To want to know if the Republicans have any grounds to suspect fraud

[DynamoKev]

Not a fan of either Trump or Biden.

Due to Trump's pathetic behaviour it is easy to dismiss his claims.

But some claims (if true) seem to be worthy of investigation.

You can only turn use a specific polling station here, rorosemary and there will be a list there with the names of the people on the electoral register for that polling station, which they cross off when you vote. But there's no ID checking to check you are who you say you are.

I haven't read through the whole thread so my apologies if anyone has already stated all of this, but Trump is simply throwing a temper tantrum and trying to undermine our democratic process.

I don't think that most of you pay attention to the down ballot races (i.e. senate and house) - and I don't say that as a slight; I certainly wouldn't if weren't American!! The president is on the same ballot as the senate and house (and local reps). Republicans did BETTER than expected in these races. Trump certainly isn't complaining about his gains in the House and holding the senate.

So if they are on the same ballot, how would there only be fraud for the presidential election?

Trump has been laying the groundwork for this for months; we all saw it coming. Do not buy into his dangerous rhetoric. The people voted him out.

charlotte
So if they are on the same ballot, how would there only be fraud for the presidential election?
THis has indeed been pointed out
and is indeed the crux of the matter.

Until the pictures shared up thread I think most Brits did not realise what down ballot meant

I think they have some bullshit argument about the down ballot votes thing about an 'unusually high' number of ballots which only had a vote for President and left the rest blank. Clearly because a lot of people voted with the sole intention of getting rid of Trump and had no interest in other races, but since when does logic matter.

I'm getting worried about where this is going... With Barr, McConnell and Pompeo on board (and a new Sec of Defense to replace the one who objected to the use of military force on citizens) things are suddenly feeling quite ominous. I think the long game is to drag things out in the courts for so long that the results can't be certified, then manipulate the Electoral College vote under the pretence of being unable to 'verify' the results. Scary times.

Not feeling good about where this is going either.

It feels like whatever happens the 'losers' are going to explode. One side because their guy lost, and therefore there must be fraud, the other because of the intentional and frightenig undermining of democracy if Biden's win is overruled by SCOTUS .

What we really need right now are senior republicans to tone the fraud allegations right down...it's shameful that they are stoking fear and a very misguided sense of injustice in Trump supporters. End result will be chaos and more division.

To want to know if the Republicans have any grounds to suspect fraud

Well, yes of course. Certainly they did in 2016, but they just covered it up.

My kneejerk reaction is that Trump is having a tantrum/clutching at straws. But given how much people hate him and want him out the Whitehouse, it would certainly be an easier situation than many to cut a few corners.

Biden currently leading popular vote by 5 million.

In five states Trump has filed post election lawsuits, Biden leads by 148 000 in MI, 45 000 in PA, 36 700 in NV, 14 00 in GA and 12 800 in AZ.

It’s over for Trump.

So far he's lost 10 out of 10 lawsuits, and they're for such frivolous things like the type of pen used - which was shown to actually be the best kind of pen for filling in the ballots due to quick-drying ink. If they had actual evidence they'd be pursuing it instead of nonsense.

Though they can't overturn the election they seem to have met another aim they had and that's convincing republican voters that it's been a fraud as quite a high percentage don't trust the election now. So well done, they've undermined democracy to try to soothe Trump's ego. His enablers are the worst.

I’m becoming seriously worried that Trump really is attempting a coup and that he has the support of senior Republicans. I’m hoping that they’re only stroking his ego until the court cases come to nothing and then they’ll back away.

He's now replaced a load of senior staff at the Pentagon. The 'best case' scenario here is that they will be destroying information and covering up for him. The only other explanations I can see are 1) a coup or 2) starting a war with Iran so he can stay in power. Fasten your seatbelts everyone.

I think he is doing what despots do when they know their time is up: rapidly building a soft landing pad.

I reckon he will be acting to protect himself and his family from prosecution. Maybe setting up a new TV show. Maybe negotiating which country the family will move to. Finding ways to make money out of it to clear his debts.

Biden currently leading popular vote by 5 million

Please can you attach a link to verify that.

What we really need right now are senior republicans to tone the fraud allegations right down

I think you will find they are doing the exact opposite.

Not feeling good about where this is going either

In court will see all the evidence, and if Mr Biden has won fairly, then that will be the result. Have some faith in the system, it is there for a reason.

@Ihaveyourback

Biden currently leading popular vote by 5 million

Please can you attach a link to verify that.

I don't know whether to laugh at you because your'e so clearly trying to muddle the waters or feel sorry for you because you're so clueless. There are about a million websites all taking their information from the individual states that are releasing it as the votes are counted?

Your argument may be that these votes have not been "verified" by the courts, but I assure you that the courts are not going to be counting 150+mn votes. They're mostly going to be relying on the Secretaries of States of each of America's states to provide numbers.

Personally, I think Trump is just trying to rile up his base. Because he needs them 100% on his side for whatever comes next - his new TV station, a run at President in 2024, the launch of a new business etc. Getting Florida to secede from the US....

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/11/03/us/elections/results-president.html

New York Times election tracker. Biden up
4 924 464 currently, more to come from places like California. It’s an absolute blow out for Biden.

3ormorecharacters

I'm getting worried about where this is going... With Barr, McConnell and Pompeo on board

I was trying to explain this yesterday.

Pompeo is no fool - he would not have signed up to ANY of this without good reason to believe that Mr Trump can actually win the end game court case, so I think we have to prepare for the evidence that is produced to be of high quality - moreover with a fighting chance of a conclusive win. Otherwise we would be expecting to see radio silence from the Republicans, and that is definitely not the case.
With Pompeo's backing the Republican party will be 100% behind Mr Trump.

The shrill tone of the democratic party yesterday is coming across as desperate, Mr Biden now looks like a fraud standing there with his speeches and ignoring the elephant in the room. He needs to acknowledge what is happening now, and stop the pretence. He is in grave danger of over talking and losing authority. It is far better to be open and honest about the situation, and reassure his voters and the world that he is happy for any court ruling to take place, and would expect to win under any circumstances.

It is also worth noting that major countries such as China, Russia and others have still yet to even acknowledge any victory. This is not a positive sign.

edition.cnn.com/2020/11/09/world/biden-win-russia-china-silence-intl/index.html

Anyone that thinks this is a done deal for Mr Biden is sorely mistaken, it was the media that allowed you to believe that - any responsible outlet would have made it crystal clear from the beginning that this is a contested win, likely to be settled in the courts.

space It is muddy the waters, not muddle the waters.

nolonger Those stats are no longer valid if widespread fraud is proven to have taken place, so I my feeling is that it should be taken with a pinch of salt until the hearing. We need to know what has happened first, the recounts need to be completed, and the investigation needs to be done before anyone can 'verify' anything. That would be a reasonable position to take given the situation.

@Ihaveyourback

space It is muddy the waters, not muddle the waters.

OOh, that told me. A typo means I must be an idiot.

You said it, not me.

nolonger Those stats are no longer valid if widespread fraud is proven to have taken place, so I my feeling is that it should be taken with a pinch of salt until the hearing

Could you please post a link to the upcoming “hearing” you refer to? My understanding was that all the court cases have been thrown out for lack of evidence.

And lol at a 5 million vote lead being “no longer valid”.

Face it, it’s over.

@Ihaveyourback look this is getting tiresome and you’re starting to sound desperate. Typos are everywhere on all sorts of posts, always been likebthat here. Look I even did one just there!

Face it, your guy lost. All he’s doing now is trying to fleece his supporters of as much money as possible because they’re gullible enough to fall for it, and he’s a conman with no morals.

@Ihaveyourback

3ormorecharacters

I'm getting worried about where this is going... With Barr, McConnell and Pompeo on board

I was trying to explain this yesterday.

Pompeo is no fool - he would not have signed up to ANY of this without good reason to believe that Mr Trump can actually win the end game court case, so I think we have to prepare for the evidence that is produced to be of high quality - moreover with a fighting chance of a conclusive win. Otherwise we would be expecting to see radio silence from the Republicans, and that is definitely not the case.
With Pompeo's backing the Republican party will be 100% behind Mr Trump.

The shrill tone of the democratic party yesterday is coming across as desperate, Mr Biden now looks like a fraud standing there with his speeches and ignoring the elephant in the room. He needs to acknowledge what is happening now, and stop the pretence. He is in grave danger of over talking and losing authority. It is far better to be open and honest about the situation, and reassure his voters and the world that he is happy for any court ruling to take place, and would expect to win under any circumstances.

It is also worth noting that major countries such as China, Russia and others have still yet to even acknowledge any victory. This is not a positive sign.

edition.cnn.com/2020/11/09/world/biden-win-russia-china-silence-intl/index.html

Anyone that thinks this is a done deal for Mr Biden is sorely mistaken, it was the media that allowed you to believe that - any responsible outlet would have made it crystal clear from the beginning that this is a contested win, likely to be settled in the courts.

I've never believed Pompeo is a fool, but he is demonstrably a power hungry warmonger with minimal scruples. He is as aware as everyone else that these court cases are going nowhere. They are a cover story to provide a narrative which will enable the Trump administration to use other tactics (delaying the certification of votes to justify manipulating the Electoral College probably, or possibly an attempted coup, or possibly starting a war elsewhere in the world).

Could you reference where the Democratic party have been "shrill" or "desperate"? All I saw was a very calm press conference by Biden in which he laughed off concerns about Trump's delay tactics. If anything they need to be more "shrill" to start combatting some of this misinformation.

Finally I will ask you two questions:

1. After how many court cases will you be satisfied that there is no case to answer? (13 and counting so far...) (I've asked you this three times before but had no answer.)
2. Why has Trump just decimated the senior staff at the Pentagon and replaced them with his own people?

I think we have to prepare for the evidence that is produced to be of high quality - moreover with a fighting chance of a conclusive win.

So...why haven't they produced that in any of the court cases thus far?

Let's see how all these challenges stand: www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/10/donald-trump-longshot-election-lawsuits

"Legally, the Trump team has not made much, if any, progress. Since the Nov. 3 election, the president’s attorneys have not won significant legal challenges in the key swing states Biden won or leads in: Michigan, Pennsylvania, Arizona, Georgia and Nevada. In some cases, Trump’s team didn’t present the evidence needed to invalidate ballots. Other times, his team didn’t even send in the right documents. In Michigan, the Trump campaign didn’t file the full paperwork, including the lower court’s order, needed to appeal a case to the Michigan Court of Appeals."

www.politico.com/news/2020/11/10/trump-legal-strategy-election-435853

And also...I think we now have another piece of the puzzle - Trump is using his fundraising for his legal challenges to pay off his debts: www.wsj.com/livecoverage/trump-biden-election-day-2020/card/zU0rMlE7ltxzuW4lIwai