was i BU with dd 12 last night (I swore)

[embarasseddd12]

name change as am embarrassed. sorry its so long!! I have been having issues with dd12, our relationship has been so much better since she was about 7, I had found her infanthood tricky as she is very stubborn and headstrong. she is child number 3 of 4. but recently things have deteriorated, she has been having friendship issues and has recently started her periods.
anyway last night I felt guilty as I'd promised her and her brothers a movie night but had double booked a zoom call with our friends. so I set up nice beanbags in the other room and they actually agreed a film to watch, with added chocolate and i and dh did the zoom call - wine was drunk. when I went to tuck her in we had what I thought was a lovely chat about what colour she'd like to repaint her room, getting some new curtains etc. I was sitting on her bed when she suddenly kicked me so hard I virtually fell off it. I was hurt and angry and asked her why she did that. before she answered there was a clatter and she said 'oh no my water bottle has leaked" to which I replied "I don't give a shit about your water bottle" and stomped out. I feel awful about this and this morning apologised for shouting. there was silence so I said " are you sorry about kicking me?" and she said yes and we had a small smile and agreed no more shouting or kicking. but later at breakfast she admitted she hadn't watched any of the film as she'd been on her phone all evening. I criticised her for this and said what a shame if she's not engaging with life around her (and felt ...sort of that I had failed again that she hadn't "joined in") and she said she would never bother telling me anything about herself again. aibu to feel really hard towards her and that I just don't like her at the moment? what should I do?

I criticised her for this and said what a shame if she's not engaging with life around her (and felt ...sort of that I had failed again that she hadn't "joined in") and she said she would never bother telling me anything about herself again.

I don’t have a problem with the zoom call but if you’re not around you lose the right to criticise her choices over what she does if it’s not hurting anyone else. You picked at a round here that didn’t need picking.

@Oblomov20

I find this thread frightening. Good for you! You Uber attachment parents, who want to spend every second with their darling children.

Only reservoir and Ariel agreed with me.

I put my family, both DS's, ahead of myself nearly all the time and on the very very rare occasion that I want to have a zoom call with my mates and a couple of glasses of wine this would take absolute priority over everything quite frankly.

The fact that many posters refer to it as a 'double booking' makes me want to vomit!

and the fact that dd3 was let down because God forbid mum, in lockdown, prioritised herself last minute, and had a laugh and a giggle with a couple of her friends on zoom.

I mean really? seriously? this is mumsnet now ?

where op is now being portrayed as some completely pissed paralytic raving drink? swearing, on the edge of her bed - though isn't it any wonder she didn't fall off because she was so bladdered?

that's just not what the op has described.

Where are you getting this all from?
That's assumption and presumption at its very worst! talk about reading into a story.

Harrumph. I said this upthread.

The fact that many posters refer to it as a 'double booking' makes me want to vomit!

The OP used that term

Someone literally said: She kicked you because you broke your promise about watching a film. As if that is a justification!

Yes, but they didn't say it was acceptable, did they?

Pre-teens aren't rational at the best of times. She's been stuck inside all weekend with her parents, was maybe looking forward to hanging out with her mum and was let down, upset and frustrated. That doesn't mean that kicking her mum was acceptable, but it was perhaps, in her head, justified at the time.

I genuinely am confused that a child listening to her mother partying on zoom with her mates and then coming rambling into her bedroom and being a PITA is a scenario that can be dismissed out of hand given what the OP has described

And you don’t think your own experiences have shaped your thinking here, considering what OP said is that she had a couple of glasses of while whilst having a zoom call with friends who are having a difficult time at the moment? And it’s your own imagination that has filled in ‘partying’ and ‘rambling’ and being ‘a PITA’.

The sweat is inconsequential. I simple don’t believe a 12 year old wouldn’t have heard this before.

Not watching a movie in favour of zoom call with a friend - so what? As others have made assumptions I’m going to make my own that OP doesn’t neglect her children in favour of friends, and one weekend evening is nothing. Kids choices don’t rule the roost and plans can change.

The fact that a 12 year old kicked her mother is the point. Unless it’s in self-defence, there is no defence to this behaviour. I’d come down like a ton of bricks on any of my kids if they dared do this.

Unbelievable thread.

The op has not made it clear if it was a deliberate kick or whether the water bottle leaking made dd jump and she accidentally kicked op in the process.

One minute someone is saying that the poor DD has been stuck indoors all weekend with her parents and then is justifiably lashing out at her mum because she can’t spend time with her. That doesn’t seem to make sense

And you don’t think your own experiences have shaped your thinking here, considering what OP said is that she had a couple of glasses of while whilst having a zoom call with friends who are having a difficult time at the moment? And it’s your own imagination that has filled in ‘partying’ and ‘rambling’ and being ‘a PITA’.

No I don't. My parents used to drink but they weren't alcoholics by any stretch. They were very much "do as I say not as I do" type parents though and i just didn't have any patience with their hypocrisy. Every thing I see in this thread comes from the OP herself. How she's just constantly waiting for her child to mature, how she won't clarify how much she drank or whether her being a bit pissed might have irritated her daughter, how she was hypocritical to her the next day, how she dashed out of the room and didn't address it with her child in the moment. Why? It's a big thing? Why didn't she talk to her about it? Why she didn't go back and try and sort it out. It all sounds very toxic and avoidant to me. The swearing I couldn't care less about, I have sworn in front of my children, it happens 🤷🏼‍♀️

It's easy to dismiss people saying "well it's not much fun having to chit chat with a half cut parent" as uptight pearl clutchers. I tend to think those that do must feel a bit defensive, you know like those friends that get irritated when you say you're taking a night off alcohol and then keep offering you a drink all evening because your being sober is making them a bit uncomfortable.

@ineedaholidaynow

One minute someone is saying that the poor DD has been stuck indoors all weekend with her parents and then is justifiably lashing out at her mum because she can’t spend time with her. That doesn’t seem to make sense

Of course it makes sense.

Most 12 year olds would probably rather be hanging out with their mates at the weekend. Due to lockdown, she didn't have that option but was perhaps looking forward to some quality time with her mum - then when that didn't happen she maybe felt upset/unwanted/unloved (pre-teen hormones can send your mind into overdrive) and lashed out.

If she'd had quality time with her mum during the daytime, presumably OP would have said that. I just remember how long and boring rainy weekends felt as a kid - if she had something to look forward to and its as cancelled, I'm not surprised she was upset and a bit pissed off.

And where does everyone get the assumption that the OP was 'drunk', she said 'wine was drunk' .... as if a couple of glasses of wine are going to make you drunk. Some of the comments on this thread are barking mad ... the OP had a change of plans, as many of us do, the DD could still watch her film or play on her phone with snacks etc and have a nice evening. I can count on one hand the number of times I've watched a film with my DC ... no doubt that makes me a terrible mum on Mumsnet.

Were you drunk? Are you sure she deliberately kicked you off the bed? Is it visible she moved due to spilt water and you fell because you were drunk?
Seems odd she'd kick you out of nowhere tbh...

I can count on one hand the number of times I've watched a film with my DC ... no doubt that makes me a terrible mum on Mumsnet

But that's really not the point, is it? The point is she had plans with her daughter and cancelled, only to sit in the next room, drink and zoom with her friends instead.

Then when her DD confessed she'd just sat on her phone all evening instead of watching the film, she got told off when her mum had done exactly the same thing.

I think there are a lot of points being missed here. I find it odd that OP mentions setting up a room with 'nice beanbags' - surely if kids have beanbags they can use them whenever they want, not when it's 'film night' only? Seems a bit staged. While I'm not entirely in agreement with those saying OP shouldn't have done the zoom call, I agree it could have hurt the dd and it would have been better to say 'kids, I've messed up. Let's do film tomorrow - you can have extra phone time tonight to make up for it,' rather than enforcing what they did (and what they sat on!) while Op went in another room and did her thing.

The really odd bit was leaving the room without finding out what had led to the kick and how wet the bed was etc. That is beyond odd. I want to know how it played out - OP stomped out and then did the dd go silent? Or was she to be heard maybe struggling with bedding etc. I know I've been in situations when I've been telling my kids off and then they've got hurt/some accident has happened and I've had to switch to helping them and it's hard as you can still feel irritated but you can't just storm off, you have to be the adult. So odd as well that the next morning you apologised and got her to, but still didn't find out why she kicked you?! And then told her for for going on her phone when that's what you'd done?!

I think people are taking issue with the lack of op's self reflection that her actions may have in any way upset or affected her dd. That's not the same as saying she deserved to be kicked. She's spoken about her dd in negative terms while admitting that she's struggling with friendships at the moment. Due to the information volunteered by the op, it sounds like her dd could be negatively affected by something as simple as a broken promise of a movie night with her mum.

The whole situation around the kick is strange. There was no argument that we know of, but her dd's water bottle leaked and the kick seemingly came out of nowhere, so it's really hard to judge whether it was deliberate or not without further information.

Op, you don't deserve to be kicked and if it was a deliberate act of aggression your dd should absolutely be punished. Saying "shit" in front of her is nothing to be concerned about and frankly I'm impressed that you've made it this far without such an utterance leaving your lips! It sounds like you may need to work on your relationship. It's a two-way street, sure, but as adults we need to make the first move and pro social model the behaviour we expect from them.

@vanillandhoney

Someone literally said: She kicked you because you broke your promise about watching a film. As if that is a justification!

Yes, but they didn't say it was acceptable, did they?

Pre-teens aren't rational at the best of times. She's been stuck inside all weekend with her parents, was maybe looking forward to hanging out with her mum and was let down, upset and frustrated. That doesn't mean that kicking her mum was acceptable, but it was perhaps, in her head, justified at the time.

And they also didn't say it was unacceptable. In fact, they said the OP should be apologising more. Which is absolutely laughable.

Even if the op was drunk
It doesn't make it acceptable for a 12 year old to kick out for no reason
Parents double booked yes maybe disappointing but being disappointed doesn't make it ok to kick
Can see daughters point on criticising her on phone use during film though
Personally I would of probably swore in that situation and I would of been punishing for the kick regardless today , and finding out why she did it , was or def deliberate

@HmmSureJan your issues of your parents saying do as I say not do as I do, nothing to do with the alcohol they drunk, you just have a bad relationship with them. Not necessarily they're fault.

I used to lash out like this at a similar age. I had a lot of attachment issues with my parents due to abuse from someone else age 2-8. It affected my self esteem too and I took perceived rejection badly.

When I lashed out it wasn't a mental decision, more that there were more emotions inside me than I could handle and it was impulse driven.

I suspect (and this is based on what you've paid for it and is a massive projection) that your lack of relationship has given her a shaky sense of self and she's starting to realise. She hates you and loves you in equal measures and that is confusing too.

When you did the zoom call instead of the movie I bet you reignited all sorts of rejection feelings, she tried to piss you off by being on her phone and that didn't work, she lashed out because of the build up of negative reactions and her moan about the hot water bottle was an excuse/attempt to garner sympathy.

My mum drinking was a massive trigger for me too. I hated that she'd be "fun" and the chatty, attentive, proud mum that I wanted her to be in front of her friends.

If I were you I'd look at the reasons why she does what she does, don't get into a punishment-attention seeking cycle, that is only a race to the bottom.

It doesn't make it acceptable for a 12 year old to kick out for no reason

Of course not but rhe op has declined to explain if it was her daughter kicking out suddenly because her water bottle leaked and she reacted and the girl was not violently attacking her mother as the op is implying but not spelling out.

lots to think on there, thanks mn posters.its hard, I do find it easier to avoid tissues I've been having with dd. I have tried various tactics, making sure her fave hobby ( expensive, always moving schedule) happens, that we spend 1 -1 time together, taking her up to town so she can stay with dd1 as I recognise it is quite brother-heavy here, dd1 has left home, and providing cash for the shopping trip there. but I don't feel I give of myself to her as I always walking on eggshells. on the canceled movie night note, we do have a lot of them so it wasn't such a big deal imo to re-arrange as in make room nice and chat to friends. dd just doesn't seem to want to be with us as all, ever. she came on a walk today but with headphones jammed in and was obv not enjoying it. but I need to chat with her about the blooming water bottle. today I was sorting through all her clothes on the floor when she was trying to find a pai of trousers and they were all wet....dd possibly is dyslexic we could do with getting that tested....

@Oblomov20

I find this thread frightening. Good for you! You Uber attachment parents, who want to spend every second with their darling children.

Only reservoir and Ariel agreed with me.

I put my family, both DS's, ahead of myself nearly all the time and on the very very rare occasion that I want to have a zoom call with my mates and a couple of glasses of wine this would take absolute priority over everything quite frankly.

The fact that many posters refer to it as a 'double booking' makes me want to vomit!

and the fact that dd3 was let down because God forbid mum, in lockdown, prioritised herself last minute, and had a laugh and a giggle with a couple of her friends on zoom.

I mean really? seriously? this is mumsnet now ?

where op is now being portrayed as some completely pissed paralytic raving drink? swearing, on the edge of her bed - though isn't it any wonder she didn't fall off because she was so bladdered?

that's just not what the op has described.

Where are you getting this all from?
That's assumption and presumption at its very worst! talk about reading into a story.

Right? What happened to this place?

So her water bottle did leak? And that might have been why she jumped suddenly. And you took it badly because you had been drinking?

You didn’t see cancelling on her as a big deal, but don’t know how she felt? She may be dyslexic but it’s not been dealt with, she’s struggling with friend ship issues. Maybe getting bullied. And to top it off just started her period. Then you criticised her for doing what you did. Avoiding the movie to be on your phone?

You take issue with her not wishing to be with you but you demonstrate that being with her isn’t so important to you. And happily prioritise your friends and a few drinks as you don’t see it as a big deal. Either you spend a lot of time together or you don’t.

She sounds deeply unhappy to be honest. And you seem to struggle to empathise. More you simply see her as more of an annoyance and irritant, who should comply as and when you wish, but you as the adult have no such constraints.

You seem to think that it's her job to be perfect and fit in with what you want to do. I think you need to accept she's not just going to do what you want her to do. She's her own person. And is young.
You promised family time but chose to spend time with your friends and drink instead so dumped them all together to watch a film, and then you were annoyed she played on her phone instead? So what? What's the difference, they're both screens, not like you took them skiing and she sat on her phone instead of taking part.
Dunno, you dont seem very patient, it didn't really take much to make you swear and storm out the room, you didn't handle it well at all.

[quote Bookworming]@HmmSureJan your issues of your parents saying do as I say not do as I do, nothing to do with the alcohol they drunk, you just have a bad relationship with them. Not necessarily they're fault.
[/quote]
Do you mind if I don't engage with you anymore? You're clueless and it's getting tedious. Thanks

on the canceled movie night note, we do have a lot of them so it wasn't such a big deal imo to re-arrange as in make room nice and chat to friends.

You didn't think it was a big deal, but did you ask her what she thought? Or whether she'd mind if you re-arranged and watched the movie tomorrow instead?

but I need to chat with her about the blooming water bottle. today I was sorting through all her clothes on the floor when she was trying to find a pai of trousers and they were all wet....dd possibly is dyslexic we could do with getting that tested....

So her water bottle DID leak? So there's every possibility she kicked/lashed out because the cold water spilt on her? I hope you apologise to her if that's the case.