AIBU to think that secondary school teachers should be apolitical in classroom and encourage debate

[vdbfamily]

DS17 and DD14 both came home today and seperately stated that they were surprised their teachers were allowed to be so anti Republican/Trump and that there was an assumption everyone agreed with them. FWIW neither of my kids like Trump but they felt uncomfortable with the fact that teachers were making derogatory comments about any idiots who voted for Trump and this was several teachers for both of them. WIBU to contact school and suggest it should be a place where students are encouraged to discuss pro's and cons of different parties and not get dictated to about such things! My daughter was saying that some of the kids who would not have known any different were then parroting the teachers views without really knowing what they were talking about.

I couldn't agree more. It's the same on here though. Everyone assumes you must agree with them and harangues you if you don't, you're simply not permitted to look at both sides and express viewpoints from them.

I am in the UK BTW but I am concerned that the same will likely happen for UK elections and I would prefer to see education that encourages debate and comparison and a bit less partisan.

Are you UK or USA?
What lesson was it in?

But yes I agree.

It depends on the topic. Schools have to teach British values like the rule of law.

If a teacher was criticising Trump for attempting to have the rule of law not apply to him that would be acceptable surely?

But Trump is acting unreasonably and is a danger to the American (well, the world) democratic process. I’m not saying he’s anywhere in Hitler’s league but we don’t have to have free debate on whether or not Hitler was in the right or not. I think it’s similar and most people would agree that what Trump is doing can be universally said to be wrong.

I'm gonna bite.

Flip your question: is it possible for a teacher to remain impartial when the entire tutor group is asking what the hell Trump is playing at? That was my experience this morning with 29 year 8s.

17 and 14 year olds should know what is going on in the world and should be exposed to different political views. Do you not discuss politics at home? In less than a year, your 17 year old's vote will carry as much weight as mine. I would like to hope that they can research the facts and reach a sensible decision about where to cast it.

Reminds me of one very irritating young colleague. My DDs were delighted to be old enough to vote last December. DD1 had missed the previous election by less than a month. Both did their research and were very keen to participate. My colleague, a KS1 teacher who has spent the last year moaning about how she never has any pens, paint, whiteboards, whatever stated on the day of the election: "oh I'm not going to bother voting. It's all pointless". She lives in my constituency and had 2000 more people voted one way, we would have rooted out the arrogant incumbent. Pathetic

I would normally agree with you to an extent (I wouldn’t tell students who I voted for in the last U.K. election), but I don’t in the case of Trump. I wouldn’t describe people who vote for him as idiots (in a classroom setting anyway ) but I will quite happily tell them that I am anti-Trump and want Biden to win the election. He has said some terribly hateful, racist and misogynistic things and I don’t think it’s unprofessional for me to make it clear to the students that I don’t agree with him.

I think sometimes its appropriate if you are clearly identifying right from wrong. If they are identifying actions taken by trump that are plainly racist, unlawful or deliberately likley to cause loss and injury that is fine. If you are rallying for or against the Democrat vs Republican parties it's a different matter.
How could you not label the separation of children from mothers and the encouragement of far right thugs wrong?

Trump is a rapist, a misogynist and a racist. All facts.

No, teachers should not be encouraging support of that and yes should be teaching students that is wrong. You should be, too.

I will attempt to be as apolitical as I can be, but sometimes it is quite hard to be superhuman and remain completely impartial when you have students who are asking sensible questions asking you.

To be honest I had a chat with some of my Year 9's prior to school and we were actually debating what a bizarre voting system the US has and how it can be challenged legal as Trump is trying to do - not necessarily anti Trump but I may have likened him to my 4 year old having a trantrum when he doesn't get his own way!

For UK issues I will not let on my persauasion in politics, I have shared my Brexit vote as that can't influence them now, but not in a heavy way - and only with my Sixth form as they had a Brexit question in a past paper.

I agree with you OP. School and teachers should be impartial.

I get the feeling that the people that think it's OK, are the ones that never think they will have the 'wrong' views.

I use Trump to teach about authoritarian personality and narcissism as he is such a an excellent example (psychology).

With British politics I try to give an unbiased view, but I'm not so concerned about being unbiased when it comes to American politics.
It helps with British politics that I'm a bit of a floater and have been known to vote for different parties so not heavily invested in one party.
However I certainly moaned about Gove some years back but that wasn't so much a dig at the conservatives as just a dig at Gove. I think he's the only educational secretary that I have ranted ( a bit) in front of a class.

I couldn't agree more. It's the same on here though. Everyone assumes you must agree with them and harangues you if you don't, you're simply not permitted to look at both sides and express viewpoints from them.

Agreed

I tell students my opinions. It's up to them to decide if they agree.

I have asked them for further context. Was not a classroom discussion. One was a maths class where as DD entered the teacher just had a rant about the amount of women Trump had impregnated so how dare he be anti abortion basically. DD said she would have had no issue with a political debate supported by evidence but not just random teacher rants which happened several times today!!

and yes, we do talk about most things at home and as a floating voter, I try to get them to look beyond the person to the issues and priorities of the different parties they represent as the vote is more than just the figurehead.

It’s very tricky. There is no such thing in reality as absolute impartiality. Teachers - like everyone else - have views that straddle the political and the social. So at the moment, being anti-Trump is closely related to supporting democracy, and that is a British value the teacher is required to support.

The rules are there to prevent teachers from indoctrinating kids. I don’t think they are there to suggest no politician should ever expect to have their actions overtly criticised in a classroom. So if the teacher was espousing fervently left-wing views to the exclusion of any discussion of right-wing views, I’d agree. But I am not sure about this.

Normally I would agree that it should be kept out of the classroom, however in this instance I disagree with you. Trump's actions in presidency and reaction to the election are unacceptable. This isn't even about politics, what he is doing and the things he has said in the past 4 years are indefensible and morally wrong. I would be genuinely concerned if a teacher did not feel that way. And I think for children to hear that is important!

I don’t think a teacher should be being derogatory towards people who hold differing beliefs to them. However I don’t think teachers should need to hide their own beliefs, but it needs to be respectfully done

If it was a general election here I would feel differently though.

Impartiality or you shouldn't be teaching.

Nah I don’t agree. Teachers are humans too and they’re allowed to voice their opinion,
I don’t think they should remain vanilla and neutral. It’s good to hear a range of opinions including the teachers.

Also think in maybe 10 or so years Trump will be discussed in history lessons and it won’t be in a favourable manner.

I teach secondary and I always make a point to be objective and non-partisan, giving the facts and letting the pupils lead the conversation. The Trump conversations this week have been really good, it's peaked their interest and has stoked some good debate. but it is VERY VERY hard to be non-partisan when one of the parties is clearly a raving lunatic who never makes any sense

So at the moment, being anti-Trump is closely related to supporting democracy, and that is a British value the teacher is required to support.

In Trump's case, 100% this. The man is deliberately undermining the rule of law and democracy. That is to be condemned.

Apart from that, all I know is that in DDs' classes there are a range of views and that there absolutely is debate, with no expectation that the students should take as gospel the views of the teacher (yr13).

I am in favour of robust debate, but silencing the opinions of teachers under the guise of 'neutrality' is moving into dangerous territory.