To dump DP over his female friend.

[femalefriend]

When DP and I first got together, he opened up a conversation about his female best friend. The reason he initiated the conversation is because this female friend had caused lots of issues for him in his last relationship. He told me that he uses this friend as a confidant, she is the only one he can really be himself around without judgement, they go out for dinner, drinks, nights out. They also kissed on an occasion when they were teenagers. He wanted to know my thoughts as his ex had not liked this friendship and it was one of the contributing factors for them splitting up.

I was honest and said I don't think most women would like to idea of their DP regularly opening up to another woman, going for dinners, going for nights out just the two of them etc. It wasn't something I felt overly comfortable with and could understand why his ex didn't like it either. He said he understood my position and was happy to adapt this friendship into something that wouldn't cause anymore issues for him. Fine.

There have been a couple of instances now relating to this friend. In the first instance, they went for dinner one evening, he never told me about it and I found out much later down the line. This caused an argument as I felt he had lied in the first instance by pretending to be happy to adapt his friendship, and also indirectly lied by not telling me about it.

Every time we go through a difficult patch this 'friend' seems to appear in a big way. After we had an argument about something unrelated he went on a night out with her after work, then booked tickets for them to go to a concert the following weekend together.

Recently, we split up and within 2 weeks he had booked a holiday abroad for the two of them to be away for 4 nights together, staying in separate rooms in an apartment. She posted photos of their holiday all over her social media accounts, knowing full well I, our friends/family and everyone else would see them. To add insult to injury, I had asked him so many times for us to go away together and he kept saying he was worried about covid. He said he only went on the holiday as he was so upset over losing me and needed an escape.

We then decided to get back together and he said he knew he couldn't continue with the friendship in the same way after everything that has happened. After the nights out, dinners and especially the holiday he knew it was inappropriate and he knew he needed to put me first from now on. This was one of the reasons I even agreed to give him a second chance. It has now been 3 weeks and he is saying it will be very difficult for him and it's easier said than done giving up a friendship like that...

AIBU to dump him and not get back together again?

Before MN I was completely unaware that so many grown women were incapable of coping with their partners having female friends.

We're not. It's a bullshit narrative, an offshoot of the tedious, adolescent and actually rather misogynistic "I'm not like other girls" bollocks. But many women will stay in these godawful relationships for years for fear of having this nonsense slapped on them.

Most women are fine with platonic friendships, prefer it even, but it's patently obvious that that's not what this is (on his part at least), and nobody should feel obliged to stay in a relationship when they're being told straight up that they're not getting the real person and only this other individual is.

You don't get any extra "cool girlfriend" points by pretending that this situation is the same as a normal friendship with a member of the opposite sex

Its not just this thread - there are loads of these threads, including ' you are not allowed to be friends with an ex' threads.

OP stated clearly from the start she didn't want him to be friends with this woman who was his confidant. In my experience a lot of men don't have male confidants and do use close female friends to talk about things like that in a way they don't with male friends. I went out for meals alone with an ex when I was married. It just wasn't a deal. I am not talking about all the rest of the thread, because the starting point was, I don't like you having a close female friend.

You have a really low bar for cool if you think that is a 'cool' boast.

Op I feel like you are a pawn in the real story -between them . And so was the last gf

100% dump him

I don't think his friendship is inappropriate, I just think you aren't the type of woman who can cope with a partner with a female best friend. And that's fair enough, I wouldn't feel happy either due to low confidence.

Why don't we have a vomiting smiley so I can effectively express my response to this pile of shite?

@blindinglyobviouslight

Get real. A "friendship" this ain't. OP is one corner of a love triangle. And he's taking the piss.

We're not. It's a bullshit narrative, an offshoot of the tedious, adolescent and actually rather misogynistic "I'm not like other girls" bollocks. But many women will stay in these godawful relationships for years for fear of having this nonsense slapped on them

Oh for goodness sake! What rubbish! I am not telling anyone to stay in any relationship. I actually don't think OP should stay in this relationship, so thanks for slagging me for something I don't even think, and magnifying it to me being a misogynist. Not that you are given to exaggeration of anything.

There are a lot of ' don't like my boyfriend being friends with a woman' threads. I don't like that attitude.

I am not talking about all the rest of the thread, because the starting point was, I don't like you having a close female friend.

Firstly no it wasn't.

Secondly you obviously did just want to be sarky to OP because you haven't bothered reading or paying attention to the thread.

You couldn't wait to get your dig in based only on the OP. Bit weird and sad, IMO. But hope you got whatever you wanted out of it...

Firstly no it wasn't. Secondly you obviously did just want to be sarky to OP because you haven't bothered reading or paying attention to the thread

Actually I did read all of OPs posts before I posted. But she'd already said she was unhappy with the friendship before all the rest of it. SO it still was a ' don't like my boyfriend having a close female friendship'

Hope you got whatever you wanted out of thinking you can read my mind. You didn't.

Why don't we have a vomiting smiley so I can effectively express my response to this pile of shite?

🤮🤮🤮

You're welcome 😀

All this “oh I can only truly open up to her” stuff. It was a lightbulb moment for me when I finally grew up and realised that I no longer needed to spend time baring my soul to my friends or discussing my relationship with them. Instead, I just opened up directly to my partner (now DH) and didn’t talk about him behind his back.

He sounds immature OP. And even if they are truly platonic, the lying about meeting her and the holiday thing show that he just lies and feeds you lines to suit himself. Sack him off and move on.

@blindinglyobviouslight

Firstly no it wasn't. Secondly you obviously did just want to be sarky to OP because you haven't bothered reading or paying attention to the thread

Actually I did read all of OPs posts before I posted. But she'd already said she was unhappy with the friendship before all the rest of it. SO it still was a ' don't like my boyfriend having a close female friendship'

Hope you got whatever you wanted out of thinking you can read my mind. You didn't.

Ok, hun.

I'm sure you know the OP and her feelings better than she does. There aren't enough eye-roll emojis in the world.

This behaviour would piss me off too and I wouldn't put up with it.
My husband does have a close female friend but I have never been made to feel like this.
Whenever they meet, her husband and I are invited too. She's never been touchy feely with him or over stepped the mark. Now we both have kids, my DH is her daughter's godfather, and she is our sons godmother.
That's how it should be. Not all this running to her and using her as a substitute girlfriend

I suspect she doesn't want him romantically, and he's hanging around with her in case she changes her mind. Bet she's enjoying the attention as well.

Or perhaps it's the other way around - he doesn't want her romantically and she is hanging around with him in case he changes his mind?

I'm sure you know the OP and her feelings better than she does

What a weird comment. She said clearly at the start that she, nor most other women, would like their partner to have a female friend they opened up or and socialised with one to one. Both opening up to and socialising with are normal parts of a friendship. I can only base my thoughts on what OP says, and my reaction was to this specifically. Go ahead and think you know what I was reacting to better than I do if you want to.

This female friend caused problems in your DP's previous relationship and now it your relationship - surely even your DP can see a recurring theme here.
Dump him - she occupies the part of his mind and the relationship he should have with you
Good luck to your DP in finding someone prepared to tolerat that type of intense friendship

I wouldn’t have taken him back after the holiday he took with her.
You are well rid.

I don’t see a problem with having friends of different genders. I do however see a problem with having an off/on DP who refuses to go on holiday with you. Relationships shouldn’t be this difficult, sounds like you need to move on.

For the people who said oh the OP is just jealous, if the friend was a bloke she wouldn't mind...really? DH has a close friend, Mike, that he met in college years before he met me. They used to work together and still talk quite a lot on the phone. Mike has confided in DH about relationship problems with his ex gf and talked about his new gf with DH. If DH is working in the area he calls in to see Mike's mum and occasionally goes for nights out with Mike and stays overnight at Mike's house. DH and Mike are relaxed in each other's company, tell stupid jokes, etc. All cool with me. If DH was lying about spending time with him, not cool. Going on holiday with him not me, not cool and if that was a pattern I'd consider ending it. If DH also said that Mike was the only person he could open up to...hmm I suppose if he said it very early on then OK but later when we were in a very established relationship...um no I'd be running for the hills. If, as I was putting my running shoes on, DH said "yeah Mike and I used to be snogging in college" I wouldn't just run for the hills, I'd get in the car and floor it to the hills.

The holiday thing creates a very simple version of what is called a form line in horse racing circles. His desire to go on holiday with her > his fear of covid > his desire to go on holiday with you.

My first thought on reading the OP was "if friend is so great why doesn't he just marry her then? But actually, who cares? Who cares if she's the unrequited one, or him, or whether they will have their "Saved the best for last" wedding dance in the end or not?

I'd release him back to the wild and find a man who wanted to go on holiday with you and tell you things. This, in a nutshell.

But she'd already said she was unhappy with the friendship before all the rest of it. SO it still was a ' don't like my boyfriend having a close female friendship'

Possibly because in the same conversation he also said this:

He told me that he uses this friend as a confidant, she is the only one he can really be himself around without judgement

Having a friend of the opposite sex isn't black and white. If a man came home and said to his DP that he's had a coffee with a female colleague at lunchtime, and she screamed at him that he was never to be alone with any other woman but her - not OK. That's controlling.

But there are lines to be drawn, and this man has crossed them big time. It doesn't matter whether he fancies her, she fancies him, or if it is just a genuine but very intense friendship. Maybe I'm in the minority, but I wouldn't tell my female friends all the details of my relationship. If it's extremely personal then it's between me and DP, spilling the gory details to anyone else, male or female, would feel disloyal. And my friends don't either. For some things, what happens at home stays at home.

OP this relationship will never go anywhere while he's anchored to her like this. As PPs have said, he's setting out the pecking order, and when it comes down to it, you're lower on that list than her. Time to end it for good and find someone who has you as his priority.

Sounds like an emotional affair.

If you put aside the fact that’s she’s a lady, the fact that he has a whole separate life (holidays meals nights out) without you doesn’t sit well. And he seems to be picking you up and putting you down.

It's not just about whether his friend is male or female. You mention you wanted to go on holiday with him but he hasn't committed. Then he went away with her. I'm sure you'd be feeling annoyed if it was a male friend he went away with. You need to be his priority!

Have a night out with them both. Maybe you’ll become buddies with this woman too. At any rate you’ll get a feel for the friendship chemistry between them, and whether or not your boyfriend acts inclusive around her with you, or awkward.

@CounsellorTroi

I suspect she doesn't want him romantically, and he's hanging around with her in case she changes her mind. Bet she's enjoying the attention as well.

Or perhaps it's the other way around - he doesn't want her romantically and she is hanging around with him in case he changes his mind?

Either way, OP is still down the pecking order when you'd expect a person to put their actual partner up there.

I'm a lesbian and all of my close friends are women. We only meet up one-on-one as my friends don't know each other. We text every day, have regular dinners (when there's no COVID, now I just see one), stay overnight together.

With some of your attitudes, I'll have to pick between my friends and a relationship if I ever meet someone.

I'd always choose my friends. Relationships have a tendency not to last, so why give up lasting friendships for a jealous partner?

@blindinglyobviouslight

We're not. It's a bullshit narrative, an offshoot of the tedious, adolescent and actually rather misogynistic "I'm not like other girls" bollocks. But many women will stay in these godawful relationships for years for fear of having this nonsense slapped on them

Oh for goodness sake! What rubbish! I am not telling anyone to stay in any relationship. I actually don't think OP should stay in this relationship, so thanks for slagging me for something I don't even think, and magnifying it to me being a misogynist. Not that you are given to exaggeration of anything.

There are a lot of ' don't like my boyfriend being friends with a woman' threads. I don't like that attitude.

I'm not accusing you of telling OP to stay in this awful relationship, or that you personally are a misogynist. I'm saying that the bullshit narrative you're perpetuating - that lots of women can't stand their partners having female friends - is a misogynistic one. Because it is. If you don't think it's true that many women are incapable of their partners being friends with other women, perhaps you shouldn't state it in your posts here? Just a thought.

If you do in fact think OP should dump this relationship (and you're right, she should), then maybe you should use your posts on here to say that, rather than telling us how awful so many women are? Just another thought.

And while we do get some threads about "I don't like this friendship", my experience of most of them is that the OP is quite right not to like it, because they are usually like this one: the man is telling her that she'll never measure up to this other woman. There are some where it seems harmless, and in those cases, the responses tend to reflect that.

It is, I'm afraid, 100% true that many women stay in these crap relationships because they are scared of the narrative you spout: that they are one of so many women who just can't handle friendships. If you don't like this, perhaps don't bring that bullshit narrative forth in a thread where even you believe OP should, in fact, cut and run? Why, indeed, would you do that if that's what you think?