To tell my son he scraped a pass when he didn’t?

[Afibtomyboy]

My son is due to take the 11 plus test in a month.

We paid for a private tutor last two years (as is the norm around here).
He has done a revision course And mocks.
He’s a bright boy and should pass.

However, he likely now won’t be going to grammar school as we will keep him at the private Prep school he currently goes to (that Goes up to year 8) and then on to another private school, which has its own admissions process rather than the 11 plus.

So... Pass or fail has no consequence whatsoever, and here’s the thing.... He has very very low self confidence. We are awaiting an adhd diagnosis (mild). He and his friends are competitive, actively encouraged by the school (a good thing IMO) and results will be discussed.

I am so worried about the impact on his self confidence if he does fail. I can’t tell you how much we have worked on building up his confidence over the last year, and it’s reaped so much. He’s so much happier, so much more settled. It is very positive but I strongly sense that an 11 plus fail will go deep, very deep and have a lingering negative impact.

Seeing as the impact of the result isn’t going to change our plan to keep him at current school (when we embarked on the 11 plus tutoring and process we didn’t think he would be staying but now we have sufficient funds to facilitate it, hence the change in plan. Still plan to take though, as head of current school says it will be very good preparation for the admissions process to the school we hope he will go to), AIBU to tell him that he did pass (but say that it was a scraped pass, but a pass nonetheless) if he does fail?

I think if you’re so convinced he will fail despite years of tutoring it would be better for both you and your son to realise he is not academically gifted and to take the pressure off him. My mum worked with a family whose son was average if not below average intelligence, but they had money and were obsessed with him becoming a doctor or lawyer etc. Years and years of intensive tutoring, prep courses, pulling strings to get him into the best grammar school and keep him there resulted in him flunking his GCSEs and A levels and becoming depressed and losing all of his confidence. He was then handed a managerial position at a family friend’s business and he couldn’t handle that either (probably because he had no confidence), so stacks shelves in his dad’s shops.

I don’t think any good comes from not being realistic about your child’s academic capabilities and putting so much pressure on them to achieve more than they’re able to. I wonder what their son could have done if he was encouraged and nurtured in something he was naturally good at.

If he wants to take it then tell him the truth about his mark. Because it makes no difference
But why? To please you?

I think you are being a bit naive about the option to lie to him. All the DC at his school will be talking about it, their scores, who passed, who failed. They will all have seen their email/letter, all the parents will be talking. So unless you plan to lie to everyone, edit the email and bluff it with the school, the truth will get out.

Lol at the Op, thanks for all the advice, I'm going to do what I was planning anyway. Why do some people post?

Those are my thought also.

Honestly, what an awful school system you seem to have in the UK - so much competitiveness and pressure on young kids. I can see why there is poor MH among so many young people. I feel sorry for your son OP, in every way.

@JinglingHellsBells

That’s not what happens though is it? Hot housing the middle class children for 3 years so they get the place

That's not what happens long term though.

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

If a child is 'hot housed' ( and it's actually impossible to make an average child bright) they tend to fall at the first hurdle. They might pass an entrance exam through learning by rote, for some parts of it, but when they are in the school they will sink to the bottom.

It's the same when they get to uni; I know of so many kids who were spoon fed at good public schools and practically had a their personal statements written by their teachers, and then they found it hard to cope with the reality of independent learning at uni. Some of them drop out.

Speaking from professional experience, all children find their own level in the end, regardless of 'cramming' for exams.

So if tutoring has no impact on their score- why bother paying? Why do thousands of parents bother to pay.....thousands of pounds- if it doesn’t work at all?!

It’s illogical or they wouldn’t bother. They obviously feel like it’s worth and that it will give them the best chance of passing. Of course it can’t be measured objectively, as no one knows if they’d have passed without the tuition.

I agree you can’t make an average child pass the 11+ with top marks, however, I think if you have a fairly bright child that has a chance of passing the test, the tutoring and practice can increase the score. Not necessarily significantly but enough to secure a place.

There in lies the advantage over a child with no tuition.

Back in the day, I was in the junior part of a selective private school and we all (in what is the equivalent of Year 6 now) had to take an entrance exam to proceed to the senior school.

One of the girls in the class claimed to have passed the exam, but that her parents had decided not to send her to the senior school after all but move her to a different school. Everyone in the class (bar the girl herself) and all their parents knew that she hadn't actually passed, but her parents were trying to cushion the blow. I'm fairly sure there were other children in the class that failed too, but I don't remember them now - I only remember the girl whose parents had lied to her.
Do not lie to your child. It will come out and you'll make it worse.

So if tutoring has no impact on their score- why bother paying? Why do thousands of parents bother to pay.....thousands of pounds- if it doesn’t work at all?!

@TableFlowerss You have misunderstood. My reply was in the context of another post. I never for a moment said tutoring doesn't work- you won't find that in my post.

What I did say was you can tutor a child to pass a test (I tutored children for decades and taught in schools) BUT you can't ensure that a child who passes a test with intensive tutoring will do well once they get to a selective school. I also gave another example of students who are tutored intensively for A-levels who often find university hard (and some drop out) as they can't cope with independent learning (without constant tutoring to boost their grades.)

Why on earth would you make him take it if plans have changed. There’s absolutely no need and it’ll cause him stress and worry he doesn’t need to participate in.

I couldn’t lie to my child for life. I also couldn’t justify putting them through such stress for no reason.

To be fair to the OP, she said 'he is a bright boy and should pass'.

The dilemma is his self esteem and how if, he fails the 11+, he will cope with knowing that.

What the OP ought to do is make it clear that his next school place is not dependent on the 11+ and he simply has to do his best in the exam. (If there is any point at all doing it, which I doubt.)

He will have to learn to cope with failure and rejection at some point, even if that is after getting a double first at Oxbridge and some employer turns him down!

No parent can or should create a situation so their child never experiences failure.

What we ought to do as parents is teach them to bounce back and see any failure as a step to something else, which they can learn from and build on.

Why on earth would you make him take it if plans have changed

The OP hasn't said so explicitly, but I suspect it's to 'keep up with the Jones' ' and she doesn't want her son to be the odd one out.

I'm thinking it's the OP who has self esteem issues (as well/too) because I find her posts reek of doing 'what's expected of certain parents living a certain lifestyle' as is the norm around here

The lack of confidence to make a sensible decision seems to be her own issue.

I don't see a " rough ride" anywhere here.

People lie, its horrible. Small ones , big ones..... You were a close second for the post/ he's out of the office at the moment/I'll get back to you/its not you it me.......on and on it goes.

If your own mother lies to you, thats in a different league.

@JinglingHellsBells

So if tutoring has no impact on their score- why bother paying? Why do thousands of parents bother to pay.....thousands of pounds- if it doesn’t work at all?!

@TableFlowerss You have misunderstood. My reply was in the context of another post. I never for a moment said tutoring doesn't work- you won't find that in my post.

What I did say was you can tutor a child to pass a test (I tutored children for decades and taught in schools) BUT you can't ensure that a child who passes a test with intensive tutoring will do well once they get to a selective school. I also gave another example of students who are tutored intensively for A-levels who often find university hard (and some drop out) as they can't cope with independent learning (without constant tutoring to boost their grades.)

Well in that case I absolutely agree with you!!

I thought you were implying that you can’t make a an averagely intelligent child perform above average. I assumed you meant that with regards to tutoring and that if they pass the test, it is because they were bright enough and not because of the tutoring.

You’re right, it’s ok inflating their grades until they get a place in the grammar school, but it’s very likely they’ll struggle if it wasn’t on natural academic ability.

People argue that tutoring doesn’t work to pass the test..... but my question to them is, why pay then?!

Tutoring to pass entrance exams is wrong. It can be incredibly damaging to the child and it also steals places from children who are naturally more academic and who would potentially thrive.
It's like asking Mariah Carey to record your entry tape into a talent show.

Pleased we have sorted that @TableFlowerss!

I very much meant that tutoring can help, but if it's simply pushing an average or below average child over a line, they will keep on struggling and it doesn't do their self esteem any good to know they are the one in a class who is always near the bottom. In that case it might be better to send them to a less academic school where they will be happier and the expectations won't be so high.

There is always the choice for late developers to transfer to a 6th form school/ college for A levels if they mature and do better than expected.

Tutoring to pass entrance exams is wrong. It can be incredibly damaging to the child !!

^^ this and this includes the interview prep courses. It's also counterproductive in the long run. It is one thing to pass the 11+ exams but what happens after that? So many children get into top schools because of tutoring and end up stressed, struggling to keep up, let alone perform to average standards once in. I have seen this so often with many of DC friends and the child is always on the losing side.

We are going through our 3rd round of 11+ exams. Never tutored. We only encouraged a lot of reading which significantly helped with Comprehension and the writing. First 2 both got into top London senior schools and are happy there. Some exams were performed better than others and some schools didn't offer a place, we told the DC because that's life, sometimes you do well, and other times you don't.

I don't think tutoring to pass entrance exam is wrong at all. Every parent want best for their children. If they can go to better school which may change the child's future, and you have means to do that, why not?

If the child who is academic and would thrive in the environment don't get the chance because others are tutored, the system is wrong, not the parents who wants best for their children.

Why is he still taking the exam? I can't believe you would do that to your own child, to have so little confidence in him and his abilities. No wonder he has such low self esteem if his own parents don't believe in him. Every single child has strengths and your job as parents and my job when I work with children is to find those strengths and support the child to develop them. Why are you not doing your job?

Also OP as your DC is already at a Prep, the school will already be preparing him for the exams. This usually starts from the summer term and intensifies in the Autumn term. Practice papers, interview skills, even mock interviews, music, sports scholarship techniques etc. There's no need for additional tutoring.

Tutoring to the test works and it's what people pay for. But tutoring doesn't boost ability. It might facilitate building foundations of knowledge that were missing but that is a school issue.
If a child doesn't have the academic ability or stamina to be in an academically intensive environment then there's no point in training them up for entry because you will have to keep up the tutoring through their school lives.

I can't believe you would do that to your own child, to have so little confidence in him and his abilities. No wonder he has such low self esteem if his own parents don't believe in him.

But the OP does have confidence in him- she says he's bright and is likely to pass @littlemsattitude

She's trying to find a way of telling or not telling him he failed if that happens.

I think it's more about her - she doesn't want to withdraw him from the exam, partly I guess because sitting the 11+ is the 'done' thing around where they are.

I would not let him sit the exam.

If he does and you only get a number, I would tell him the number and tell him the truth: you don't know if he got in or not. I would explain the process and leave it there.

You are not building confidence with lies.

@JinglingHellsBells

I can't believe you would do that to your own child, to have so little confidence in him and his abilities. No wonder he has such low self esteem if his own parents don't believe in him.

But the OP does have confidence in him- she says he's bright and is likely to pass @littlemsattitude

She's trying to find a way of telling or not telling him he failed if that happens.

I think it's more about her - she doesn't want to withdraw him from the exam, partly I guess because sitting the 11+ is the 'done' thing around where they are.

So why is she even considering the idea he will fail? I would not put a child with low self esteem in for the 11 plus when there is a good alternative which there is. I certainly wouldn't do it because it's the 'done thing'

Don't lie. That is the stupidest thing ever. Just take him out of the exam, and explain that he'll be sitting the entrance exam for the private school instead. Continue with the tutoring.

And get a grip.

Hey OP - it's clear that you care so much about your son and everything you are doing is coming from the right place, but it sounds like you might be over-invested in his academic success, and I do wonder if your anxiety is rubbing off in ways you're not aware of. You say he has sailed through all of his mocks and the tutor hasn't raised any alarm bells - yet you are already beavering away at contingency plans just in case he fails. You are trying to manage all possible risk for him, protect him from failure, smooth a perfect path for him - all of which is understandable (you love him!), but will this really help him to build confidence and resilience? Is there a danger that the energy you are pouring into this sends the message that failure / deviation from your perfect road map is disastrous?

I personally don't think you should lie to him - but instead help him to find some balance between understanding the importance of exam grades but putting them in context - they are not the only thing that matters, and will not ultimately determine how happy or successful he his in life. Perhaps it should be up to him whether or not he sits the exam? I say this as an incredibly anxious, Oxbridge-educated over-achieving swot who DESPERATELY needed someone to take her aside at this age and help her get some perspective.

What will you do if he doesn't sit the 11+ and then fails entrance exam?

At some point he's going to fail at something and the more that you string him along the harder future failure will be.

Just manage his expectations and the outcomes as best you can without putting him under huge amounts of pressure.

I read a thing in the times years ago written by a child psychologist and he said one of the worst things you can do to your child is shield them from failure. Exams and important tests get bigger in life the older you get, if you've never experienced failure it gets harder and harder to deal with as the stakes rise.

Just be open and honest with him. Manage his expectations and he may surprise you.