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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask why so many women are in unhappy marriages?

207 replies

jennie0412 · 04/11/2020 02:54

Not victim blaming, a genuine question! It's overwhelming over on the relationships board how many women are utterly unhappy in their marriages. Why is this happening so much? Sad it makes me not even want to try with relationships because I'm worried I'll end up being 23 married to a 47 year old bloke who won't touch me!

OP posts:
DontDribbleOnTheCarpet · 04/11/2020 09:22

@Bluntness100

How old are you op? Are you dating a much older man?

And if a woman is in an unhappy marriage then it stands to reason so is the man.

Not necessarily. My husband considers himself to be very happily married.
Meuniere · 04/11/2020 09:22

Also when I look around at people who are still married and outwardly happy (I’m including my parents there who would both say they have a happy marriage), there is no way I would accept what those women accept.

So my conclusion is that women who say they are happy are those who are also happy to accept an unequal relationship.
I appreciate that my views on equality have hardened in the last few years and I’m not happy to accept crap anymore.....

Meuniere · 04/11/2020 09:24

Yes so is my DH @DontDribbleOnTheCarpet...

Hickorydickoryspock · 04/11/2020 09:24

I'm very happily married... but I have been in relationships when I was younger where I thought I was in love and probably would have married the guy if he'd asked... despite their having been glaring red flags. Now im older and in a supportive healthy relationship I look back with horror when I realise how close I came to backing myself into a miserable corner...
It was just lack of life experience... if you've never been in a supportive healthy relationship its hard to spot when yours isn't... you just assume a lot of what the man is doing is oar for the course.. everyone flawed, im flawed, im difficult to live with too... is what you think to yourself... I cant expect fairytale...
You think these thingsand I also think women are more brought up to keep trying to work on relationships and keep trying to love even when it's dead in the water.
I'll be telling my daughter to just leave if she has the underlying feeling she is unhappy... leave before it even gets to an engagement.
Whilst its true you shouldn't have unrealistic fairytale expectations... you very much can expect to be genuinely happy most of the time. You can expect basic levels of respecting support.
I know I settled for less many times in my youth and im so lucky that things didn't go further with those men.

buildingbridge · 04/11/2020 09:31

I have a very very good friend who I have known since university. She was going out with this guy (he was bad news!) but his family were pressuring her to get married to him. I begged her and pleaded with her to not do, that she will be unhappy, you'll be tied down to a family who do not value her and treat her like shit.

She got married to him and has two kids with him now. He works 6 days a week and gets home over two hours late from work (when he only works 10 mins away from her house!) and doesn't support the kids when he comes back. He expects my friend to cook, clean and get their kids ready for bed. On his days off, she tells me that he lies on bed everyday, whilst she's minding a four year old and a newborn. Not only that, her mother in law and sister in law treat her like the shittest of shit.

She's depressed, very unhappy, she lives her kids but there's always a "but". She will never leave him unless she values herself. Not only that, she has an idea that she cannot go out with the kids (day troupes etc) unless her husband is there with her. I don't understand. I told her that the more you go out with your kids, the more you'll feel confident, and feel that you do not need to rely on him. I just don't get it, my mum was a single parent to 6 kids! and she always took us out every weekend.

Besides from money, security, financial reasons, some cultural norms. I do believe, that a large part of the reason why married women stay with losers is because they do not value themselves. I'm sorry. This is true. I have been there. They just do not. They do not realise their worth, they are scared of the unknown, they are scared of taking the plunge. They do not believe they can do better.

Valkadin · 04/11/2020 09:31

I had never ever valued marrying and having dc like many of the women I have met through my life, it was not my ultimate goal. I think many women are conditioned still without realising that this should be the sum of their life. It’s not so obvious now it’s not the 1950’s but it’s still there, this drives many poor choices. Women need to value their own worth more.

My goal was always to be financially independent and not rely on a man. My Mother was married four times and was divorcing back in the 1950’s when it was rare, she had children over 20 years. I was one of the youngest and she was unbelievably jaded by the time I was born. She said never rely on a man for money and that was the best advice I was ever given.

I am a very practical person, DH and others have said my responses are very much like a man often. My life has been far from perfect but I have never had the issues that my women friends do in relationships. I would make a decision and that was it. I could always walk away from relationships and never fret about my decision. I could also come to that decision quickly. Many women I have known make a huge mistake when dating. They know what they don’t like about a BF and then think they can change them.

Batlights · 04/11/2020 09:33

I'm in my 40s, disabled and unable to work. I've been with my husband since my teens and our marriage is great. He's never mistreated me and Ive always felt loved and respected by him even at my most abject. I don't want for anything, whats his is mine and vice versa.

I have a really wonderful father and my parents have a great marriage and I think that experience meant that I knew a good thing when I saw it. I am aware that I never tolerated any disrespectful behavior in boyfriends even in my teens, I believe I have my father to thank for that as he modelled for me what a good partner should be.

I tend to assume other couples are as happy as we are and am then surprised when it turns out they are splitting and things have been bad for years between them. I also know some couples who bicker and snipe at each other all day long but seem happy, thats not my idea of a loving marriage but it seems to work for them.

Whatisthisfuckery · 04/11/2020 09:37

Because it’s sadly a myth that marriages last for a lifetime, or it is in the majority of cases. I twigged pretty early, after I got married in fact, that it’s naive to expect one person to satisfy all your emotional, sexually and companionship needs for life, especially if you get together young. Also the getting married young thing, how do you know what a great relationship looks like if you chuck in your lot with the first willling partner? It’s like insisting that your particular recipe is the best when you’ve never tried any others. It might be really good, but you might get bored of it or you might just be ignorant of the dish’s true potential.

As for why so many women are in unhappy marriages, well that’s easy really. Women are more likely to earn less, have caring responsibilities and it’s invariably the mother who looks after the kids when a marriage breaks down. Leaving because your bored and unhappy just isn’t going to come out well in a cost vs benefit analysis. It’s hard enough to leave a marriage that’s abusive and dangerous, so if there aren’t immediate reasons for leaving then it just won’t feel worth it.

There’s a good reason why men invariably only jump ship when they’ve got another woman lined up, so they won’t push it either if the benefits don’t significantly outweigh the costs.

Fallsballs · 04/11/2020 09:40

@popcornlover - you need some help to address your issues, it’s not healthy to be that bitter.

sacchariferous · 04/11/2020 09:41

Isn't the relationships board where people post asking for advice or wanting a vent about issues in their relationship? If someone has a happy fulfilling relationship they aren't going to start a thread are they?
Using it as a benchmark is a bit like going into a hospital and declaring humans to be a weak unhealthy species due to the number of sick people around.

I've found the relationships board extremely helpful in the past, because the people on there have seen it all, and can provide some hard to hear but actually very wise advice.

If you are single the thing to take away from it is how to value yourself. Women can be very naive about taking on the domestic load without a thought at the beginning of a relationship. I did, I didn't question it. Don't. Don't accept anything less than equality. Retain your financial independence. Understand that even the best relationships hit problems, and these things are what will enable you to make the best decisions for yourself. Too many women end up trapped, financially dependent on an arse who treats them badly.

Batlights · 04/11/2020 09:45

I've also had the experience on here of being told that I'm naive to trust my husband or believe in my marriage from women whose husbands have cheated on or left them and basically been told it will eventually happen to me.

Admitting to a happy, loving, respectful relationship can seem like smugness to women whose negative experiences have strongly coloured their opinions of men and marriage.

Belladonna12 · 04/11/2020 09:45

The relationships board will inevitably give a biased impression. People in happy relationships probably aren't on there. However, often people end up in less than perfect relationships because however good they were to begin with, people and circumstances change. Many people don't want to split up despite that for financial reasons.

D4rwin · 04/11/2020 09:47

Nobody posts about their happy life unless they want to get ripped to.shreds

ExConstance · 04/11/2020 09:49

I do think it is very important to think about and decide on the very important issues of money and children before you get married, and to agree. so many of the "unhappy marriage" posts are about numbers of children, if any, and how you deal with income and expenditure. If you have the good fortune to be married to someone who views all assets and income as "ours" it really does help.

ImEatingVeryHealthilyOhYes · 04/11/2020 09:51

I stayed because I was in denial of how much he was taking advantage of me, and that he’d stopped loving me.

Also I was terrified of being a single mum (I’d seen what my dm went through) and of harming the dc (I knew what I’d gone through!)

Fear and misplaced loyalty.

Excellent thread btw, should be read by all young women!

TigerBrite · 04/11/2020 09:51

So women reduced their hours when they have a child as the norm for example but men don’t
I don’t think it’s just because it’s the norm. Women are disadvantaged from the start by assumptions that they are less career focused because they’ll have babies at some point. By the time women give birth they already earn less and are further disadvantaged by 9 months of vomiting and hospital appointments and being physically unable to do stuff. Then they take 9 months maternity leave to recover physically. So they were behind to begin with and now they’ve lost another 18 months per child. When the couple chooses who’s going to stay at home, the woman (who earns less and needs physical recovery) is the obvious choice. Plus the woman has hormones, feels more bonded to her baby, so in many cases she has more desire to look after her child.

That’s before you even consider the subsequent brain fog and other menopausal symptoms that affect mothers just at the point where they might be able to get on with their lives because their kids need them a bit less. It’s one thing after another and unfortunately a lot of it is unavoidable biology.

honeylulu · 04/11/2020 10:05

I think men and women are just too different in their biological instincts, which have been compounded by many centuries of societal pressure and tradition.

These are generalisations but women are more likely to want children (and have further children), have no choice but to bear the children, want to take on the primary care role (often dropping to part time or taking less demanding roles that allow them to "be there" more), less willing and able to put children's needs out of mind (mental load of school admin/ play dates/ activities/ healthy eating/vaccinations/dentistry/new shoes/ screen time limits).

Conversely men seem to be: less interested in having children, less interested in being the primary carer/default parent, unwilling/uninterested in stepping back in career, give less thought to all the minutiae of raising happy healthy children. I'm not saying they don't care, but in general much less engaged with such thoughts and worries.

Men are hugely privileged even if they don't realise or actively deny it. Moreover most are pretty happy with the status quo of at least nominally traditional roles. Even if they deny it many tend to find housekeeping and child rearing dull, unrewarding and demeaning - but think it's ok for women to do that (because they are inferior???)

The happiest marriages I have observed seem to be ones where the husband has the big career, the woman has the main responsibility for house/child rearing, and they both appreciate each other's roles and efforts. However, the woman is definitely playing the second fiddle.

The traditional model is sadly also a trap for many women, particularly if they dont have appreciative and fair minded husbands.

I would say I am happily married and we have an equal/ fair set up whereby I certainly don't play second fiddle. But I've had to fight to maintain those boundaries. My husband was prone to making assumptions without a moment's thought. I.e. that I didn't need one of the weekend lie ins because I'd wanted a baby so much (he was less keen) I should surely want to spring out of bed to attend to my special hobby. Don't worry, I soon corrected him on that. But there are numerous things that have cropped up. I didn't change my name on marriage. He asked if I wasn't proud to be married - I retorted that if he thought we should make a name change an outward sign of our pride he could change his name to mine. What a surprise - he declined.

He will forget to look in school bags and complete forms for school trips and reply to party invitations. I've tried leaving him to it and the result is that the kids lose out. His response is typically "of course I would have done it but you didn't remind me". No one reminds me though! We've been together 25 years and despite my attempts to change this he just doesn't give it a thought. It's either that he's not programmed for it, or secretly believes (but denies) that it's women's work, or a combination.

We've managed an equilibrium that I can accept in that he has some set roles that we agreed are his responsibility and I will not assist unless he expressly asks. So he is in charge of: all laundry, all hoovering, children's uniforms (including replacing) and children's dentistry, as a few examples.

Some men though would not even contemplate/tolerate having their privilege challenged in that way. I suppose my secret weapon was that I would have preferred to stay single and childless than play the second fiddle. For many women that's not an option they'd be happy with.

I don't really know what the answer is.

FourTeaFallOut · 04/11/2020 10:08

Nobody posts about their happy life unless they want to get ripped to.shreds

Well, not on the relationship board but you might find reference to an abundance of happy relationships between the lines on just about every other board were couples are supporting and caring for each other and they don't get ripped to shreds.

Fwiw, I got married at 23 and remain happily married at 41. We have a equitable, calm, faithful and loving marriage that has been easy and without drama. I'm not likely to announce that while someone is detailing their struggles in their marriage - it wouldn't serve any purpose but fwiw, the marriages among my friends seem broadly similar and I'm not of the opinion that we are the snowball in hell.

DryRoastPeanut · 04/11/2020 10:12

To answer “why are women in unhappy marriages” the answer is, for some it’s a case of better the devil you know. They have the security of a roof over their heads, food on the table and children being raised with both parents. They’d rather live like that than leave with nowhere to go or end up in a new home with the stresses of no food in the cupboards.

Osirus · 04/11/2020 10:15

@Batlights

I'm in my 40s, disabled and unable to work. I've been with my husband since my teens and our marriage is great. He's never mistreated me and Ive always felt loved and respected by him even at my most abject. I don't want for anything, whats his is mine and vice versa.

I have a really wonderful father and my parents have a great marriage and I think that experience meant that I knew a good thing when I saw it. I am aware that I never tolerated any disrespectful behavior in boyfriends even in my teens, I believe I have my father to thank for that as he modelled for me what a good partner should be.

I tend to assume other couples are as happy as we are and am then surprised when it turns out they are splitting and things have been bad for years between them. I also know some couples who bicker and snipe at each other all day long but seem happy, thats not my idea of a loving marriage but it seems to work for them.

I had the opposite - my father was a terrible husband to my mother and a terrible father to us.

I too knew a good (better!) thing when I saw it.

You can learn from the bad as well as the good.

cheeseychovolate · 04/11/2020 10:16

Lots of women stay in an unhappy marriage because of the children, they don't want to break the family up especially if there's no abuse, and they've just grown apart.

ImEatingVeryHealthilyOhYes · 04/11/2020 10:17

Question for those with good men: do their fathers treat their mothers well?

I’m trying to work out if this might be a good predictor (among other things of course)

CounsellorTroi · 04/11/2020 10:18

I think the question of why women stay in bad relationships and marriages is different to the question of how they get into them in the first place. For that answer I think you have to look at female socialisation. I've seen too many posts by women saying "we've been together for 2 months and he's slept with an escort", "we've had 3 dates and he's called me a bitch", "it's been 8 months and he's still only affectionate when he wants sex" etc, clearly not situations where the woman is trapped in any way by finance or children but they still aren't leaving.

Yes I too wonder at the posts starting “my DP have been together x months* and wonder why on earth they think they are stuck with these men and why they can’t set their bar higher.

MessAllOver · 04/11/2020 10:20

Women are more likely to earn less, have caring responsibilities and it’s invariably the mother who looks after the kids when a marriage breaks down. Leaving because your bored and unhappy just isn’t going to come out well in a cost vs benefit analysis. It’s hard enough to leave a marriage that’s abusive and dangerous, so if there aren’t immediate reasons for leaving then it just won’t feel worth it.

There’s a good reason why men invariably only jump ship when they’ve got another woman lined up, so they won’t push it either if the benefits don’t significantly outweigh the costs.

Completely agree. I'm not 100% satisfied with everything in my marriage, but wouldn't contemplate leaving until DC are older. I think there's a reason why many women stay to see the kids off to university and then think, "Now's my time" and end their marriages.

Also, generalising here but women tend to have other resources that make staying in an unsatisfactory marriage easier...I certainly have more friends (mum friends and pre-DC friends) than DH does and I make an effort to keep in touch and meet up with them regularly. I don't depend entirely on my marriage for my happiness, and I suspect many women are the same.

ChasedByFox · 04/11/2020 10:22

It is nigh on impossible to have a home on an average single income as housing costs are so high. This is why so many are stuck in lousy situations.
My salary is well above average, but I would really struggle to adequately house my children by myself, let alone anywhere near the level of comfort we have or an area that's safe to wander around at night.