AIBU to not let DS stayover at MILs after this -dog concerns

[TheMILinatorReturns]

Name changed Sorry Long rant...
Half term, MIL kindly agreed to look after 3YO DS...all going well, photos of fun activities etc and grateful of the help. Then I get a phone call to say she's confessing she has allowed a relative to bring her staffordshire bull terrier into the house with DS present which is something DH told her specifically not to do. I'm guessing she had to 'confess' because DS would have told me anyway...

I'm pretty livid because I don't trust dogs, especially the big ones around my small child and particularly ones I have never met myself. I know I will get flamed for this by diehard dog lovers but to me dogs are animals and can easily flip when under stress, small children and dogs together are (IMHO) an unpredictable mix and an unnecessary risk I wanted to avoid with our child. Also she has not respected my wishes by allowing this (she has past form for this).

Another point is this particular breed doesn't have a great reputation, they are powerful muscular dogs and there are a lot of children according to news channels who have been killed or left with life changing injuries in this country alone. I have actually had a bad experience with one myself when I had to do a home visit and was knocked to the ground and had it not been wearing a muzzle I am not sure what would have happened but that's another story.

Granted I am sure the majority of these dogs are lovely pets and great around kids but.... I was not comfortable with this and DH communicated it to MIL, I never thought she would go ahead anyway. She has apologised says it was an 'accident' she 'thought it was a delivery' and the dog just came running in. This says to me it was out of control for one, surely it should have been on a lead on the street outside...? She says she held DS on her lap whilst the relative sat across the room with the dog and it was 'only five minutes' and the relative had come with a present for DS (his birthday soon). I suppose it is good she has admitted it and apologised but to be honest I think she is trying to minimise it and I don't know why she didn't just say 'please will you take the dog away whilst my grandson is here'. She could even have blamed it on me and said my crazy DIL wont let me have dogs in the house whilst I have my grandson here, I wouldn't have cared. To me she has prioritised the relatives feelings over my sons safety. This is really difficult for me because on the one hand I feel everyone will think I am overreacting but on the other had something gone wrong and the dog got jealous (it often stays with MIL apparently) and bitten DS... it just doesn't bear thinking about. Trying to put this into perspective as nothing actually happened (and I will probably be accused of PFBS) but the fact is she knew our wishes, WHY then allow this to happen, I just don't get it? It was the only rule we lay down, didn't even say don't feed him up with sweets and chocolate (which she always does) because we realise this is a grandparent thing. Part of me wonders if she is trying to push my buttons on purpose as she has been difficult over other issues in the past (she can be quite overbearing and manipulative - I never thought spiteful though). She called me up on video call to 'confess' and I wonder if she wanted to witness my reaction. I really want DS to see his grandparents but I am going to sit worrying about this bloody dog being near him now if I send him back there to stayover and that I cannot trust MIL to do as we have asked. AIBU to tell MIL she can see DS but only at our house or at hers when we are there and no more staying over? DH will support this. However I don't want to be accused by SIL and other family members of keeping MIL away from DS...what to do?!

If she had done this deliberately then it would be fair to say she can't be trusted, but it doesn't seem like she did, and without more details on what it is shes done before to go against you we can't really comment on that. If the owner of the dif is used to visiting and bringing the dog in then there is every chance that the owner did what a lot of dog owners do, which is when they get into the property let the dog off the lead because the dog will go bounding in excitedly to see the person because they are used to the house, so that is no indication the dog is out of control. Your MIL had your DS on her lap and that seems to show she was trying to follow your instructions but as best she could without wanting to send her visitor away, which is fair really because they had just bought your DS a prezzie so turning round and going "How nice, but you'll have to get that dog out now ir my DIL won't like it" would have probably made her feel uncomfortable, so when unexpectedly in that situation she probably just pulled him onto her lap and made sure the visitor didn't stay long. It does seem that you might need to consider your position on this because, while completely your choice, it will be nearly impossible to keep your child away from all dogs for such small amounts of time. What about play dates with friends, or parties at the houses of other children, which are all not too far away when he starts school in a year or two. Your child would very quickly be known to not be allowed round to friends if they had a dog if you enquire and tell the other mums and dads to keep them away and you'd probably be considered to be "that mum". Your MIL might not even have fully realised the extent of your disapproval and understood your consider not letting your DS stay unsupervised if she didn't turn the dog away. If your DS is never allowed around dogs even while supervised he will be wary of them as you are and this wont do him any favours, as well as the reality that boisterous younger dogs who just want to play are more likely to listen to instruction from someone confident, so if your DS is allowed around dogs with adults there he'll be more likely to have the confidence give commands the dog will listen to and can be taught dogs are animals and you must be careful but not try and hide because they will be around for life with the millions of dogs kept as pets.

@SilverBangle - sorry but you're wrong!
The parents had already had that conversation with the GP about dogs. GP must have agreed to this request. Child goes to GP, dog turns up and GP ignores an already agreed request. Trust = broken, no matter the circumstances

I couldn't give a monkeys if a GP or anyone else for that matter 'already brought up a child ....' bollocks - accidents happen ALL TH TIME - people are respectful of the people's children and their boundaries or they say no and destroy their own time with what should be their beloved GC by respecting others boundaries!

Where would you like to draw the line of what acceptable to GP ignoring! ....
The children don't eat meat - GP not in my house, they'll have what I give them?
The children need to wear sunscreen -GP not here, it never did me any harm?
Don't smoke around the children - GP never did my kids any harm, they're fine
The children don't play in the street alone they're only 4 years old - GP whatever, I used to walk a mile to school alone when I was 4 they'll be fine
We don't smack our children. GP well I was caned at school and it did me the world of good, beatings are ok in this house

Are these all things a GP can still do, ignoring parents boundaries 'because they're in charge? '

Wow can’t believe some of the responses on here. OP you are absolutely right to protect your son and outline your expectations to your MIL. God forbid something happened to him, your DH needs to lay down the law but personally I wouldn’t trust her again. Can you use alternative childcare?

You're absolutely 100 per cent right to be furious. No more childcare there this week. Let her grovel. What's she going to do to make it up to you and prove you can trust her?

For those saying get over the fear of dogs, it almost doesn't matter that the subject of concern is a dog. She made a promise about childcare and safety that was important to the mother and then she broke it.

@SilverBangle - sorry but you're wrong

There you are. You know best. I can’t be arsed to read the rest of your hysterical post. How do you know what happened? Were you there?

I have 7 GC. I’ve had dogs all my life - and therefore theirs. Hell would freeze over before any dog hurt one of my GC. My Dd and SIL know it. They don’t make demands on what I do or not with my GC. They trust me. They know I will always prioritise my GC’ s needs and safety.

You sound as if you have a problem with dogs too. Accidents happen yes. But not nearly as often as you’re making out. In fact I have lots of friends, family and neighbours with dogs and children and I don’t know of any incident regarding any of the children and dog’s.

As I have stated twice now - if OP cannot trust her MIL with the child she is free to look after the child herself or pay for childcare.

What do you suggest? A public hanging of the MIL because she dared to have a friend over, who gave her GS a present, against her DIL’s wishes?

Another one of these threads:

OP: AIBU?
MN: YABU
OP: IANBU
MN: YABU
OP: FU

OP. YANBU

you said to mil "no dogs around our toddler", She lets someone in the house with an unleashed dog

It's not difficult . That's a no. Confession or not, she knew not to do it since DH said clearly . Yours isn't an unreasonable worry and is your decision to make as a parent

Mil knew to say no and chat at the door with DS in another room to relative turning up with a dog. MIL had No need to invite them in and sit down gift opening with the DS & dog, even if sat separately, dog could have secured elsewhere or left home. If they knew DS was there to take gift over , it's cos MIL told them and she equally had time to tell them "DS's parents don't want Dogs around DS so leave DDog at home please "

For those telling OP to suck it up or find alternative childcare- RTFT

MIL isn't her childcare they pay childcare elsewhere, MiL wants to be childcare(!) and this trip to MILs was about her wanting DGS which is lovely

OP DS can still see MIL , just not unsupervised, you take him over and stay or she visits him at yours, Regarding dogs you know you can't trust MIL so don't cause yourself that worry. A 3 year old doesn't need to sleep over at grandparents house. She may realise that she messed up after a year or so snd properly promise next time

@SilverBangle - It's about the respect for parental boundaries and not damaging the trust of the DS and DIL, it's not the dogs.

How do you know my post was hysterical if you didn't read it - or do you like throwing grenades in because you're unable to deal with debate or challenge, you'll just jump straight to 'my rules or get your own childcare' infantile response

KitMarlowesCodpieceOfthigh you read a different thread? Lots of posters agree with OP. It's even in the vote - 52% she's NOT being unreasonable. Me included. MIL could have prevented dog from entering house, as agreed. OP is totally within her rights to say no dogs. Trust gone.

I'd be furious if I was OP.

@KitMarlowesCodpieceOfthigh

Another one of these threads:

OP: AIBU?
MN: YABU
OP: IANBU
MN: YABU
OP: FU

Other people said YANBU so that's not accurate . It's just that a few dog lovers have been repeated posters more recently doing some YABUs

OP has good reason as a parent to not want unleashed dogs around her toddler , especially ones not familiar with children nor her child with them.

Sorry but that's how agencies view it

Whether MNers agree or not, is irrelevant really. They made a reasonable parental decision and MIL ignored it almost immediately. She is most certainly NBU to feel they cannot be confident in MiL in this and consequently in other matters.

This is not about the dog to me - it’s about you outlining your boundaries and your m’n’law when put in a position to make a decision she did not respect your boundaries. I had something similar with my m’n’law when we had explained to her my son’s allergies and how we did not want her dogs in our house. She decided to go stay in our house with her dogs while we were on holiday as she wanted to be closer to one of her sons. And when we returned I found dog hair in the house so asked her why she had not mentioned the dogs. She explained that she knew if she had told her she was bringing the dogs with her we would not have allowed her to stay.

Jeez - life’s to short to worry about these things. You’re being absolutely ridiculous. Your MIL had an unexpected visitor, remained with her DGC the whole time to keep him safe and told you.
Crikey you really are hard work. I’m surprised she wants to provide care for your DS when you behave like this.

I suggest for your DS sake you do not destroy his relationship with his DGM over your irrational fear and a non issue.

Custard bear if somebody wants something for nothing they cannot attach conditions. You insist OP needs to be there to assess the situation and whether something is safe for her child then I’m sure MIL won’t mind her looking after her own child.

If any of my GC’s parents told me they weren’t happy with the way I care for my GC they would be told, in no uncertain terms, to make alternative arrangements.

It comes to something when GP’s get criticised for helping out - free of charge.

There is nothing in OP’s post to give any concern that the dog was a danger to the child. Or that the dog went anywhere near the child. Child was on Grandma’s lap. Dog was probably sleeping on the floor next to it’s owner. If the dog was trusted enough to be off lead throughout then it’s unlikely to be viscous. The dog and child were kept apart. As is right. I really cannot see anything to complain about. The only gripe OP could possibly have is that MIL let her friend and her dog into the house for a few minutes. If OP wants to cause animosity over that then so be it.

I would be incensed that my specific instructions had been ignored, irrespective of how it came about. In your situation, I would make sure MIL knows how unhappy you are but I wouldn't specifically tell her she couldn't have your child overnight again. I would just visit with DC or let her come to yours but, if she ever offers to have him over again, either for a visit alone or to stay overnight, just say no at that time. Say no every time. If she questions it just tell her why then.

How hard would it have been for MIL to say "sorry would you mind taking the dog into the garden please, my grandson is here".
She ignored a safety concern. It's comparable to my in-laws who couldn't figure out the buckle on DS's car seat (despite me showing them beforehand) so just didn't fasten him in. They rationalised it was only a 30 minute journey, they were unlikely to crash. And he was fine. But the potential harm if something did go wrong could be catastrophic!
I'm not a dog lover, I haven't taught my kids to be scared of them but very cautious. Because there's no such thing as a 'safe' dog. My son has played loads (in a controlled situation with close supervision) with his uncle's dog. This week the dog bit his auntie very badly, out of nowhere, and had to be put down, and she needed hospital treatment.
You are right to take this as seriously as you do.

YANBU at all but I see the dog-obsessed people are out in force on this thread 🙄

you do realise that dogs are predatory animals right...?
That they hunt in packs and bring down animals larger than themselves..?
Most dogs exhibit predatory interest to some degree.
Chasing a ball is predatory behaviour!
Why do think dogs like to chase so much

Er yes, MrsJungelow that is EXACTLY the reason that the OP is not happy about an unknown dog dashing into a house where it could happen upon a 3 year old I does not know running around in the front room.

Before the MIL (allegedly) sits with the 3 year old on her lap.

I am guessing that DH knows the relative and the dog in question as he specifically asked MIL not to have the dog round. I bet he doesn’t trust the owner (his sister?) and with good reason since the dog ran in out of control.

The owner of the dog was irresponsible to allow it to run in to a house where a young child could be in the floor eating a snack, rolling around etc.

I don’t believe the ‘only 5 minutes’ or that the child spent the whole visit I get lap.

YANBU OP. But I would get your DH to say that it must never ever happen again or the child will not be allowed at her house alone again. Don’t just swallow the minimised version and brush it off.

People are so wide eyed about Stafford: "why pick on that breed, my postman got bitten by a chihuahua!" The issue, as is quite obvious to anyone who isn't a totally blinkered dog fanatic, is the degree of possible harm that can be done in the short time it would take to separate the attacking dog and it's victim. A staffie has huge powerful jaws and can inflict fatal or life-altering damage with a single bite to a small child. Whether they are more likely to than another dog is another issue; all good risk assessment looks at likelihood Vs potential harm. So if a little Scottie dog runs barking up to me apparently ownerless in the park, I don't panic as I could drop-kick the little bugger if I had to; if a solidly built staffie does the same thing I start looking for the nearest climbable tree. Because IF it wants to hurt me it can do so very easily. Unless Granny was sitting on top of the Welsh dresser having DS in her lap makes no difference - leadless dog could have leapt and bitten faster than its owner could get it under control.

Dog owners just don't understand that to people without their blinkers on, these are large potentially dangerous animals which for some reason are allowed to roam around freely in public, posing a totally unasked for and unnecessary risk to those of us who don't like them.

If squirrels were the size of dogs do you think they'd still be fossicking around the park uncontrolled? But no, it's people who are actually able to see dogs for what they are that have the "issue".

Dog in your house, fine. Dog off lead in your garden, fine. Dog out and about in public without a lead or anything else that stops them running at, slobbering all over and potentially hurting other people? Not ok.

The only reason it's legal is because this country has a weird split personality about animals - according them more rights than human beings on the one hand, abusing them hideously on the other.

So OP you are completely reasonable. Your son doesn't have a dog, therefore shouldn't have to "get used" to being exposed to other people's uncontrolled dogs. And frankly, you could have told your MIL never to feed him bananas because you don't like the shape and YWNBU - he's your child, you are leaving him in someone's care, you are entitled to put conditions on that care!

I wouldn't make a big play of it as you will of course be painted as hysterical etc because of your perfectly reasonable dislike of dogs. Just seek alternative care and don't ask again or accept her offers. Tinkly laugh, mild excuse, again and again, forever.

*staffies!

I think yabu to say Staffies are all dangerous and you’re also unfair in the way you’re handling your ds with dogs as you’ll pass your fear on to him.
Yanbu to expect your mil to respect your wishes

@KitMarlowesCodpieceOfthigh

Another one of these threads:

OP: AIBU?
MN: YABU
OP: IANBU
MN: YABU
OP: FU

Isn't that the point of a debate...to argue your point and listen to others? I might not agree with everyone's point but it's helpful to hear others perspective on this...that is why I posted

So if a little Scottie dog runs barking up to me apparently ownerless in the park, I don't panic as I could drop-kick the little bugger if I had to; if a solidly built staffie does the same thing I start looking for the nearest climbable tree
Are people confusing a staffy with something else here?

A Scottie averages about 30cm tall, Staffies are around the 35cm mark, rarely over 40cm tall.

That’s about the same size as a miniature Schnauzer or a cocker spaniel or a miniature poodle.

Hardly massive...

@Fluffybutter

I think yabu to say Staffies are all dangerous and you’re also unfair in the way you’re handling your ds with dogs as you’ll pass your fear on to him. Yanbu to expect your mil to respect your wishes

I'm not saying that. And to be honest the whole dog breed thing is a massive distraction from my actual point. Obviously they are not all dangerous or no one would keep them as pets. But I do think the news articles I posted warrant discussion. Why do they have a bad press? What possible agenda could they have to smear one particular dog breed? There must be something there. Would you agree a dog who is from stock originally bred to bite/chase/kill other animals is more risky to be around than a toy dog in terms of temperament. Or are we saying all dogs have the temperament to hurt a human it's just that bigger dogs have bigger teeth and cause more damage or can easily kill so more bad press. The fact is, I feel less comfortable with my DS around a dog as big or bigger than him. Fact is I could pick up/restrain a little dog, not a bigger one like an alsation or a rottweiler, mastiff or a staffie.

Would you agree a dog who is from stock originally bred to bite/chase/kill other animals is more risky to be around than a toy dog in terms of temperament

I have a toy breed. It was bred to catch rats and mice, and is as good a hunter as the cat.

Most dogs are bred for a purpose. And some of the dogs that aren’t bred to chase and kill are more risk- collies for example herd, but sometimes herd their humans and will nip if a human doesn’t follow instructions. Retrievers are bred to be soft mouthed but they still are statistically more likely to bite.

You can’t avoid all dogs. It’s better to let your son familiarise himself and learn what should and shouldn’t be done around dogs than avoid them altogether. That will keep him safer. Same as you teach them stoves are hot rather than get rid of the cooker.

YANBU.

I don’t believe for a second that the relative popped in and sat down for five minutes without MIL offer them some refreshment.

What happened when MIL left the room?

I have a large dog and usually put him outside when anyone visits or he’s locked in the utility room if the weather’s bad, unless it’s someone who he knows well and likes him.

My DS is 11 and I wouldn’t leave him and his friends alone with DDog. DDog is a lab cross and very sweet but you don’t know if other children could be unkind to him, so it’s not a risk I’m willing to take.

A baby doesn’t need to be socialised with dogs. That can easily wait until he’s much bigger.