Questions for white people

[Questionspandemic]

Why are white people offended by black people talking about racism?

Obviously not all white people are racist and name changed - in case of gaslighting.

Usually it’s because they’re embarrassed by others actions.
It’s an in built guilt thing. That or embarrassed that it still happens and sadly it’s so institutionalised that’s we can’t immediately prevent it.
I don’t think offended is the right term though.

I think we live in a culture and am education system that discourages us from looking at group patterns. How convenient fir the status quo.

So everything is viewed at the individual level therefore people feel personally attacked.

It’s why I’ve stopped talking to men about feminism.

FelicityPike to an extend of silencing them about their experiences - e.g. BGT, Lewis Hamilton, the outrage about BLM marches, etc?

So everything is viewed at the individual level therefore people feel personally attacked

I think for a lot of people its the above

Plus some people are stupid and ignorant

Because it highlights a major flaw in them and their family and friends. Same reason men get offended when women talk about our risk of sexual assault and even day to day sexism.

I think at the root is the fact that people generally don’t like to question their own behaviour and values. It’s uncomfortable and confronting and people try to avoid that by burying their head in the sand. Plus, lots of people don’t see themselves as privileged so struggle to acknowledge that they benefit from racism/white privilege. There’s a knee-jerk “but my life is hard!” reaction.

Generally I think most people struggle to care deeply about things which don't directly affect them

Because it makes us feel very uncomfortable and we don’t always realise we need to feel uncomfortable to make change happen. We prefer to think we aren’t part of the problem even when it’s glaringly obvious that we are the problem.

Because they genuinely don't believe it's real. Which is total BS. But there you go.

DS came to me very confused recently because an older friend of his told him that Jewish people get people to say things and then make up stuff to say that it's racist. It meant a very difficult conversation because how could I explain to him that lots of people say and do racist things but because they don't think they are racist, they refuse to listen to the people who are the recipient of these comments.

White people often truly genuinely believe that they're supportive of PoC and that if those people can do the job/interact with them/ whatever, then they will have no issue with them. But they don't have a clue how deep seated cultural stereotypes are or how they are setting others up to fail.

I am white. I see a lot of this. And yet I'm pretty sure I still do and think things that are deeply entrenched in my white privilege. As a woman, I think I can see it a bit easier because I can feel the day to day misogyny so it's less difficult to see a similar but different dynamic with racism. But then, lots of women don't see misogyny either so....

I think because they see themselves as the supreme race and see black people discussing racism as insolent and speaking out against “elders and betters”

Whilst of course denying they are in any way racist.

You just have to read any books on British empire to see where this attitude came from.

I think some people are offended by people talking about racism and some of those are white. I don’t think it’s a uniform situation. For myself I think that I am responsible for my own behaviour not that of my forefathers.

I think people see it as a criticism.

I'd agree with most of what been said already but I also think that it's very generalised 'white people do this' 'White people do that' it then becomes personal because you're including all the non racist white people in the discussion about the negative things racist White people do and they don't feel they deserve to be lumped in with them, I can no more control a group of people I don't even know than I can my ancestors.

Privilege is such an over-used word but I think it's very hard to accept that, even though you may not feel enormously privileged, your skin colour does privilege you. I'm writing this as a working class Scottish woman who often had to hide from people coming round our house looking for money - I don't feel like there was much privilege in my upbringing. But of course there was because my skin colour 'matched' the prevailing culture.

It's hard to unpick it. I find when I want to say 'but xyz' is when it's my privilege is rearing up, so I try and shut up at that point.

Because people are uncomfortable being stereotyped. The same reason black people get offended when gay people talk to them about homophobia.

Yes, people are fragile and think they're being called racist and are being asked to apologise or defend themselves. When actually they just need to shut up and listen, and consider why they can't assert 'this country is not at all racist'.

I think they (we) go to defensive as an initial reaction. It's quite hard work to unpick such complex and ingrained thoughts and feelings. And it doesn't ever end. So much easier to just deny it.

I think some white people want to be in control of what is discussed when they are in a conversation. White people usually don't want to talk about racism.

Some also don't like black people discussing racism between themselves to the exclusion of white people, and say that is racist (literally saw such a comment on here the other day).

Not offended - but when some (not all) black men talk about racism, their male privilege is definitely showing. As a woman, I find it hard to listen to men (of any race) who are openly misogynistic, even when the message is important. I prefer to listen to the voices and experiences of black women.

Some people find it deeply problematic to experience themselves as perpetrators of inequality. Some people misunderstand the term 'white privilege' and scream about their poverty/poor education/lack of opportunity/disability. Some people have deeply ingrained views about the 'right type' of non-white person ideally grateful for being allowed in the gates, unchallenging of the status quo, reluctant to protest or do anything that might associate them with the Angry Black Person stereotype, downplaying their own race. (This type of person overlaps strongly with the imaginary-- BAME colleague who thinks that being called a racial epithet in the office is just jolly bantz and never PLays the Race Card.) Some people simply don't like a conversation in which they are called upon to play only a listening/learning role.

Some people are as thick as a pig's ear, and have no understanding of structural or institutional racism, and think it's not racism unless it's someone actually hurling racialised abuse at someone on the street, and even then they think that there can be anti-white racism, because they don't grasp the difference between racism and ethnic prejudice minus the power.

I mean, I could go on.

I am white. I try very hard not to be offended by black people talking about race, whilst also trying to be aware of my own internal biases etc.

I think that the issue for many is that they view racism as very specific acts which they don’t themselves do - such as using slurs, refusing to hire black people, attacking people because they’re black, etc. If they don’t do those things themselves they don’t perceive themselves as racist, and therefore get very defensive when they hear people talking about ‘all white people’.

I think white people struggle to recognise that racism isn’t just using slurs. It’s about choosing not to participate in dismantling racist systems. It’s about not feeling responsible for inequality because you didn’t personally create the conditions that make it that way. It’s about prioritising your feelings of being a good person over the experiences of a black person living in a racist society. But that takes a deep recognition that you haven’t been doing enough and should be doing more, and people struggle to acknowledge that because they don’t want to face up to their own implicit racism.

I’ve struggled myself. I try very hard to be a good ally; but I’ve definitely fallen into the trap of thinking ‘but I’m one of the good ones! This doesn’t apply to me!’ when hearing black people talk about their experiences of racism. I have to work very consciously to hold front and centre the fact that I benefit from living in a racist society, and if I’m not actively taking steps to dismantle that then I am being racist and contributing to the issue.

Not sure any of that makes sense - but ultimately I think it simply comes down to people’s fear of being confronted with an unwelcome truth that they’re scared of acknowledging, because it’s fundamentally at odds with how they view themselves.

I think because they see themselves as the supreme race and see black people discussing racism as insolent and speaking out against “elders and betters”

It's this type of shit that makes me angry and shut down to be honest. I am white, my family are white. The statement above is true for SOME white people not ALL.

So many reasons.
Partly it's about the difference between individual experience and population wide experience. The individual doesn't think they are racist. Let's say they are 99% not racist, and have 1% hidden bias (that's someone like me- not intentionally racist but there will be some things I'm not noticed about myself). Add that up across an organisation or population and it becomes a significant barrier. But no individual feels racist.

At an individual level, if a white person from a disadvantaged background fails to get a job because positive discrimination favours a bame candidate then they will feel discriminated against, that the policy is racist, that BAME candidates have advantages over white candidates etc.

Because we can't see our own privilege
Because we see other people with other barriers (poor white boys) and think 'what about them'.
Because as individuals we are not racist, but live in a society that is racist.

When I first learned about white privilege (right here on MN many years ago) my reactions were: well that’s never affected me, oh I see maybe it has, oh it definitely has, oh crap that’s awful, thank god I’m white, fuck me it was nasty to think that.

It’s kind of settled down into a vastly improved awareness, but of course there’s always more I can learn so I listen carefully

Good question. My inlaws are racist. Not that they would shout at people in the street but they certainly see people of colour as not to be trusted, weird and they're not very welcome. I pull them up on it and remind them that my loved half sisters are mixed race so they now comment less when I'm present. I really have no idea why they are racist. They do see BAME people talking about racism as if they are attention seeking and it's so inconvenient. I don't think that they will change anymore, it's up to the next generation to be more inclusive.