AIBU to give up a life's work to see my kids grow up

[doctormumoftwo]

I am thinking of leaving my job and I desperately need advice from other people who may have been in my position. I have two children who are 2 and 6. I work as a junior doctor/surgeon and am halfway through my training/exams. My DH is a full time a doctor. I love my job but it is very stressful. We could get by on DH salary alone but it would mean a big change in lifestyle (no holidays etc). I acknowledge I am very lucky to be in this position. I have been part time since I started but I am falling behind on my surgery and I have realised I can't continue part time as I need more surgical experience to gain competency. I also have final exams to take which means many hours of revision. I will be working flat out for the next 5 years minimum (nights, weekends, exams etc). Due to COVID our parents can not longer help regularly. It will be less stressful (but still demanding) as a consultant. DH cannot go part time to help. Despite the long hours we work, we can't afford private school, we live in a small flat with no garden. We will have to put the kids in school/nursery from 0745 - 6pm 5 days a week, or have a nanny for >50hrs for us to both work. My child's school is not great, there is not much community outside the school. My heart breaks for them, especially the 2 year old. I feel like I am sacrificing their childhood for my career. I have worked so hard to get where I am, invested money, time and incredible effort, but it feels like the demands of my job are just not compatible with being a decent mother. I don't know what to do. Our part time nanny recently quit handed in her notice. My child's reading is falling behind and they always ask me to play but I don't have the time to give them. I am thinking of giving up work and being a mum. I feel so guilty to continue leaving them for so many hours. I don't think a part time solution is going to work any longer because of the surgery, as I am falling behind and I spend many of my unpaid days off at work 'catching up'. I enjoy my job but I am incredibly stressed and sad about the toll it is taking on us all- that I know will not end for many more years. What should I do?

OP I follow a lady on Instagram called @thesurgeonmum. I’m not in medicine, I follow her because she posts really useful stuff about kid’s health - but she also posts about balancing family life with surgery. Maybe look at her page and get in touch with her?

Secnarf and Theld - great educational posts

I don't think you should quit your job. You must have worked so hard to get to this point. The needs of your children will change and some of the difficulties you're facing now will become less of an issue. I'd try and imagine your life in 1/5/7 years - what do you want it to look like in terms of children, home-life, career, finances etc. You may need to strike a balance in the near-term to help you achieve your longer term aims. I am not medically trained so I can't offer you advice but exploring alternative specialisms within medicine sounds like a possible. Also, I think you need to share the near-term sacrifices with your partner. I also work FT and have two children - there's been sacrifices in terms of career AND parenting but we have a good balance now and we can turn things up/down in the future as we require (e.g. more focus on our career) and we have the financial stability that provides more options in the future.

I would qualify, because you have worked so hard and may regret it later. Look into getting a new nice nanny to help with reading , make yourself play with them (I worked full time since ds was 5 months old , I KNOW it is hard) . Your kids need you, you make time, it is just as important as housework or making meals . Easier said than done. Honestly just find clever ways to make it work for you.

OP, I'm not in medicine but I have dipped out of a full on, demanding and fulfiling 20 year career a few years ago to be more at home. I spent the DC's early years working long hours and being very preoccupied with work even when I wasn't there! My DC are 10 and 14 now and things are still very full on with them and the general running a household- its not just childcare of course! My observations for what its worth - when I look back on their earlier years, i don't know how I did it! With hindsight I realise how stressed i was and I did miss out on a lot of priceless times with them and time for my own wellbeing. My marriage also suffered at that time due to how stressed i was. But I loved work and got loads out of it. From my own (and other friends I know) kids don't need you less as they get older, they just need you differently. I never understand the 'it will get easier' mantra as it certainly hasn't for us! The poster who said you can't have two people in 'big jobs' at once nailed it for me. So in our family now, I am the primary DC support, housekeeper, chef, PA, social secretary, odd job and gardening woman and general project manager for most things! I also work a bit part time in a role much more junior than I am cabable of and I do some managerial level voluntary work to still stretch my 'work' brain! Regrets? I do feel crap and bitter sometimes about my career and what 'might have been' if I had stayed. Dipping out is hard on the ego, especially when you see colleagues who were your juniors steaming ahead and when your job was part of your identity. There are also times I am SO glad i am around more for my DC now - things are still v demanding with them, especially the teenager. The whole teenage mental health thing is relevant and having accessible parents around to just chat etc after school when things aren't going smoothly. If I had taken the other path, I know I would have regretted it more than the wistful thoughts I have about my career. So, its ups and downs and a pig of a decision either way. Listen to your guts and heart to try and identify what is right for you. Best of luck .

My friend was a surgical consultant. Had 2 DC then retrained as a GP because it child friendly. Currently age 11 & 6. Picking up more shifts now at hospital as they're both at school. Worked only 2 days pre both starting school. It did take a while for her to requalify on the hours.
Her older DD has just started private school.
So the money does give options in the longer term.
No advice, just someone's solution to a difficult problem.
Good luck whatever you decide.

Great to see your update OP and I hope it works out well for you. Also, thank you and your husband for your fantastic work. Best of luck.

If my husband was a doctor, I'd have a little part time job in a shop or something

Couldn’t help commenting on this little gem. I suspect most doctors wouldn’t be interested in men or women like you...

@doctormumoftwo just read your update and glad you have a way forward. There is nothing to feel guilty about in having a career at all.

If my husband was a doctor, I'd have a little part time job in a shop or something

And what would you live on? I think you have been sadly misinformed about the salary of a junior doctor (or NHS consultant, for that matter - yes private work pays well, most of us do not do private work).

You are not going to pay the mortgage (or rent) on a two bedroom flat in London on £40k total household income. It’s a good wage, but it isn’t enough to support a wife and two children in the lap of luxury while your wife puts her feet up in a little hobby job. Maybe if you live in one of these mythical northern towns where a five bedroom house costs three and sixpence. Not in the south east.

@ChristmasCarcass

If my husband was a doctor, I'd have a little part time job in a shop or something

And what would you live on? I think you have been sadly misinformed about the salary of a junior doctor (or NHS consultant, for that matter - yes private work pays well, most of us do not do private work).

You are not going to pay the mortgage (or rent) on a two bedroom flat in London on £40k total household income. It’s a good wage, but it isn’t enough to support a wife and two children in the lap of luxury while your wife puts her feet up in a little hobby job. Maybe if you live in one of these mythical northern towns where a five bedroom house costs three and sixpence. Not in the south east.

Disgusting comment towards people from the North. I suggest you keep with the times people from London way are in their own world due to the size of London and maybe slightly sheltered giving them a dim opinion of the North. There’s rough parts every where and nicer parts.

Also I wouldn’t want to live towards London way due to the cost I personally worry for my child/children how they would manage to afford everything once they decided to leave home. I work with a girl who is from Oxford and now she lives in a very nice part of the North... how ignorant of you.

Disgusting comment towards people from the North.

@Holidaydreamin I think you may have misunderstood that

@Holidaydreamin

I don’t think that’s what that poster meant. Note the use of the word ‘mythical’.

ChristmasCarcass

‘If my husband was a doctor, I'd have a little part time job in a shop or something’

IME people who are well qualified and successful in their career tend to want to partner someone of similar ability and aspiration.

You are not going to pay the mortgage (or rent) on a two bedroom flat in London on £40k total household income. It’s a good wage, but it isn’t enough to support a wife and two children in the lap of luxury while your wife puts her feet up in a little hobby job. Maybe if you live in one of these mythical northern towns where a five bedroom house costs three and sixpence. Not in the south east.

Or even in most of the real, non-mythical major northern cities. Since the majority of them (not York I wouldn't think) have options available that would allow a family of one earner, one SAHP and two young DC to live a modestly comfortable life on 40k plus CB. Obviously nowhere near London, but it's actually a realistic enough aspiration in other regions of the country.

[quote positivelynegative]@Holidaydreamin I think you may have misunderstood that[/quote]
Maybe if you live in one of these mythical northern towns where a five bedroom house costs three and sixpence Oh yes sorry

@Teateaandmoretea

Disgusting comment towards people from the North.

Maybe if you live in one of these mythical northern towns where a five bedroom house costs three and sixpence I obviously missed the compliment (been from the North)

Holidaydreamin You’ve misunderstood me, I’m from Doncaster.

The “mythical Northern town” was a reference to Mumsnet posters who claim that where they live, not in London, you can buy a country estate easily on minimum wage. Like the Mumsnet chicken. I was pre-empting the people popping up to say they earn £18k and live like kings so of course anybody on £40k lives a life of unimaginable luxury.

And Openlygay I’m well aware you can live on £40k, even in London, because I’ve done it. The poster I was replying to said that if her husband earned as much as a doctor, she would put up her feet and get a little hobby job, as they would be wealthy enough for her not to have to work any more. I was pointing out that is not really the case, given junior doctors’ salaries.

@ChristmasCarcass

Holidaydreamin You’ve misunderstood me, I’m from Doncaster.

The “mythical Northern town” was a reference to Mumsnet posters who claim that where they live, not in London, you can buy a country estate easily on minimum wage. Like the Mumsnet chicken. I was pre-empting the people popping up to say they earn £18k and live like kings so of course anybody on £40k lives a life of unimaginable luxury.

And Openlygay I’m well aware you can live on £40k, even in London, because I’ve done it. The poster I was replying to said that if her husband earned as much as a doctor, she would put up her feet and get a little hobby job, as they would be wealthy enough for her not to have to work any more. I was pointing out that is not really the case, given junior doctors’ salaries.

I have not misunderstood anything. I know the point you was making and I thought you was quite rude.

There’s no point OP killing herself (I know it’s for a good cause) to say she’s a Dr but then she has missed out on the best years not seeing her kids it’s a really tough call.

I’d be tempted to get a lower paid job too... like the poster suggested. They could get some help.

Holidaydreamin Still no idea why you think that was a dig at people who live in the north of England.

And Openlygay I’m well aware you can live on £40k, even in London, because I’ve done it. The poster I was replying to said that if her husband earned as much as a doctor, she would put up her feet and get a little hobby job, as they would be wealthy enough for her not to have to work any more. I was pointing out that is not really the case, given junior doctors’ salaries.

My comment was about northern cities, not London. Most northern cities have areas where a junior doctor's salary plus the CB you'd be below the threshold for would fund a SAHP without difficulty.

Well every time I read a thread like this I have one thing to say to all the people suggesting to leave the job or to retrain as a gp - I hope you strongly encourage your daughters to choose a family friendly profession. It’s just such a waste to let them invest years of their life in education and career that they will ultimately throw away to pick up the kids at 3pm. It also does a lot of disservice to women who are serious about their career and who are discriminated against because their seniors assume they will leave the moment they have kids.

Lcats they can have a little part time mummy friendly job in a shop for pin money.

@Lcats Or perhaps we as a society need to make work more parent-friendly for all parents rather than leaving half the population (women) struggling to fulfil their ambitions.