Find a man without children is the holy grail.

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One of my closest friends said to me this morning that finding a man without children in your 40s is like finding the holy grail of relationship goals.

I was telling her about little things that niggle me about DP (who is wonderful to be fair) and she said that I’m lucky I’ve found a man with no DC and that i need to make it work because I’ve found the holy grain

Is she right?

YANBU - finding a man with no DC is the holy grail.

YABU - who cares if he has children or not.

ALARMING? It’s alarming not to have children now? For heavens sake, how awful is that attitude towards the childless/child free?

Depends on the man. I'd rather have a decent man who happens to have children than a layabout cocklodger who doesn't. But my ideal would be the decent man who doesn't have children.

how awful is that attitude towards the childless/child free

No more awful than suggesting someone without kids is the "holy grail" perhaps? as if people with kids are defective/damaged in some way?

I really changed when I had children- it made me grow up. For this reason I’d avoid a man in his 40s without them. I’d suspect he was a bit immature and selfish. I don’t mean selfish for choosing not to have children ( I think that is in many ways a sensible choice) but simply because he’ll not have gone through the seismic shift in priorities that being a parent involves. It just wouldn’t attract me.

@updownroundandround

Personally, I think that for a man to have reached his 40's and never had any DC is a huge red flag.

I think it shows that he is either a man child or a user, and I'd not want either of that type of 'man' .

If he's never been ready to start a family with a partner ( in over 20 years !) by his 40's, then he never will be.

Jesus christ, what a load of shite. Having children is not compulsory, being child free is a perfectly valid life choice for many people, both men and women.

@HappenedXo

I really changed when I had children- it made me grow up. For this reason I’d avoid a man in his 40s without them. I’d suspect he was a bit immature and selfish. I don’t mean selfish for choosing not to have children ( I think that is in many ways a sensible choice) but simply because he’ll not have gone through the seismic shift in priorities that being a parent involves. It just wouldn’t attract me.

Posts like this really frustrate me.

It's great you grew up and changed your priorities when you had children, but you only have to read the hundreds of threads on here to realise that parenting doesn't automatically mature you.

Why does not having children make you immature and selfish? IMO making such a sweeping generalisation about non-parents is what's immature.

No more awful than suggesting someone without kids is the "holy grail" perhaps? as if people with kids are defective/damaged in some way?

Not really the same. The boring line about those without children obviously being immature etc is a perception and assumption about them as people; for those with children people aren't assuming anything about their character really, but making their decision based on the fact that they have children or not. Some have said they think it shows the person is x, y, z if they have children, but usually positives.

Dh had been a step dad for 6 years and his partner didn’t want more children for the time being. They split and we met. He never thought he would have biological children but we have two

No more awful than suggesting someone without kids is the "holy grail" perhaps? as if people with kids are defective/damaged in some way?

No, it just acknowledges that children change the dynamics, especially when those children aren't your own and you're also having to deal with someone's ex. That's hard work and certainly not something that should be taken up lightly.

I dated a man with children for four years and wouldn't do it again. It was hard work, and it's not easy always playing second best.

@ChaChaCha2012

A man without kids might be more convenient, but also he might have never grown up enough to be a father. Or he might want children but circumstances mean it's not happened, or he might be so caught up with work or hobbies that's he's not got time for children or a relationship.

You can't judge someone on such a narrow criteria, without understanding the reasons behind it.

Or maybe he is just childfree and doesn't like children? Are you saying that women who don't jave children is because they haven't grown up enough....The issue is that this woman does not want to date men with children as she is childfree also

No more awful than suggesting someone without kids is the "holy grail" perhaps? as if people with kids are defective/damaged in some way?

No one has suggested that. They have acknowledged that it’s hard to take on other people’s kids and always have a tie to their other biological parent. Nothing about being damaged or defective, just an easier option with a different dynamic. Not alarming, immature, not grown up or a huge red flag as is suggested of the childless/child free.

@HappenedXo

I really changed when I had children- it made me grow up. For this reason I’d avoid a man in his 40s without them. I’d suspect he was a bit immature and selfish. I don’t mean selfish for choosing not to have children ( I think that is in many ways a sensible choice) but simply because he’ll not have gone through the seismic shift in priorities that being a parent involves. It just wouldn’t attract me.

That does not always follow. There are some perfectly decent and 'normal' people who reach forty without children because things didn't work out in a relationship or relationships. One person I know very well is a musician who travels the world and this country (when there is no pandemic), whose absence from home caused difficulties. Ideally he will meet an independent woman who has a career and is not fussed about him travelling but he also wants to spend less time away in the future and has other strings to his bow. If you met him you would wonder why someone hasn't snapped him up because he is easy going and likeable - still good friends with two ex's. He hasn't had a lot of relationships and is quite moral. However work has been his life so far.

I've also met women who would have liked to settle down with someone and have children but it just didn't work out. Sometimes they chose the wrong man, or at least wrong for them.

There's no shame in being childless.

I was with one ex for a decade and he was early 40s when we split up...we’d never had children because I didn’t want them and he hadn’t pushed but he was a lovely man without issues and certainly someone’s holy grail..just not mine because we grew apart. He went on to have children with his new partner. I suspect he’s an amazing Dad.

More recent ex shied away from having kids because in his mind he is the ‘baby’ (he’s also in his forties) and definitely a man-child.

People are all so different and what you see at first glance isn’t always what you’ll get long-term. That’s the problem with having these criteria and approaching looking for a partner like you’re house-hunting.

Weeell, I've been there and have to say I strongly disagree.

I thought the OP was simply saying that her friend thinks it's much harder to meet men without children after a certain age if that's what you are looking for. Not suggesting that people with children are defective or damaged. But there have been plenty of suggestions that there must be something wrong with men who have not achieved fatherhood by a certain age.

finding a man who doesn't have children, doesn't want children (so is looking for a younger woman) and doesn't have a reason for not having them (too scared of commitment) seems to be virtually impossible.

One of those unicorn-like men is sitting on the floor beside me right now sharing a tuna sandwich after helping one of my DC with some science homework. He’d have had children of his own if things had panned out differently, he liked me enough to take on three rambunctious and sassy teenagers and was in full agreement when things got serious that a baby in the mix would be detrimental for them and for me, even though he would have been keen. He’s a fully functioning adult with no red flags.

To each his/her own. If you don't want to date someone with children you just have to realize that you're reducing the size of your dating 'pool' when you reach a certain age.

It was a rule of mine when I was in my 20s (& childfree). I just didn't want the hassle and the juggling that went on with someone with DC. It only took me a couple of times dating a single dad to show me it wasn't for me.

But now that mine are grown I can see where someone with grown children may 'ease' that restriction to include dating men with grown children, especially if one is NOT looking for marriage/living together but wants to have a partner who also wants to maintain their own home whilst sharing their lives. If I were to become single that's certainly the type of relationship I'd be looking for.

I don't have children, but somehow I manage to deal with all the childish bullying that the mother of my DH's children throws at me in quite a mature way. Who'd have thought it.

Or maybe he is just childfree and doesn't like children?

You don't even have to dislike children to want to be childfree.

I don't dislike children, I just don't want any of my own or to take on any form of responsibility for anyone else's.

@OhCaptain
It doesn't. It came out wrong-I meant to say no kids (for guys in their 40s) or, possibly, lack of LTR might suggest commitment issues. Not a given though.

There must be more to the conundrum but if anyone thinks I'm some sort of find, who am I to argue?

Haha. I wouldn't disagree either.

It's much better to find a man without children. It is less complicated and he can focus his attention on you rather than have his love and finances spread across multiple people.

Unfortunately the ex, the mother of the children, tends to be a major problem in dating a man with kids. They never seem to trust you and often actively dislike you.

I'm 30 and married but I don't want children. I've never, ever wanted them and that feeling just gets stronger with every passing year.

If DH and I broke up, I would not date a man with children. I don't want my own so I definitely don't want to be a part of raising someone else's. Their children should (of course) be their number one priority and I have no desire to fit my life around a ready-made family.

Gosh I must be so immature for never having had unprotected sex. What a silly little girl I must be to just have children that I don't want just because of societal pressure. I'll never be a proper up. 😢

To not have*

GROWN UP!* Fucking Hell. I can barely type never mind be a parent.