To want my husband at our baby scan?!!

[MrsBonnie]

I have our first scan on Monday and have to go it alone... I'm so worked up worrying about getting bad news and having to hear it on my own.

You can do SO many things with other people, yet I can't go into a baby scan, both wearing masks, with my husband?!!

Am I being unreasonable to whinge about this?

@mincepiesalready

I’m sorry if posters have anxiety. But their ‘anxiety’ doesn’t trump my ‘anxiety’ (I did that deliberately to show you the context.) Pardon me for not wanting to get seriously ill and pass that onto my unborn baby.

But no-one is saying it does. She is explaining why it is hard for her, after you dismissed her as behaving like a little girl who wants a hand-hold and a colouring book (!?) for wanting her partner there.

To which, if you actually did have any empathy and respect for mental health (which you've pretty much admitted you don't thinking it's just a ploy people use to stamp their feet and get their own way) you would have said something like "wow that sounds really hard, I'm sorry you've had so many losses. It must make it really difficult for you to go alone. Unfortunately at the moment it's the only way to keep you and the rest of us safe from covid, but I recognise it is a big sacrifice for you."

Instead you decided to be incredibly rude and dismissive.

@mincepiesalready

They are a serious issue all right when they are genuine.

People confuse ‘things I don’t want to do’ and ‘things that make me sad and uncomfortable’ with a ‘mental health problem.’

Okay so you are openly admitting now that you think their severe anxiety disorder is not genuine?

Gosh.

@Corilee2806

Oh and really appreciated the measured, sane response from *@TammySwansonTwo*. It’s the first time I’ve seen such a thorough and rationale explanation of why things have to be the way they are, the trusts that aren’t able to relax their restrictions could learn a thing or two from you about their comms and talking to people like they’re adults. It’s certainly made me see things a bit differently. the other thing it would be great to see more of is what alternatives or mitigations can be put in place especially for the most difficult or traumatic situations that are likely to have an impact on post natal mental health. I haven’t seen any discussion around this at all!

Many people have been trying really hard to get the trusts to put out more information about why restrictions can’t be lifted at this time, why it’s not like going to the pub etc. I think more communication would make a big difference but it’s not happening. It’s very frustrating and I completely understand why so many are so upset.

And to clarify an earlier point, there has been no guidance stating that trusts must lift restrictions. There was guidance stating that trusts must do the risk assessments quickly, and the latest guidance said that 2m social distancing must be maintained. If they don’t have the space for it there’s nothing they can do to resolve this. It’s different in each trust because every unit is different.

@mincepiesalready

When posters who I presume are adult women are saying they ‘can’t’ go into a scan alone yes I do roll my eyes a bit. I could manage a hospital appointment alone at 14 so I’m pretty sure they can manage it as adults. It’s no wonder we get patronised and talked down to so much as pregnant women if these attitudes are widely accepted.

And it's no wonder that mental health is still so badly managed in this country when people who do open up are told they aren't genuine and met with sarcasm and mockery.

I can understand why you’re upset but try and keep it in some perspective. I think @TammySwansonTwo explains it perfectly.
Good luck at the scan,whether you’re alone or not.

The rooms in private clinics are probably larger which makes it much easier to distance.

Private clinics can time things so there is only one couple in the clinic at a time. NHS can’t do that and be able to get everyone through their appointments as needed too.

People can make the choice to go to a private scan or not. Women who are in a high risk group can’t not go their NHS scans.

It was clearly used to point out we are adults balkin and while it might be preferable to have another adult with us we don’t ‘need’ one in the way a very young child would.

I am not in any way treating mental health as unimportant here. I simply have the opinion, which obviously differs to yours, that first of all someone’s mental health does not override every time someone else mental or physical health. It is wrong and quite manipulative to make demands on this basis.

Mental health is also full of people who will use it to try to further their own agenda. In this instance that’s women who want their partners with them. Anything that is done to support people with mental health problems should be done based on the best evidence and judged by people with appropriate qualifications - not based on what the loudest group of people decide they want.

It’s also complex. I think it’s actually quite dismissive of real MH problems to decide that anything that might cause someone worry is therefore either the cause or trigger of ‘anxiety’ hence the inverted commas.

Whether you have mental health problems or not, learning to do things like attending medical appointments alone is really very basic in terms of adulting skills.

I know where you’re coming from and I do sympathise, but I don’t think it is unreasonable that you have to attend alone. A routine pregnancy scan is not akin to going to the pub, going shopping etc all of which are completely optional leisure activities. It is akin to someone attending any other hospital appointment alone where there is the possibility of bad news. Ultimately in a toss-up between essential NHS services being cut even further because increased hospital traffic is pushing up infection rates and pregnant women going to routine appointments alone, I’d choose the latter. Remember it’s not actually just about sonographers getting Covid, it’s also about them catching the common cold and having to self isolate until their test results coming back- this results in staff shortages, cancelled clinics and has a knock-on effect on ante-natal care. So I’m afraid I think YABU and I say this as someone who is currently 23w pregnant and attended alone to a private scan at 8 weeks, my 12 and 20w scans and the appointments with the consultant to book my c-section. Incidentally I had a MMC of twins last December and I was alone when I found that out and yes, it was the worst day of my life but that was because my babies were dead, not because my husband wasn’t there - I still had all of his support and the wider support of my family and friends when I left the clinic. I wish you the absolute best of luck with your scan and hope you have a happy and healthy pregnancy going forward.

When my baby was 4 months old, dh and I both got on a roller coaster. DF asked us what he thought we were doing. If we both died, what did he think would happen to our baby? His point was that we needed to think about more than just ourselves.
Same for the op, and all other fit and well women having routine scans. There is a global pandemic on, and hospital is the one place where you are guaranteed to find people with bugs. Why increase your chances of getting sick, or passing the illness on to someone else? Yes, its shit not being able to have your partner with you, but there are much worse things. I could go on with examples, but I won't.

yes, it was the worst day of my life but that was because my babies were dead, not because my husband wasn’t there

Yes exactly

Honestly, anyone saying you are being unreasonable needs a kick up the hole.

Of course you aren't. I gave birth over lockdown and I found it emotionally very difficult. The rules surrounding pregnant mothers are a joke.

But, of course there's always a few who cannot wait to shit on another woman with an absolutely stinking attitude following closely behind. They should be ashamed of themselves.

@mincepiesalready

People confuse ‘things I don’t want to do’ and ‘things that make me sad and uncomfortable’ with a ‘mental health problem.’

And you are in a position to make this assessment on a poster you've never met how precisely? Telepathy?

One of the (many) reasons people don't seek help for mental health problems is that the line between 'being a bit unhappy' and 'being clinically depressed' is not a fixed and obvious thing. And who is to know if someone feels like they can't get up in the morning whether they actually COULD if they just pushed themselves a little harder, or whether they genuinely can't because they are in the grip of black depression? How are THEY to know?

People saying 'you're not really anxious, you just feel uncomfortable with something' MAY be the magical panacea they need to pull themselves together, or it may be the spur to make them doubt themselves, hate themselves for being so weak, stop talking to those who could help them, spiral down. Do you, random you, genuinely feel like you are in a position to know which is which? Or do you take no responsibility for their response to your offhand words - after all, that's on them right?

Sorry but You are kidding yourself if you think you understand, respect or empathise with mental health problems. You simply do not. Own it by all means, but own the damage you may do to others by dismissing mental illness in the way you have done too.

Precisely my point venice

It’s not my place to do so, or yours. Decisions about mental health should be left to the professionals. Sometimes those decisions are difficult.

I've got two teenage DC's now and when I was pregnant I attended all scans without my DH - it wouldn't have occurred to me to ask him to take the time off (and I don't think it was the norm either).

The second 12 week scan I had was a failed pregnancy unfortunately, but I just had to get on with it and go straight back to work after the appointment.

It not nice but this feels like small fry in the scale of things. I know it's not a race to the bottom but I have a relative going through palliative cancer care at the moment and all of their treatments are having to be done solo.
You have to accept the situation for what it is. You can't change it and stressing over it will only serve to make you feel worse. Try and frame it as a positive experience. You are going to be able to see your baby remember any little things to tell your partner and laugh over later. Baby wouldn't stay still and they had to chase them with the scanner for example one of ours at a later scan flipped off the radiologist.
Take a notebook to write down anything important you think you might forget.

Good luck and look forward to being able to pee afterwards :)

@mincepiesalready

Mental health is also full of people who will use it to try to further their own agenda. In this instance that’s women who want their partners with them. Anything that is done to support people with mental health problems should be done based on the best evidence and judged by people with appropriate qualifications - not based on what the loudest group of people decide they want.

What is this 'mental health' that is 'full of' these people? Are you talking about the sufferers of mental health problems? The charities set up to support them? Or a great cohort of fakers you are able to identify somehow among the genuine and deserving sufferers? Do YOU have appropriate qualifications?

You are doing it again.

decide that anything that might cause someone worry is therefore either the cause or trigger of ‘anxiety’ hence the inverted commas

Why do you keep insisting that this was just a case of the nerves or a bit of a worry. The poster quite clearly explained there was a medically diagnosed anxiety condition which required medication and counselling for some time and was surrounding pregnancy related medical appointments due to multiple losses.

That very well could trigger anxiety and it is absolutely dismissive to put it in the same category as a spot of worry or nerves about a scan.

Why are you so insistent that this poster doesn't have the type of problem that she describes? Why are you so sure it isn't as bad as she's made out? Is it because as per your original 'anxiety' in quotation marks post, you don't believe it exists or are sceptical about the genuineness of it? If so, then yes I still think that makes you an arse.

This isn't even about disagreeing with your general point that MH doesn't come before all other things. This is about your constant dismissal of someone's genuine medical problem as if it's nothing.

I don’t think @mincepiesalready is trying to belittle mental health at all, I think what they are trying to say and please correct me if I’m wrong mincepies.

But that feeling anxious and having anxiety are completely different things. Of course lots of women are going to feel anxious about a medical appointment regarding their unborn child regardless of a pandemic, but not everyone of those women have an anxiety disorder. It’s more situational anxiety which is heightened due to the current situation. If everyone who felt anxious about the appointment was allowed a partner in, then the waiting rooms would be full. Unfortunately the people with genuine anxiety disorders are going to suffer in this situation but ultimately the hospitals have to make it a blanket rule.

It’s an impossible situation and I feel for women that are finding it hard.

YANBU. I had to go to my 12 week scan alone last week. Its s**t. We'll probably pay for extra reassurance scans to allow DH to come along to.

Also, how does a person's partner really increase the risk of transmitting covid around a hospital? If she lives with (him, for the sake of this argument), and he drove her there, if he has asymtomatic covid then the chances are so does she. Similarly, if he's there for established labour, surrounded by midwives, anaesthetists etc, then goes home... it's already been passed on. What difference does him sitting beside her in bed make?

I totally understand not having other visitors but the partner should absolutely be there for scans and during and after the birth. It's their child too. They're fully entitled to be there to see their baby and to support mum. Especially as most maternity units are horrendously under staffed, partners typically are there to make up the shortfall, as much as it shouldn't happen.

I honestly think some people just like kicking people when they're down to make themselves feel better.

I had to go to a breast referral app at the breast clinic and as I sat in the waiting room looking around, I thought how many of these women are going to be told they had breast cancer on their own.

@Sirzy

People can make the choice to go to a private scan or not. Women who are in a high risk group can’t not go their NHS scans.

People with insufficient funds cannot make that 'choice'.

And I’m not saying that in relation to any previous posters, I just mean in general.

[quote VeniceQueen2004]@Sirzy

People can make the choice to go to a private scan or not. Women who are in a high risk group can’t not go their NHS scans.

People with insufficient funds cannot make that 'choice'.[/quote]
I was posting in reply to a poster asking why private places could do it and nhs couldn’t.

It’s a shit situation but while things are so bad it isn’t likely to change because they need to keep people as safe as possible who don’t have a choice but to be there

It’s a tough one... I’m 37 weeks pregnant (conceived pre COVID just to point out) and after previous loss was EXTREMELY anxious for the 12 week scan. I was so upset my partner couldn’t attend but it wasn’t actually bad at all- I realised if it was bad news it would have been the same outcome whether he was there or not and he was waiting in the car anyway. We decided to pay for 2 private scans after this and it was worth every penny, my OH felt he was missing out- this solved that problem. I realised for me, I didn’t end up minding being alone, this is a high risk pregnancy and I’ve had 11 scans to date and seen under various consultants bi-weekly- alone obviously, and it has felt completely manageable (he’s at work anyway)
I have more of an issue with the fact my hospital have not lifted restrictions around birth and I find the fact he has to leave after 1 hour quite sad, but I can’t disagree with the rules because I do believe they are there for a reason 🤷🏼‍♀️
I have friends who have decided to TTC during the pandemic- I warned them of the restrictions and I do believe they made that decision knowing the consequences and can’t really complain IMO. If you do choose to have a baby during a pandemic, knowing there is very limited allowance for partners support, you can’t act surprised when they aren’t allowed in- but I do understand that can be upsetting.