Blaming Labour

[InsanityRocks]

Time and time again I see here that the only reason people voted for the tories was because 'anti-semite/terrorist/bad dresser Corbyn' AIBU to think that all these people voted for the racist/misogynist/self-serving Johnson knowing he is all these things as all his views come straight out his mouth, yet the anti Corbyn stuff is hearsay from the press/Russian bots/SM etc.

I don't think Corbyn would have made a good prime minister necessarily, he is too passionate, too idealistic. However, for all those saying he should have stepped down: he won more people to join the Labour Party than ever before, there was the beginning of a movement for change, real change. But members of Momentum joined to deliberately sabotage, along with the constant hum of how evil this man is, how dangerous from the right-wing big business and newspaper owners along with a growing feeling of mistrust manufactured by Russian social media destabilisation all conspired to make sure he failed.

We are all hating what is happening in this country now, but for the moment, the best way to tackle it is through socialism and inclusion. People seemed so scared of socialism, is it because it gets confused with communism? For covid and climate change and unemployment and mental health support and education and the NHS and all the other major issues that face us as a society at the moment, we need to work as a team, surely?

I would be terrified if Corbyn was 'in charge' right now, absolutely terrified. He does not have the skillset

@Friendsoftheearth What skillset has Boris Johnson shown to make you "relieved" he has the title Prime Minister.??

I've been thinking why people often feel safer with a leader like Boris, who most think is fairly self-serving, over one like Corbyn, who most think, even f they don't like him, has principles. (Given, in this instance, that both are probably not top drawer in terms of leadership or the people they like to keep around them, so no real advantage either way there.)

Because I think that's actually common, I've seen a similar dynamic elsewhere, and on the face of it it seems not to make sense.

I wonder if it because people feel like someone like BJ will try to do what is best for himself, but that probably means making some attempt to actually make the government work.

Whereas they can easily imagine JC going far wrong out of some sort of commitment to ideology? He'd think he was doing the right thing, and all evidence is that he'd keep doing it even in the face of opposition.

I do think there must be some psychological process that explains it, I don't think it relates to people's partisan sympathies at all.

The only person BJ is looking out for is himself, the country is being robbed under the guise of emergency procurement and awarding of lucrative multi-million pound Brexit consultancy contracts without tender to friends and donors of the Tory party. People were worried about Labour spending, at least we may have got something substantial out of it rather than a lot of unusable PPE such as recently reported 36 years supply of possibly faulty coveralls with a shelf life of 3 years, sitting untested in a warehouse.

@Friendsoftheearth

I would be terrified if Corbyn was 'in charge' right now, absolutely terrified. He does not have the skillset, the leadership skills nor the ability to manage such huge challenges. He was struggling just to get through PM questions, quite how he would cope with covid and something of this magnitude does not bear thinking about.

I don't think the current government have coped with this flawlessly - and they have definitely made mistakes, but given the two options I am very relieved.

Thats mad! Bojo has sat on his hands and allowed the UK to have one of the highest excess death rates in the world, on par with other right wing populist leaders in Brazil and the US. UK would have highest per capita if they hadn't doctored the figures.

He couldn't have done worse than if he'd done nothing at all.

As for struggling through PMQs? bojo has screwed up many times against Starmer, johnson, like a performing clown, needs a baying audience behind him but he hasn't so he flounders.

We are nowhere near the highest deaths per capita jas get a grip for goodness sake, it is embarrassing and wildly inaccurate.

Here we are so you can check for yourself, last updated on the 27th of October:

www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/

You really should consider reading the facts and doing your research in advance of your posts.

what i wrote.......UK would have highest per capita if they hadn't doctored the figures

what you replied with We are nowhere near the highest deaths per capita jas get a grip for goodness sake, it is embarrassing and wildly inaccurate

Read the post, the key words would have

the UK changed the way it reports deaths, knocking 1000s of our death toll, we'd be up there with the very worst performers, so not widely inaccurate at all.

BUT even without this, the UK is in at number 10, quite shocking and shows just how incompetent your party has handled this.

I think we need to wait until next spring before we can say who has worse deaths. Some countries seem to be going through their first waves now ( Czech Republic) and I plenty of other countries seem to be creative with their reporting, Spain certainly seemed to have very low figures just when they wanted to open up their tourist industry plus their has been a scandal in turkey recently of hiding deaths. Russia too has had huge cases but relatively low deaths which seems odd. U.K. reporting is probably more accurate than many other countries, not perfect of course, some argue over reported rather than under.
I know some media here is desperate for the U.K. to be the worst at everything but I don’t think they will get that wish.

And wasn’t it England that changed the way it counted deaths ( from any positive test to just within 28 days) to bring it in line with the way Scotland, Wales and NI already recorded deaths which seemed sensible to me.

@sashagabadon

And wasn’t it England that changed the way it counted deaths ( from any positive test to just within 28 days) to bring it in line with the way Scotland, Wales and NI already recorded deaths which seemed sensible to me.

Compared to Russia & Turkey???

You set a high bar!

I do not recall Spain doctoring figures, they dropped after many weeks of lockdown, rising quickly, just like ours.

Talk of doctoring, didn't we stop testing for a few weeks? due to a warehouse move.

Due to a complete lack of testing 1000s of deaths in the early months of CV were not counted at all, plus many die after 28 days but wont be counted.

Excess deaths, which is generally acknowledged as a reasonably accurate measure, puts the UK highest of all european countries.

I wish it wasn't so but pretending the UK has handled this well is foolish, just means we'll carry on making the same errors as before.

I’m not saying that we have done brilliantly - but to claim we are worst in Europe / world is equally foolish

The whole 'I voted tory because labour are pro trans so are anti women' is the most ridiculous flaunting of middle class privilege. Totally ignoring conservatives record of persecuting single mothers, public sector workers who are disproportionately women, hatred of feminism, endless pushing of 'tradional family roles ' (i.e keeping women in the kitchen) and having the likes of Christopher Chope and Phillip Chope in the party.

But you've got your fucking money so dont give a shit, the overwhelming political worry in your life is seeing a trans person (I dont think i've ever even seen a trans person) at the swimming pool so you'l throw it all in with the right and then turn up the Archers when they start abusing feminists and refusing to pay women an equal wage again?

*Phillip Davies

Heres a member of your party for women

'The Conservative MP Philip Davies has once again used his position in the House of Commons to attempt to undermine a bill relating to domestic and sexual violence.

Davies objected to Conservative MP Nusrat Ghani’s bill, which sought to end the use of the term “honour crime” in official government publications. The bill also argued for the extension of extraterritorial jurisdiction in some instances of domestic violence crimes committed against UK citizens, such as the recent Seeta Kaur case.'

'It was not the first time Davies has intervened in parliamentary proceedings with the clear purpose of derailing measures intended to tackle violence against women and girls. In December, he filibustered for more than an hour in an attempt to prevent the passage of a bill calling for ratification of the Istanbul Convention, which has been described as a “gold standard” for tackling violence against women. Just last week, he also spent more than an hour filibustering a bill from MP Caroline Lucas which sought to make sex and relationships education compulsory, so she was unable to finish her opening speech or proceed to a vote.'

'Today Davies called for the word “women” to be removed from the women and equalities committee. He has previously described feminists as “zealots”, voted against equalities legislation, argued against equality targets in the workplace and once tabled a private member’s bill that would have repealed the Sex Discrimination Act 2002. Last year, he spoke at a conference organised by the Justice for Men and Boys party, which is known for presenting petty “whining feminist” certificates to women’s rights advocates, and promoting inflammatory, misogynistic articles on its website such as one entitled “13 reasons women lie about being raped”

-Laura Bates

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/feb/02/is-philip-davies-fit-to-be-an-mp

Bless you user, you obviously know nothing of the debate same as tomm.

There will be no single mothers, because already mother is a dirty word and birthing parent is the new mother. There will be wage parity because men who Identify as women dont suddenly lose 20%of their wages on transition.
Also I got no money from this, wish I had it would have made my choice easier.
And personally I'm more bothered about transwomen in female prisons. It's already happened and women were assaulted. And the as yet unlikely but not improbable transwomen in male prisons. I'm bothered that young girls are having to share with trans girls and IF they say a word it's off to reeducation.

I'm bothered about the creep of womens words and ability to meet to discuss anything at all being damaged. I'm bothered that people think a board made up of 50% men and 50% transwomen is fully coequal to having 50%women. Clue it's not.
Lots of things that involve only women, if women lose this battle then women are lost.
Labour cannot tell what a woman is.

Philip Davies is not a positive example to use. All parties have their outliers. David Davies would be a better example of a pro woman Tory mp ( not the Former brexit minister but the other one)

The Labour Party ideologically seems to import ideas from the USA such as trans right at the expense of women's rights.
Liz Truss stood up for women's rights against fierce opposition from Labour.
This was my dad's MP, just pointing out not all Labour politicians are inherently 'good'.
www.womenarehuman.com/politician-who-advocated-mixed-sex-restrooms-changing-rooms-accused-of-sexual-activity-with-a-child-david-smith/

I think the drift toward American style identity politics and away from -now old fashioned- class politics has a lot to do with it, voters in the North East are pretty socially conservative and pro Brexit; that was a good match with the Conservative Party.