To ask what mainstream parents really think about the kids with special needs.

[Willbob]

I have a child with SEN. He has complex needs; statement at three transferred to ehcp. We had to fight for a mainstream setting. He has full time 1:1. My older childer is very bright and now goes to a selective grammar school for secondary education. I had the "normal" school parent experience with him.

Other parents at school are mainly pleasant, some more so than others like any parent really but completely different to my my experience with my older child. I do wonder though for those who don't understand or know the sen world what you really think about the kids in your child school like my son? I imagine some like it and see the value of having them there, where as some see them as a drain on funding or a distraction. Just curious really. Though this maybe a good place to ask as anonymous.

aren't subjected to violence - I really don't want children being attacked.

100% with BoobsOnTheMoon

I've also experienced parents on a secret Whatsapp group complaining about why one of the classes in that year group had all the SEN kids (a total of 3 including mine) and 1:1 help, and stating that it meant that their poppets were being held back and falling behind the other class by this.

Not understanding whatsoever of how SEN/resurce units work.
One of the parents outed the group as she was so disgusted by the tone of the messages.

@Xenia

It depends on what you mean by think about. I am sure everyone is glad he is getting an education and some of the children in his class with be his friend and others not as with all children.

I sent my children to selective private schools at 5 so although there are plenty of children with special needs at those schools they tend to be things like very high performing aspergers, some on ritalin I suppose but no one who has an IQ below 120 as a rough guess so they might have one arm or perhaps even be partially blind but no one who would change the fact the whole class works together at the same academic level.

I also only chose single sex schools as I wanted them only educated with people on the same sex too!

That does mean I think badly of boys when my girls are in the girls' school of course - it was just my choice and one reason have always worked full time even with 2 week old babies was to have move chance of exercising that choice of single sex schooling and academically selective schooling.

Bizarre Totally bizarre Surprising that @Xenia manages to shoe horn in that irrelevant information? Not in the slightest!

I did dislike a very disruptive child being in my DDs class because she would often come home upset about her behaviour, including her lashing out at DD and other children occasionally. The first thing my DD would talk about when I picked her up was this child and she was frequently distressed, I was really happy when she was kept back a year.

Another child in her young engineering class was autistic but that was a positive experience. He was disruptive but his dad stayed with him, the leader had a very inclusive attitude, DD was in awe of his abilities and he was completely accepted as part of the group by his peers.

I've seen the struggle from the other side too, my friend's DS has autism and ADHD. He is a lovely bit but very disruptive and it breaks his mum's heart when he is left out.

My son is now in high school, i do not remember a child being at his primary school knowing they have special needs, of course I am not saying there were no kids with special needs but I was not aware there was so i don't have an opinion

I moved my DD to a new preschool because of a boy with special needs. Do I blame that child or his parents? Absolutely not. His mum was lovely and so positive and patient in spite of what I imagine was a very stressful home life. I admired her greatly though I would never want her life.

The school didn't handle the child well or give him the support he needed to succeed. I was very understanding at first. I grew up having a family member with severe disabilities and feel being exposed to that really encourages tolerance and empathy in children.

However, my child began to suffer. The boy would scream in her face regularly and hit her. I sat in on the class when she started to refuse to go having previously settled beautifully. She was a nervous wreck. Watching the interactions I couldn't blame her, it was a very stressful environment for a three year old. The school tried to solve it by asking the mum to drop him off late and pick him up early - I think they didn't want the other parents to see him while still not addressing the actual issues. I pulled her at that stage and she's so happy at the new school. There are still DC with SEN but the staff are fantastic and inclusive and all the children seem very happy.

I think, and I think this thread has shown it a bit too, that most parents don't care unless it impacts their own child negatively.

However they don't make any effort to encourage their child to be wider or more tolerant in their friendships. A child with SEN who is perhaps a bit slower with conversation, isn't good with sports, no special talent, maybe a bit 'young' for their age, can easily end up as friendless. Not through conscious exclusion but just because everyone overlooks them.

Disclaimer: Poor DD2 is unfortunately in a cohort with some very unpleasant mums.

DD2 has some SN - her speech is slightly affected, but mainly just issues affecting her work in class - bright kid but can't record it on paper basically. We have a vile little clique of mums who don't want their children mixing with "the special needs kid" and have tried for years to exclude with party invites, ignore party invites and tell their kids quite openly that "we don't like mini-Domina." The kids - don't give a shit - they will play with DD in school quite happily now parental influence is dwindling as they get older but they've made her life pretty shit for a good few years now. It's just a particularly nasty cohort in general.

We've also had complaining about how "it's not fair some kids get to use the computers lots"... DD2 was using an iPad that WE provided because she physically couldn't write! Everything that she has had in terms of aids to help her - we've provided so it's not as if school are funding it (oh I stand corrected they bought a set of cutlery... we'd offered to).

The parents in DD1s year who know DD2 very well absolutely adore her, as do the parents who've taken the time to get to know her as (and I know I'm biased) she really is the sweetest and most kind-natured little creature. Just a little dishevelled, badly coordinated and scatterbrained round the edges!

Personally I have a mahoosive soft spot for the kids in both my children's classes with some SN (there are a couple of absolutely gorgeous lads - I know their diagnosis because their mums have shared it with me - they're just lush and I love the grunted "aw-right" I get from them on a morning cos I'm known to them enough that I'm eligible for that now!) Also rather fond of the lad who I know does have a tendency to lash out at times - because I understand his frustration and he's got a cracking sense of humour and is a real charmer when he gets going (I haven't quite forgiven him for trying to guess my age and starting at 80 as a young point to work from though)!

Hahaha that’s so Xenia.

@NoGinNotComingIn

My child goes to nursery with a little girl who has Down syndrome, I don’t really think anything about her being in his class other than it’s good for her. I explained to my child in simple terms that she might find things more difficult than other children and to remind them to be extra kind to her. There’s no negative thoughts.

My friend has a DC with Downs.min nursery and KS1 it was all fine. As they became a little older her DC was popular but had no friends. Like a school pet. No play dates or party invitations to speak of.

When a move to special school was suggested and then forced upon them my friend was very upset but actually they made great friends in the new school.

It very much depends on the context. Very few parents are going to embrace a very disruptive child/ children in the classroom because no matter how well resourced (!) the school is it does impact negatively on the whole class. It doesn’t mean the child is disliked but I can see how it might seem so to the parents of that child. It’s a very difficult position to be in.

I certainly wasn't boasting. Working full time when you have a 2 week old baby and picking single sex primary selective private schools are just part of the discussion here - that all parents make individual choices in the best interests of their child as many have said above and I certainly have no problems with children with special needs being in a class with my children as long as of the same sex and having passed the academic selection test. I posted because no one had when I put mine up so I thought it would be helpful and supportive - that like most parents I have no problems with children with special needs in the class.

I used a term "high functioning" - I learn every day so do let me know what is now said - I meant someone who can pass an academic entrance test so is at the same kind of IQ standard as the rest of the class in selective state and private schools. High functioning it seems from above is not a term now used. Just tell me the current word and I am more than happy to use it.

Also fee paying primary schools are often used by parents who can afford fees for children with a wide range of issues.

What do I think?

I like my children to be surrounded with a mix of children, nationalities, special needs, backgrounds.

BUT if I feels it starts to impede their education or negatively impact their school experience in any way ie teacher having to focus on one child more than class due to special needs, language barrier, behaviour - then at that point, I want an alternative solution

I actually don't think you are going to get unbiaised information on here. Even though it's anonymous. The backlash posters would get to say 'I really dont want that child with SEN in mu dc's class' or 'they are just hard work' is just too big.

the reality though is that this is exactely what a lot of parents think (and say if they feel confident you are not going to look at them strangely if they do).

Yoiu just have to read threads on here with dcs who are getting physical etc.. because of their SEN to know that
1- parents dont like it
2- they would refer said child to be somewhere else
3- but they will never say that to someone's face. At some point though, it will show up by the way they are treating you child (been there... and my dc doesn't even fit the 'serious SEN' issue)

I think Xenia's point is that her children will never have to mix with ^those^ kind of SEN kids cos she went back to work when the kids were 2 weeks old.

@x2boys it's about the right setting able to meet children's needs. My DDs SEN secondary school could not cope with teens entering that had developed major anxiety issues from primary due to delays in diagnosis and MH support and are being restrictive about releasing her ehcp funding.

So short answer - I only notice children with SEN when they directly impact on my own DC.

^This. And once your dc are at secondary school, you won't necessarily even be aware of whether there are SEN kids in your child's different subject lessons unless your child happens to talk about it.

I've worked at SEN schools so I don't really notice them anymore. My dds old mainstream school had a fab approach to SEN pupils. They had facilities for a dozen of so children who wouldn't normally be offered mainstream schooling, then with 1:1s and their specialised facilities could mix the children with their NT peers and it was great. The kids learnt so much about socialising with people with SEN and became comfortable about it. The children changed from 'the kid who walks funny' to Amanda or Johnny or whoever.

I'm so grateful she had the opportunity to learn actual inclusion. The parents of those kids were no different to the parents of NT kids. We all picked up our kids from the same place and talked together. I really miss that school.

Yoiu just have to read threads on here with dcs who are getting physical etc.. because of their SEN to know that
1- parents dont like it

What parent could possibly "like" or even accept physical violence against their own child?

It simply is not acceptable for ANY child to be the victim of any violence - it's not about blaming the child or not but it's obvious parents will make a stand for violence and upset to stop. It's up to the school to put the correct measures in place.

SN is a huge range of things, isn't it? We have kids with all sorts of issues at our school, disabilities, LD, ADHD, behavioural issues, etc. I know them for the most part as individuals, and many of them we knew well before they were diagnosed with whatever the condition is that they are now known to have. Yes, some of these children are disruptive. But some non-SN children are disruptive. I do sometimes get pissed off that my children - who have their own needs - don't get the attention and support they need, but that's not a fault of other kids, it's the fault of a blunt school system and a shrinking budget/society. I don't blame children who need more support for those wider failings.

And for the most part, I like that my kids get to experience a wide range of other children, that was always what I preferred - to understand how different people can be, how to rub along with different people, be understanding, stand up for yourself, negotiate, listen, speak up, etc. I want my children to be well rounded and learn how to function in the world. Does that make sense?

Jesus some posters are actually jealous that children with SEN get a 1:1 🙄the reason will be is that it will be a recognised need from the child's EHCP which btw is a legal document ,it isn't a waste of schools resources ,it is provided so the child with SEN can reach their full potential as for why children who are very bright and bored going over the same work ,the reason they don't get 1:1 is because they don't need it!

Lol Xenia managed to squeeze in her 'returned to work 2 weeks after birth' story in yet another thread 🤣

Like many PP’s, I’ve only been aware that a child in my DC’s class had SEN if my children happened to mention it. DS mentioned a boy at his primary school who was included in games during break time but, in DS’s words “ wanders off and talks to himself a lot.” When we had him over to play and they were also in Cubs together, I realized he had some SEN (no idea of the diagnosis) but the other kids just accepted him as he was.

I think, and I think this thread has shown it a bit too, that most parents don't care unless it impacts their own child negatively.

what does it mean to affect their child negatively though? being hit is quite clear cut. But expecting their dcs to actually mix up and be kind to said child? Nope that doesnt happen either, even to the nice ones who don't have any 'behavioural' issues. It's all brushed under the carpet under the 'well they are not friends'.
I've seen it with a child with SEN in my onw dc class and with my dc too.

What they are talking about is that they are toerated because they don't cause problem. Not that they are accepted/not an issue/happy to be there.

I also think that a lot of the discourse about been happy for thier dcs to mix woth children with SN is a lot of posturing, the same way many people say they are not racist etc... whilst racism is endemic at all level in the uk.

It depends. A few years back, my son was getting battered daily by an autistic boy who used to smash things up in the classroom and hit the teachers. So I was glad when he went to a special school because the mainstream school couldn't deal with it at all. There are a few children with Down Symdrome in my daughter's class and it's not something I have thought much about. My DD has global development delay and needs a bit of extra help with things which is managed well by the school, so I think it depends on how complex the needs of the SEN child are.

I think I how I feel would depend on the child and the impact on my child.

My default would be I'd be genuinely pleased that the child is included. Any one of us could have a SEN child and I'm aware that if I did, then I would definitely want access for my child. I also see the value in including all who can engage with mainstream school for everyone's sake, the SEN child and all of the rest who would benefit from know about his condition and accepting diversity in practice rather than theory.

But it depends on the child. If I received regular feedback from my child that the child was very disruptive and class was stunted due to this, then I would probably feel that the situation needed improving; whatever that may include. For example better provision for the SEN child, better environment etc.

Tbh I've heard of more situations where parents are fighting for places in SEN schools than the other way round. That makes me cross as sending a child who can't cope with mainstream school is unfair on everyone involved, most importantly on the child themselves. Funding for SEN schools seems wildly inadequate and I feel for any parent struggling to get the right placement for their child, despite very obvious needs.