AIBU to think that secondary school teachers should be apolitical in classroom and encourage debate

[vdbfamily]

DS17 and DD14 both came home today and seperately stated that they were surprised their teachers were allowed to be so anti Republican/Trump and that there was an assumption everyone agreed with them. FWIW neither of my kids like Trump but they felt uncomfortable with the fact that teachers were making derogatory comments about any idiots who voted for Trump and this was several teachers for both of them. WIBU to contact school and suggest it should be a place where students are encouraged to discuss pro's and cons of different parties and not get dictated to about such things! My daughter was saying that some of the kids who would not have known any different were then parroting the teachers views without really knowing what they were talking about.

The funny thing is, teachers often make teenagers go the opposite way as an act of rebellion. I think they should be able to give both sides factually and in an non bias manner

As a teacher myself I get very annoyed with the majority of my colleagues being very political. Teachers have been the most opinionated colleagues I have ever had in any profession- almost to the point of excluding people who believe a different political view. It’s one thing I really struggle with because I feel such a responsibility to ensure our students are free to make up their own decisions. They absolutely should not be persuading students to believe their own line of political thinking.

Agree and disagree. I think it's fine in a situation as clear cut as this, but they should also make it clear "other views are available", to misquote the BBC.

@housemdwaswrong

Why should I be impartial? I can say what I think surely? Now if I say what I think then stop anyone challenging my view that's a problem. Having a view though I can't see as a problem. If I overheard a lad in a my classroom telling another lad to grab women by their pussy because they liked it I would act. Why should I be less likely to condemn this in arguably the most powerful.man in the Western world? Hardly leading by example is it?

I state my views like the kids state theirs, and we discuss. It's healthy for them to meet politically engaged adults, and be forced to reason their opinion whatever it is.

Well said! And good point made by the PP who mentioned some unacceptable views being voiced by kids as well. Do those claiming teachers should be impartial think that we should allow little Johnny to say ‘My Dad says all gays should be shot’ or ‘My family thinks all foreigners should be sent back to their own country’ These comments were actually made in my classroom in the last 18 months and ‘little Johnny’ was 15/16! Funnily enough ‘little Johnny’ is a big Trump fan!

@housemdwaswrong

You sound like you went into teaching just to be able to spout off all day to people with no choice but to sit and listen to you. Why didnt you go into politics? Why is your view so important? Why should your students care about your opinions?

@CrotchBurn

I think its lame.

Remembering learning about WW2, I dont remember any teachers being like "...and Hitler was a terrible person, he was an awful Jew hating racist evil monster".

Learning about what happened in Nazi Germany was enough for us to draw our own conclusions.

I think there's a real thing now where everyone's opinion is seen as sacred and it seeps into teachers thinking their own political views are at all relevant. They arent. Teachers are there to explore context with the kids and ask and answer questions

This. It's entirely possible to state factually what has been said and done and allow students to draw their on conclusions, without projecting your own view onto your teaching. The deeds and behaviour speak for themselves don't they? While giving context of course. I think this has been forgotten of late and people seem to think they must ram their beliefs down thee was throat of, and insult people into agreeing with them.

But having an opinion doesn't mean you are persuading others. It's a false link. I have political opinions, I tell the kids we discuss. I don't force them to think the same way as me, even, God forbid, acknowledging that sometimes the have a good point.

You can have opinions without expecting people to have the same. It's important more than ever that this is modelled, or the intolerance towards other views will grow.

@crotchburn okay then. :)

Exactly

I think to encourage young people to think critically they need to be shown that it’s normal for people to hold differing views and how to discuss those things respectfully.

My line about Trump is “we must remember that even if we don’t agree with him, there are people who do support him and they’re entitled to that opinion. However, he says some things that can be called hateful, and that’s not something we accept at X school”. I am primary but I honestly feel that it’s not appropriate to give your political opinion in class because it can really shun those who don’t agree. It shuts down debate.
Obviously when it goes into people being racist in the name of politics, that’s different.

As the adult in the room you are in an elevated position and students who like and respect you are highly likely to follow your lead. You're the only highly educated person in the room so you'll be the most articulate and well informed and will of course be leading the discussion. Keep your opinions to your friendship group and family etc, why do you need to platform them in a classroom too? I just don't believe it is your place to influence a class room of children with your own political rhetoric.

The answers on this thread from teachers prove the OP point.

Covering current affairs is a balancing act and one that can take new teachers time to find their lines.

No human is truly objective and teenagers see through bullshit so I don't buy the idea that staff should pretend to be impartial.

If something is potentially controversial or its during election season then I tell my students that I won't be discussing my personal beliefs regarding political parties or candidates. If they are asking my opinion about an event in the news and it is appropriate then I don't mind sharing my opinion because it's my opinion, not a claim to the one core truth. If it is a PSHE about the main UK political parties then 'Conservatives say X in their manifesto and Labour say Y' is totally fine.

I think it is important for teenagers to hear different views and learn how to respectfully debate and discuss with people who hold different views, including adults who can offer different insights.

Sometimes I find that when parents say they want politics or social debates removing from the classroom or they want it to be neutral what they actually seem to mean is 'I don't want my children hearing adults have different views to me'.

This would not bother me, as Trump is not our president and the teachers' political views on him affect nothing. In fact, his attempts to undermine democracy are an important cautionary tale.

Apolitical on UK politics, yes.

Northernparent68
One year a few students proudly told me thay they'd worked out I was a Tory. I asked why and they said it was because of how I criticised a socialist author's presentation of upper class characters.

As they were about to leave school I didn't mind saying that I'm actually centre left politically.

It was that moment that reinforced that I think it's right to be willing to discuss issues and share our perspectives. Nobody reads a book neutrally and it would be a boring day teaching English Literature if we removed the personal interpretation and personal response.

While I appreciate that teachers shouldn't be attempting to brainwash anyone, when the political issues deteriorate to "should black people be allowed to go shopping without being shot to death" or "is it ok to rape women" or "should we keep foreign children in cages" I feel like I'd like teachers to weigh in on the side of basic common morality.

How do we define "apolitical"? None of the conversations I've had with students have been about Republican policies versus Democrat policies. We have, however, discussed such concerns as morality, integrity, misogyny and the ways in which power can be abused when Trump as an individual has come up in conversation. As an English teacher, discussing such issues is my bread and butter, particularly with the sixth form classes, and I'm certainly not going to pretend that I am neutral on the topic of Trump's character.

However, by and large, my sixth formers are capable of critical thinking and have already drawn their own conclusions on the kind of man he is. Those that support him are allowed to explain why, just as those that don't are and we discuss.

I think there’s a difference between being openly partisan in classes vs being critical of someone who is outright fighting to disenfranchise people right now.

No teachers shouldn’t seek to influence a pupil’s political leanings, but it shouldn’t be an untouchable subject in the classroom and trump’s behaviour right now isn’t about your political leanings, it’s about someone trying to circumvent democratic due process. Frankly I think it’s important teachers bring it up and are making it clear to children that this is not how democracy works!

I wouldn't say criticising trump is particularly political unless you were criticising right wing views as a whole.

For example, I didn't and wouldn't have criticised Bush when he was president in the classroom. Although I have criticised their gun laws. Trump is a very unusual case compared to most politicians and I my opinion, amoral.

Were they being dictated to, or was the teacher just sharing their own view?

There’s a big difference between ‘I hate trump and I think his supporters are racist bigots’ (which I think is fine, even in a classroom) and ‘you aren’t allowed to express a pro-trump view in this class’ (not fine).

I don’t think teachers have to be apolitical. You can express your own views and still foster an environment which encourages debate.

@SpeccyLime

Were they being dictated to, or was the teacher just sharing their own view?

There’s a big difference between ‘I hate trump and I think his supporters are racist bigots’ (which I think is fine, even in a classroom) and ‘you aren’t allowed to express a pro-trump view in this class’ (not fine).

I don’t think teachers have to be apolitical. You can express your own views and still foster an environment which encourages debate.

But saying his supporters are racist bigots in a classroom is basically saying that you can’t support him in this classroom, well not unless you want to be labelled a racist bigot.

Saying I don’t like Trump because I don’t agree with his views on x,y and z is one thing but trying to label all supporters isn’t going to encourage discussion and acceptance of differing views

I’d agree with you in normal circumstances but in this case I don’t. It’s not about left and right - it’s about right and wrong, and respecting the rule of law. And I think teachers are doing a good job if they help children to differentiate between right and wrong and to respect the rule of law.

There’s a big difference between ‘I hate trump and I think his supporters are racist bigots’ (which I think is fine, even in a classroom)

You think it's fine for a teacher to say to children that they "hate" the leader of a mainstream party and that "all" who support that leader are "racist bigots". Apart from the glaring hypocrisy in your comment, this is a totally unacceptable, never mind depressing and negative, way to teach children

Are you a teacher? No wonder education is such a mess if this is an example of education practice.

YANBU. I expect teachers to be more professional and impartial.

I’m pro Biden and anti Trump, but if my DC were conservative leaning (please, no!) I’d hope they wouldn’t be made to feel wrong by their teachers.

As a teacher, sometimes I would share my opinion but make it clear it was just that and offer information about the other side. We can't be robots and it's nice for students to engage with you about your opinion by sharing theirs. Does sound like these teachers were being a bit presumptive that everyone would agree with them though.