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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To say to hell with the rule of 6 this Christmas

214 replies

Whatafustercluck · 17/10/2020 08:11

We've been having discussions about who we should have over this Christmas should the rule of 6 still be in place in our region. We had talked to family and my parents wanted my dsis and niece to be able to spend Christmas with us, so the DC can at least be together. Ad a result, they've made alternative plans just the 2 of them. Dsis and her family will do something on their own because she and bil normally do anyway. So, our Christmas was going to be me, dh, our 2 dc, dsis and niece.

Since then, a good friend of ours has told us she has been having tests for ovarian cancer. The medical professionals have prepared her for the worst. The mass is huge. She is preparing herself to be told it's terminal and has already said she will not be having chemo or radiotherapy if it is stage 3. She's completely on her on her own on what could well be her last Christmas. We spoke yesterday and have invited her, meaning we will be 7 this Christmas. She has accepted, saying she doesn't care about shielding and is happy to take the risk.

Our neighbours are lovely and I think would totally understand if we explain. We just couldn't let her be on her own this Christmas after this news and the totally awful year she's already had. Likewise we cannot/ don't want to uninvite dsis.

Aibu?

OP posts:
Pelleas · 17/10/2020 09:19

It's too early to say what the rules will be in December. In a tier 2 or 3 area at the moment, you couldn't even have six people round to your house. It might be that, by December, all of the UK is under tier 3 restrictions. Or it might be that the current restrictions will work and things will be relaxed.

One possibility is that the government will apply a waiver for Christmas to allow slightly higher numbers than would normally be allowed - on the grounds that people are more likely to be able to stick to (say) a rule of 10 - but if it's kept at 6 they will break it with abandon and have 20 people.

What I'm getting round to saying, OP, is that it's too early to worry about breaking rules because we don't know what the rules will be. Plan tentatively for the 7 of you, see what happens, and don't fret until you need to.

bakereld · 17/10/2020 09:20

@BarcyDussell

I fully expect that by Xmas, there may be a full lockdown or with far more restrictions as the numbers are rising hugely and exponentially.

We are as high as before (first wave) and the increase exponentially on current cases will not be available for another 3-4 weeks as the stats are always 3 weeks behind.

The Rule of 6 was not something BJ made up -it's led by science.

Personally I can't see why people are willing to risk numbers rising by breaking rules because it everyone did this- oh, hang on !- it would result in more cases and more deaths.

Christmas is just a day; you aren't going to die if you don't 'have' Christmas, but you might if you mix with too many people.

'Christmas is just a day; you aren't going to die if you don't 'have' Christmas, but you might if you mix with too many people.'

I'm going to start using this saying, thanks @BarcyDussell I totally agree with you.

BarcyDussell · 17/10/2020 09:20

@Lexilooo You are mixed up.

You can have one household supporting a single person living alone.

My sister is my Mum's support bubble- mum is 95 - I can't enter her home as I am another household living elsewhere.

diggadoo · 17/10/2020 09:22

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the request of the OP.

BarcyDussell · 17/10/2020 09:22

Oh thanks @bakereld

TheFormattingIsWrong · 17/10/2020 09:25

We won't be following it either whatever the rules are by then. We'll be having our normal family Christmas of 8.

minipie · 17/10/2020 09:27

I’ve no objection to you having 7 rather than 6, at all.

I am a bit surprised at your friend saying she won’t have treatment if it’s stage 3 - survival rates at stage 3 are not great but not terrible, as I recall 35% survive to 5 years and 25% to ten years? Of course that is with treatment i imagine. My mum is stage 3 and is having treatment. Obviously it’s your friend’s decision however.

Movinghouseatlast · 17/10/2020 09:27

I'm so sorry about your friend. I am a real sticker for the rules, but in this case I think 7 people is fine.

Poor woman, what a horrible horrible thing for her.

GlummyMcGlummerson · 17/10/2020 09:28

@diggadoo

By 25th December, you could be in an area that allows no household mixing at all. Making plans outside of your immediate household is likely to leave many disappointed.
Yes but people still would (and should) visit family over Christmas.

It's totally disingenuous hysteria to claim "YOU COULD DIE" about something that kills less than 1% who contract it

wanderings · 17/10/2020 09:34

The word "selfish" has only been used once on this thread (without being quoted). Shock Shock Shock Where are the mob with their torches and pitchforks, screaming "you selfish arseholes are killing grannies"?

TheFormattingIsWrong · 17/10/2020 09:36

Where are the mob with their torches and pitchforks, screaming "you selfish arseholes are killing grannies"?

They're all on my thread Grin

mum11970 · 17/10/2020 09:36

Are you in England? Children under 11 are exempt from the rule of 6 in Wales and under 12 in Scotland.
I would just go ahead and have your friend round for Christmas anyway though.

AnnaMagnani · 17/10/2020 09:40

Obviously no-one would object to your friend being at your Christmas.

However like other posters I think she is jumping the gun on her decisions about treatment. She doesn't seem to have had a biopsy confirming what sort of cancer it is yet, or a treatment plan so hasn't been given any sort of prognosis.

Many kinds of ovarian cancer respond very well to chemotherapy so she would be wrong to rule it out without discussion as to what is genuinely going to be on offer to her.

Original poster
Whatafustercluck · 17/10/2020 09:41

@minipie I think she's saying that having had the benefit of some discussion with the medical professionals, and knowing that she would be a high risk for any kinds of invasive surgery being clinically obese (she had a gastric bypass in August, paid for privately, to reduce her weight). I know that it's possible to survive stage 3 in many cases and obviously I really hope that's the case. But being realistic she knows the odds are stacked against her and is doubtful they would give her surgery as she's not yet back on proper food after her bypass. She has vitamin D and B12 deficiency too. She believes she has already 'made peace with' potentially dying - she says she has no dependents or she may feel differently. Her mother was her beat friend and she had wanted her to travel before she dies. She therefore wants to use whatever time she may have left making the most of living, not putting all her effort into coping with treatment. Tbh I get that. She's spoken about wanting to at least visit Italiy before she gets too ill.

OP posts:
ArtieFufkinPolymerRecords · 17/10/2020 09:41

@Lexilooo

Your friend as a single person living alone can form a support bubble with you and be treated as part of your household.

Your sister as a single parent to an under 18 can do the same.

Rule of six doesn't apply if you are all part of the same household or support bubble.

I'm pretty sure a family can only form a bubble with one single person, otherwise what would stop people forming bubbles with a whole group of people who live alone.
Brefugee · 17/10/2020 09:42

I wouldn't say anything to your neighbours, I doubt they are going to be counting who is coming and going on the street Christmas day

I wouldn't count on that. But do what you think is right - if you do break the rule of 6 be prepared to pay the fine or whatever, because one thing this pandemic has shown us is that the Stasi would have been able to recruit as many people in the UK as they did in the DDR.

neveradullmoment99 · 17/10/2020 09:44

@Winterwoollies

Every inch of my being is saying ‘fuck it’. We live in the arsehole of nowhere, we can ask the whole family to isolate for two weeks before if we need to. But this has been a rough year and I will not be robbed of a family Christmas.
It could take one person to have covid and spread it to your whole family. Its not about arbitrary rules done without meaning. The rules are about safety for you and your family. You may in the end be robbed of a family member. For the OP, I get you dilemma. Not sure what the answer is but your friend may be especially vulnerable depending upon her treatment. Something to consider.
Antonov · 17/10/2020 09:45

@Winterwoollies

Every inch of my being is saying ‘fuck it’. We live in the arsehole of nowhere, we can ask the whole family to isolate for two weeks before if we need to. But this has been a rough year and I will not be robbed of a family Christmas.
I think this will be the way for many this Christmas
AdoptAdaptImprove · 17/10/2020 09:48

I want to start by saying I have every sympathy with the OP, and applaud her wanting to support a friend.

Now I am going to ask everyone else on the thread something I’ve posted elsewhere, and never had a straight answer to, but would love one.

What enormous mansions are you living in that you can have six people around your dining room table and still maintain 2m distance between everyone? Because having 6 at home doesn’t mean without social distancing! At no point has the requirement for 2m distance, or 1m with a mask (hard to eat your turkey through) to stop the potential risk associated with being indoors with people outside your household, been abandoned. So how are you all managing it?

If you meet with people from multiple households indoors without social distancing, you are taking risks which put large numbers of others at risk they aren’t aware of - those families’ colleagues, friends they meet with elsewhere, their healthcare providers, people on the bus.

It’s clear to me, reading this forum regularly, that transmission in homes must be a huge contributory factor to the present rise if everyone meeting in groups of up to six from multiple households aren’t social distancing when they do so.

How many of you are honestly social distancing when following the rule of 6?

neveradullmoment99 · 17/10/2020 09:48

And what about at the other end when you all go back to work? School?
What if you spread it to teachers, people at work...

Heyahun · 17/10/2020 09:52

I’d be far too worried about my friends health to be honest!

BarcyDussell · 17/10/2020 09:52

@AdoptAdaptImprove

We aren't. We are probably not 'doing Christmas' for that very reason.

We may have 1 DC who lives alone with us for a few hours.

Brefugee · 17/10/2020 09:57

agree that it's one day and that we need to suck it up this year. I wonder where all the people who were pointing fingers at Muslims celebrating Eid are now. Strictly sticking to the rule of 6 or ignoring it because, whatever?

Bouledeneige · 17/10/2020 09:57

I think OP that your plan is a good and kind one. I am trying to adhere to the rules but I may stretch them at some point. I'm on my own as my DC are both at uni and I will do my best to just see friends outdoors but I can't say I will never ever break the rules.

On Christmas Day I am planning for it to be just us 3. We are usually 16. I had thought of getting my DSIS and nephew and niece as well but actually as they are all grown up that would be 3 extra households. And my nephew lives in Portugal so probably won't be flying here anyway.

But lets see what the rules are by then.

Heyahun · 17/10/2020 09:59

Just fear that if everyone breaks the rules - then the restrictions will just stay longer - there’ll be hushed outbreaks after Xmas and then half of next year will be locked down again

Surely we can all skip one bloody day Having a big group get together for one year and try get back to normal life sooner

In this ops case - maybe just have the friend seeing as it could be her last year - but tell sister and niece to go elsewhere