kids dont have a voice in any case?!*

No, resilience is about being able to carry on in the face of adversity. To bounce back when things don’t go your way. Like when someone eats your favourite crisp.

What a complete and utter over reaction to a child crying about a crisp - God help you when you’ve got an actual parenting dilemma to deal with.

@HunkyPunk

Very sensible advice.

@MrsP1991

I'd have done exactly the same as you. And my dp would have said sorry.

We are both ftp and learning as we go I suppose but we both sometimes correct what needs correcting in order to teach/ set a good example. Such as dp says 'telly' I say we don't say telly daddy it's tv/ television. Daddy says oh yes sorry... then it's done with.

I don't think it's fair to just take from a child as surely that's just teaching them they can take from another / younger child? If mine has a full bar of chocolate or something big I don't want her having all of, I say mummy has to try it first to make sure it's ok sometimes I'll ask for something she's eating to teach/ remind of sharing. When I have something like crisps I'll do the same kind of thing to teach her I share etc

I agree with all you said/ did.

Jesus Christ. I've read it all now

We don't say telly daddy.

You really say this to another adult

I'd tell you to GTF

He’s 4! And tired. And show me an MNer who wouldn’t be irate if they saved their favourite bit of a snack for last and their h just reached out and had it for himself. It’s shitty behaviour.

I couldn't disagree more.

Teaching children that people will take their stuff if they want it and it's not something to make a fuss about is a shit message.

We are raising doormats for not apologising over ONE accidentally ingested rainbow wotsit?

Sigh.

Lots of things are important to children. And sometimes they are disappointed over them. They also need to learn to deal with disappointment when due to an accident/something inadvertent things go wrong. It doesn’t create doormats. And it doesn’t create resilience and he is not going to mental health problems from this.
It’s gently teaching kids perspective.

If someone takes your lunch away and leaves you hungry in school, make a big fuss.
If daddy eats the wrong wotsit, not such a big fuss.

Kids are capable of nuance you know. And the earlier we teach them that, the better.

I don’t think it’s a it telling them not to make a fuss, but the OP turned a minor drama into a whole production complete with sequel and after show party.

It’s the OPs disproportionality I cant get over. Comfort the child, find him another “rainbow” and let dad fix his relationship with his child. I know how I’d respond if my DH told my child I had been “naughty”.

DH ate my last chocolate barfi from Diwali today. He was mumbling about needing something sweet. I assumed he knew that the last barfi was mine but clearly not.

I rolled my eyes, and said, OI. And got on with it. Because DH is a kind man, who is an equal parent and a father and I am not going to go apeshit over this one act.

If he was a selfish idiot who was consistently thoughtless then this barfi might be the straw that breaks the camel’s back.

It’s all about...perspective.

*If you're teaching your kids it doesn't matter if someone helps themselves to something that belongs to the kid.

You're not raising resilient, non snowflake children. You're raising doormats.*

Its a bloody crisp for crying out loud. Yes teach your children it is not acceptable to take a strangers car. But they also need to know a family member helping themself to one crisp/chip or whatever isnt a hanging offence.

''If someone takes your lunch away and leaves you hungry in school, make a big fuss.
If daddy eats the wrong wotsit, not such a big fuss.'

Yeah I'm not sure.

4 is pretty little.

Learning that it's ok for people to take your stuff (whatever it is) at that age is not great.

I'm trying to think of what my kids liked. Say for instance they had a few jelly babies and black is favourite. I know this. They have put the one black one to the side to eat last. I snaffle it.

It's a dick move. It just is.

Tbf op only said the naughty thing after the h got all stubborn and refused to say sorry. That would have pissed me off too. But then I left my ex who’s v similar by the sound of it. Selfish, thoughtless arse who thinks he can do no wrong.