I'm sick of people from Northern England who voted tory complaining on the news

[ssd]

Suck it up. You voted for them. No one made you.

Everyone is entitled to have a moan, but seriously, WHY WHY WHY did you ever vote tory thinking they'd got your back?!?!

They were warned Corbyn was unelectable and they didn't listen.

I voted Labour despite Corbyn but lots of people I know wouldn't countenance him. The Tories won by default.

@PickAChew

And we have almost a whole generation of voters, now, who never experienced thatcher in their politically aware lifetimes. I'm early 50's and had one general election for her.

Likewise Blair. He's a big reason why many traditional working class Labour voters turned away from the party. I know one. An elderly relative. Southerner (in case it matters) but from a very working class background - grew up on a council estate with very little money. They weren't turned by Corbyn either. The militant aggression of momentum is very much not a vote winner.

Condemning potential/previous voters as stupid or 'deserving all they get' is hardly going to endear you to them either. It's down to Labour to offer an appealing alternative rather than insult voters it needs to attract.

I'm working class. So I'm told. I live in a Labour Stronghold. I voted for conservatives because I wanted to leave the EU. In the main. I was a member of Labour for Leave, but I didn't have a choice when they positioned themselves the remain party.

You do know that not everybody in the North voted tory don't you? And that people in the south also voted tory?

Ssshhhh, don't use logic, you'll spoil their North-bashing.

Far easier to pretend "The North" is to blame for the current shit-show of a government and to make out that we're all working class and therefore mildly thick than to actually consider that maybe, just maybe, "The North" got fucked off with constantly and conveniently being forgotten about.

Labour got complacent when it came to seats they presumed were safe. We had a new Labour candidate in the last election as the previous candidate stepped down. We never saw hide nor hair of the old Labour MP and did not see hide nor hair of the new Labour candidate because they both presumed the seat was safe, zero effort required. Know who people did see? The lying cunt of a Tory MP. Out there knocking on doors, walking around the town centres talking to people, going to the village fairs, listening to what people were telling him and making promises to represent those views down in Westminster. Obviously he was talking out of his arse but at the time people believed him because he was visible and he was listening. He's facing massive backlash now as he hasn't delivered anything he promised to the point that he's claiming its not safe for him to be out and about in the local area but perhaps if Labour had been visible and had listened then they wouldn't have had such a trouncing.

@sally067

People voted Tory not because they suddenly changed sides. It was to keep Jeremy Corbyn out.

Absolute insanity, did they think that he was going to surrender the country to the IRA and turn the UK is a communist state? I'm no fan of Corbyn but you can't say he doesn't believe in social justice or wealth redistribution.

How did they think that a party that's entire ideology is around trickle down economics and privatisation would benefit them. Let alone a Prime Minister that is clearly a narcissist, lier and lazy.

We also live in a parliamentary democracy with a civil service and a lot of devolved power, a Prime Minister isn't some sort of supreme leader.

It's a common misconception of some voters - and it's typically the sort of middle class university educated people who always vote for the left parties - that people in general vote based on whether the leader really believes in his ideology.

For a lot of people, they are much more practical. They vote around a policy or policies that matter to them for some reason. Ideologues may be sincere but it doesn't mean they are more likely to do the right thing.

@SuperbGorgonzola

They were warned Corbyn was unelectable and they didn't listen.

I voted Labour despite Corbyn but lots of people I know wouldn't countenance him. The Tories won by default.

Yes but the members of the Labour Party twice heavily voted him as leader. Pretty difficult to go against that if you're going to be a democratic party

Sadly Labour rarely seem to think about persuading the general voting public to vote for them. The Tories are ruthless about it (generally speaking, although hard to believe at the moment). Gaining power is the Tory Party raison d'etre.

@sally067

most of them voted Tory to get Brexit

Pretty much down to this. Jingoism pure and simple.

Cummings knew exactly what he was doing in the last election campaign and they fell for it hook line and sinker in order to get it done at great cost to themselves, their family and the country.

I'm not saying there aren't good Tory MPs and that there aren't bad Labour MP's but generally in my experience Labour MPs get into politics for public service and because they really do care. Do people up really think the likes of Jacob Rees Mogg, Grant Shapps (Sebastian Fox/Michael Green), Priti Patel, Dominic Raab, etc get into politics to represent working people? There's a book called 'Britainnia Unchained' that they all put their signatures to back in 2010/11 - it's very enlightening... basically they hate us, want to privatise everything and think working rights should be scrapped.

Do you live in the North ? Have you read the post by Enoughnowstop ? It is all too easy to say ‘Jingoism pure and simple’ but the fact is that people were reaching out for something and had been failed by the Labour Party for years. I know people who had voted Labour for 40 years but voted for the Conservative party in the last election.The modern metropolitan Labour Party may well choose to leave these voters behind and that is their choice but they can’t then complain if the loss of those votes causes them to lose a future election.

Am I missing something? Is it ok that Southerners voted Tory? Are there suddenly no poor people in the south?

Also quite interested to know what OP deems as "The North"

Also 'The North' is not one homogeneous place.

Some areas have long been Conservative (and affluent). Richmond in Yorkshire, Harrogate, parts of Cheshire, etc.

the fact is that people were reaching out for something and had been failed by the Labour Party for years. I know people who had voted Labour for 40 years but voted for the Conservative party in the last election.

There wasn't only two options on ballot papers, they could have voted for any number of candidates or spoilt their ballot paper but ticked the Tory candidate. It's not hard to go on the internet and do some research into what your average Tory stands for and their ideology. Similar to Brexit voters not educating themselves about what that means (i.e. 'project fear' is now essentially coming true). They and their children will have to reap what they've sewn.

It looks like people have assumed op is a southerner .I call it Northern England too . Ha !

@sally067

the fact is that people were reaching out for something and had been failed by the Labour Party for years. I know people who had voted Labour for 40 years but voted for the Conservative party in the last election.

There wasn't only two options on ballot papers, they could have voted for any number of candidates or spoilt their ballot paper but ticked the Tory candidate. It's not hard to go on the internet and do some research into what your average Tory stands for and their ideology. Similar to Brexit voters not educating themselves about what that means (i.e. 'project fear' is now essentially coming true). They and their children will have to reap what they've sewn.

I’m very well aware that there weren’t only two options on the ballot paper because I voted for one of the alternatives, having never voted anything but Labour previously. I desperately want Labour to win the next election but as someone from a working class northern family I can assure you that the whole ‘how can you have been so stupid’ rhetoric from the Islington set labour members will only entrench views further. The more that you tell people how stupid they are apparently are the more they will go elsewhere and language like ‘reap what they’ve sewn’ is unlikely to encourage anyone back into the Labour fold. Fair enough if you want to continue merely as a vocal campaign group but I want Labour to be a serious opposition and potential Government

Enoughstopnow
Has it. It was so obvious it was turkeys voting for Christmas. But for once people had a say. And the press had been manipulating them for years over the bureaucratic EU stealing money, crisp flavours, wonky bananas and of course immigration.

And we still have people like ClaireP20, who lives in a labour stronghold and therefore most likely a wc area and thinks leaving the EU will be a good thing. The Tory boys only ever wanted Brexshit and a hard one at that because they’ll make vast sums of money. Bozo didn’t take 48 hours to reflect on whether to back leave or remain; he spent 48 hours looking after his personal interest, moving money around, chatting to his chums and working out which camp would best serve him to land the job of PM.

The OP is an SNP supporter.

@ssd you've spent the whole year starting threads that either divide people or express your own personal panic.

I'm in the north. Always have been. It'll be a cold day in hell when I vote Tory.

What exactly is your problem?

Because Labour have done so much for the north over the last two or three decades. Not to mention labelling them racist bigots for voting for Brexit. You can’t slag off large sections of the electorate and then demand their loyalty. Jeremy Corbyn was another reason. He was a fucking disaster. And yes, Boris Johnson made a big impact. If anybody has to suck it up, it’s you.

@R1R2

Because labour had done so fucking much for them the past 20-30+ years they had held those seats

Exactly!

Labour had done nothing for them in years except sneer and ignore their concerns. So they tried something different. It was a logical thing to do. You don't achieve change by keep banging your head against the same door.

I'm sick of Labour supporters grumbling that they lost, when they knowingly put forward an unelectable candidate.

Northern England! It's not fucking Game of Thrones! Where in the North of England are you referring to?

Looking at you Leigh et al...

I agree with you OP. Next time, educate yourself and vote for the party that will actually support you.

It angers me as I live near these areas that voted Tory. I’m a lifelong Labour voter.

What in hell were these people thinking?! No understanding of the world and obsessed with Brexit. What a joke.

I'm a lifelong Labour voter. The aggression of Momentum has pushed me away, and I voted elsewhere last time, although not Tory. I am not alone in this.

What in hell were these people thinking?! No understanding of the world and obsessed with Brexit. What a joke.

That’s, in a nutshell, why Labour lost. Earnestly explaining that those that voted Tory and Brexit were in some way uneducated or deficient is a terrible way to get those people inside, but we see it in this thread over and over again.

People voting for Brexit were sold a lie. But you can only vote for what’s in front of you.

Left leaning people - you can’t get people to vote for you by telling them they’re wrong. You can’t also get them to vote by installing an Islington Trotskyite whose career MOU is largely voting against his party.

You need to offer a viable, personable solution that appeals to the masses (not just London and Momentum) who actually wants to be in power. Those two things have been in pretty short supply in the Labour Party over the last 10 years.

yawn.............bigger YAWN

@DumDaDumDum

Looking at you Leigh et al...

I agree with you OP. Next time, educate yourself and vote for the party that will actually support you.

Who would that be then? The one which held seats in the North for a century? The one which ran the corrupt local councils?

Oh look, it's another goady thread by ssd. We haven't had many of those.

I live in a part of the world governed by a devolved Labour administration. Led by a Corbynite no less. The pandemic response has been no better on the whole. In many ways he has been slower to react, in other ways he has taken the old maxim to extremes: "Something must be done; this is something, therefore we must do it". There'll be no jobs left in Wales by the time he's finished.