AIBU to give up a life's work to see my kids grow up

[doctormumoftwo]

I am thinking of leaving my job and I desperately need advice from other people who may have been in my position. I have two children who are 2 and 6. I work as a junior doctor/surgeon and am halfway through my training/exams. My DH is a full time a doctor. I love my job but it is very stressful. We could get by on DH salary alone but it would mean a big change in lifestyle (no holidays etc). I acknowledge I am very lucky to be in this position. I have been part time since I started but I am falling behind on my surgery and I have realised I can't continue part time as I need more surgical experience to gain competency. I also have final exams to take which means many hours of revision. I will be working flat out for the next 5 years minimum (nights, weekends, exams etc). Due to COVID our parents can not longer help regularly. It will be less stressful (but still demanding) as a consultant. DH cannot go part time to help. Despite the long hours we work, we can't afford private school, we live in a small flat with no garden. We will have to put the kids in school/nursery from 0745 - 6pm 5 days a week, or have a nanny for >50hrs for us to both work. My child's school is not great, there is not much community outside the school. My heart breaks for them, especially the 2 year old. I feel like I am sacrificing their childhood for my career. I have worked so hard to get where I am, invested money, time and incredible effort, but it feels like the demands of my job are just not compatible with being a decent mother. I don't know what to do. Our part time nanny recently quit handed in her notice. My child's reading is falling behind and they always ask me to play but I don't have the time to give them. I am thinking of giving up work and being a mum. I feel so guilty to continue leaving them for so many hours. I don't think a part time solution is going to work any longer because of the surgery, as I am falling behind and I spend many of my unpaid days off at work 'catching up'. I enjoy my job but I am incredibly stressed and sad about the toll it is taking on us all- that I know will not end for many more years. What should I do?

I have been working full time in a frontline role since dc were young and it’s very tough.i also was a LP for most of it.
It’s very hard, like another OP said I was constantly rushing to feed them, dress them, get to work etc and the same at end of shift in reverse.But once I was home my job was done, I was able to focus on them fully, you cannot do that at present , therefore feel you are short changing them and yourself which is totally understandable.
im through the other side now with one left home and a teen and have time on my hands.I could restart now in my mid forties if I wished with study etc
If you are not forced to do it for money, don’t do it, to have that choice is a godsend.
I don’t even think for the children, just for yourself.cut yourself some slack.In 3 years or so they will both be at school and you can start studying again.Add in breakfast and after school club.
If you have to for the money then you are going to need a better support system,is there any grandparents or aunts/uncles that can help?
Every working parent has this battle, I think you have to have a hard talk with yourself and decide and commit, you are no good to your self or job and children if in a constant mind battle, you will burn yourself out.I’ve been there.
If I had had a choice I would have parked my career for less stress, that’s being honest and going against the grain of my beliefs that mothers /women/parents should be able to have it all.Home is important, children and you are important , if you give up and your 6 yr old still struggles in a year, you know you gave it your best shot.

* If I gave up we would move out of town (bigger home, garden, school) but it would mean a long commute for DH, (which he doesn't mind if I was at home to support him).*

Are you in London?
So many fantastic towns on outskirts that wouldn’t mean a long commute

I did it. Quality of life soared and 40 mins to London

I am writing this as a woman in her 60's who has retired.
I had no opportunity to take a part time role in my career when the Dc's came along and ended up trying to juggle full time work using a full time nanny (virtually no nurseries available in those days) financially it wasn't good so I became a full time Mum.
Economics forced me to return to work (2 grades lower than when I left) and initially it was terrifying but by the time I retired I was back at the grade I was when I first left.
However I have been left with a real sense of non achievement that I have never fulfilled my potential and it both troubles and upsets me.
I know it only says wife and mother on a tombstone, but think very very hard about your own sense of achievement.
Will you be happy to be home all day every day in your current home?
Being a full time Mum is not a bed of roses and it often makes your world very small.
As other PP's have said your children as they grow, grow less needy, and you could end up doing some mundane job when they are both at school purely for the money with no sense of self satisfaction or achievement.
You know your own feelings best don't make any life changing decisions because you currently feel backed into a practical and economic corner.
Good luck I really feel for you

Lots of sensible advice but echoing what @lolalovesmarmite says about ‘regrets of the dying’. You also need to be sure about your relationship and finances moving forward. Keep your hand in work but maybe compromise the ideal career.
I’m now in mid 50s , seen other colleagues hit marital issues/ have ill health / dealt with teenagers with issues ( it’s not just the little ones that take your time) . Thank goodness have accrued pension and can retirement plan. Don’t give medicine up but try to rethink how you can try and make it work better for you.

Don’t give up your career. I would suggest getting some serious career counseling from your deanery. There are other alternatives.

You're kids are only that age once, if you miss those times it's gone.

I'd enjoy being with them and building the memories.
I think I'd have regret if I chose career and missed kids growing up.

Honestly reading your reply, I think you’ll regret it. I note your husband is willing to offer support for anything that lets him continue as he is. That’s never a good foundation for moving forward.

Really recommend finding a good female mentor and consider taking the 3 month career break to think things through and get child care sorted again.

Good advice there.
I have to reiterate something though.
By pausing for say 3 years, you are not throwing it all away are you? The skills and level you have got to, you could re enter and go over what you have already achieved?
@HazelBite look what you did achieve though, you achieved what you set out to do, you bought the dc up and managed to get back into your workforce, don’t feel so bad on yourself, celebrate how well you did that .

I have a little boy and a stressful job but one I leave at work (very lucky). When deciding my hours going back to work my sister just said to me that she regretted the time she didn't spend with her son when he was little. I'm going back on three days a week and that will be all. I don't want my baby's first years to pass me by. I feel for you having to make such a decision

That's so tough when it's something that you've put so much effort in to.

The day my first was born, I knew they'd trump everything else in my life. They didn't ask to be born so it's just my personal opinion that they deserve to the best childhood I'm capable of providing. To me that means being around

Can you not locum for a while as CT and pick up only day shifts or weekends/when Dh Isn't working? That way you're keeping your foot in the door,still earning but on your terms?

Also agree that DH should consider impacting f his career for sake of family too

100% quit. I say this from experience. You’ll regret it otherwise and you won’t get your children’s childhoods back. It seems deep down you’ve already made the decision you just feel guilty enacting it. Just do it. Be brave you won’t regret it.

I have a very un-mumsnet opinion about this, but I think you should quit. For all of the equality, pension contributions and everything else, the reality I've found with two kids is that one parent needs to have the big job and the other parent needs to be available physically and emotionally for the kids. Unless you have a lot of help, two parents in big jobs is impossible. I'm also going to say something very unpopular and I do think it effects your kids not being there.

I've recently had a few life changing events in my life which is probably skewing my opinion. But I don't for one minute regret spending time with my kids over working more. I don't think I ever will.

Hi OP. Another here saying go for it - quit and give yourself a break. The pressure on you and your family will be massively relieved. Day-to-day that is not something to be sniffed at. Life is short and your kids will absolutely flourish having you there for them. Lots of professional parents where I am who have stepped out of the rat race and don’t look back! Family life is so precious!

@Fatted
About 50% of the replies are advising to give up

I quit my job, never looked back tbh.
Yes, money was tight, but I was around more for the kids and that was worth more than anything.

I've just sent my DD off to secondary, I've got a part time job I'll do until she leaves education, then I'll go back to full time work.

Here here oaktree55, it’s the acting upon that is the bravest part to do now.
I wish I had had the choice, I would have taken it like a shot, to be able to be at the school plays, to be the one to collect them from school, to collect them when nursery or school called me to say they were sick( instead of a grandparent)
I think children need good role models, I know my dc know how hard I work/worked when they were young, it’s good for them to see, but that’s once they get a bit more self sufficient like double figure age.when they were the ages of op’s children, mum being there was all that would of mattered.
Perhaps I’m biased too as I lost my mum when young and envied all the children going home or play dates with their children after school.

@AgentProvocateur

He is nearly finished so he can't go part time- although he's allowed, it would have a negative impact on his career prospects (there is still quite a lot of sexism about this in medicine).

So your husband CAN go part time. He’s just choosing not to as it will have a negative impact on his career prospects. Yet he’s presumably happy for you to give up your career completely? You’ve done the part time already to enable him to progress his career when the children were small. It’s his turn to make sacrifices for the next few years.

This!!

You are making all the compromises here. They are his children too, yet the burden seems to all be on you.

I think SAHMs are wonderful and it has been the best decision for some of my friends and also my DSis. I was so envious of them when our DCs were little. But it wasn’t for me, I had worked too hard already to give up my career.

So, if I were you, I wouldn’t quit after all the hard work you have put in. It’s a personal decision only you can make. But you sound like the kind of person who may be sad when your kids are older and you have little to contribute career wise and financially at home. Also, think about your sense of self/identity if it’s important to you to challenge yourself intellectually and be paid for your work. I like being paid, and I like my work status/identity.

I’m a city lawyer and worked full time from when DC were 1.3 and 4. My god, it was gruelling. I pushed on and 10 years later I have no regrets. Glad I invested in my own future. It’s so much easier when they get older and they are more independent!

When DCs were young we managed by having full time nanny as well as nursery so nanny could do child related housekeeping / shopping errands. Also had a cleaner and gardener. We didn’t earn a lot (no holidays /new clothes etc) but I saw it as an investment into our future - and mainly, I felt less guilty about the DCs (our nanny was exceptional).

Having the extra help at home means the time away from work with DCs is quality family time. My DCs now say they are proud of my career and they are inspired to work hard . They are also independent and resilient so I have no regrets that they missed out.

Also my DCs are themselves, driven to be the best they can be as people (not necessarily academically). They see how hard we work and that this pays off long term.

Is your DH sharing the mental load here? I don’t understand why you can go part time but it’s too harmful to his career. Is there sexism in your relationship as well as the surgical profession? What are you modelling to your DCs about this (not a problem if it doesn’t worry you though).

I’m sure your DH’s career /lifestyle would benefit from you not working.

Be very careful about relying on one/ his income.

When my DH was unable to work, my income was a great relief. It’s a risk to lose that. I have friends who have lost their DHs and it would be awful to have reduced earning capacity in that situation.

Think about how you will feel in 10/15 years if you stop now. It sounds like you are making this decision based on your immediate circumstances. And I so remember how that felt. I used to use the analogy of keeping my foot in the door - but it was jammed in there so tight that It was very painful grin].

Good luck, I’m sure ton and your DH will make the best decision for your family.

If I was being operated on I would rather not have a surgeon in your position. I have never considered or knew that surgeons had this predicament. I find it alarming.

I think you need to speak to your educational supervisor or training programme director about your feelings. Part time surgical training is hard but if you and your DH both went to 80% then you should get plenty of theatre time. It’s definitely possible for men to go LTFT.

Or I’d switch training programmes. GP is only 3 years and you might even get a bit knocked off as you’ve already done quite a bit of surgical training. I know it’s not the same but GPwSI in minor ops? Have a think and don’t do anything too quickly. Once you’re out of Medicine it’s Incredibly hard to get back in.

Of course if you don’t like the job thats different but it read as though it’s practical aspects making life difficult.

P.S. GP great for being able to live wherever you want in UK if you decide to move when your DH gets a consultants post.

Don’t quit. Get that FT nanny and switch your child’s school if it’s not great.

Anecdotal, but one of my closest friends was born when both his parents were in medical training. His mother quit to look after him while his father continued, and spent a life struggling with regret and resentment — and my friend felt horrifically guilty.

Tara, are you alarmed that a surgeon may be a human?